2022 national confirmed membership counts

[Eddie mush]

Yea Einstein wen u Live in a mob area u hear things
People love to gossip like little school girls
Everyone knows Some1 who knows Some1 who can’t wait to tell u there business . Hearing gossip and info dosnet make u a connected guy

I hear streeet info all the time dosnet make me connected
That’s how I know about the search warrants that were executed. I even know a couple of they guys who got there houses searched again doesn’t make me connected
But it does make me more insightful than u and wiseguy who live in the middle of Hicksville America and only repeat what you read online

U 2 both know shit about the Boston oc scene
End of Subject

"I know a guy who got his house searched so let me tell you the overall current state of the New England mob."

The point is you don’t know how fast info travels in this small little Italian community . When stuff happens you hear about it , when guys get straightened out you hear about it but you wouldn’t know cause your out there in Utah fucking yur cows or cousin not reaally sure wat u guys do out there . Hicks

Anyways I am done with this thread enjoy the plagiarized wiki info from wiseguy the cow fucker .

[Wiseguy]

I'm not taking sides here, I get the Pogo/Wiseguy argument about relying on law enforcement, primarily FBI reports, to get up-to-date information about the status of which ever crime family they may be investigating. I just wanted to point out the quote from Wiseguy. Just because he lives in Utah doesn't mean he knows anything about the Nortenos, or any other Latin gang that may be operating in that state. HOWEVER, if Wiseguy were a hispanic day-worker from a lower middle class neighborhood who made half his income with side hustles on the street, he might well have an idea about Nortenos or other Latin gangs in his area.
It may well be the same with a non-made lower-middle class Italian American who makes part of his income dealing drugs or hustling. With his ear to the street he may have a different outlook on Mafia culture in his neighborhood or city. I'm not saying that translates into membership numbers, just that one guy who actually lives there will look at it differently than another guy who is an outsider.

The Mexican day laborer or Italian street hustler may know or be able to comment on certain things of a micro nature, i.e. does a guy sell drugs, does another like to eat at this restaurant, who is another guy often seen with, and so on.

But we're talking about things of a more macro nature, i.e. the overall state of a crime family, how many members they have, general trends when looking at an extended timespan, etc.

These are things the micro-related knowledge has little to no bearing on. The day laborer may know or live near some of the gang members. He may have a general idea about who carries more weight than someone else among the people he knows. But that doesn't mean he can really tell you how the gang compares to itself years ago, give you an overall current hierarchy layout, how many members or affiliates they have, what are all the criminal activities the gang may be involved in, etc. That's the difference.

[Pogo The Clown]

The point is you don’t know how fast info travels in this small little Italian community . When stuff happens you hear about it , when guys get straightened out you hear about it but you wouldn’t know cause your out there in Utah fucking yur cows or cousin not reaally sure wat u guys do out there . Hicks

"Smalll little Italian community" = 800,000 Italian Americans spread out over the Boston metro area. Less than a 100 of them are involved with LCN. Yet this goof is hearing all this gossip about the inner workings of the family and all their goings on in Providence and Connecticut from his pizza shop.


In fact he is hearing so much inside info about them that half his posts when he first got on here was asking anonymous posters to supply him with charts of the Pattiarca family.


Pogo

[Eddie mush]

See u just proved how little u know and how fucking stupid you are Pogo. There is not 800k in the community I speak of . Walking around with a vowel at the end of yur name Dosent make u part of the community . Being from the neighborhood, understanding Italian culture and life makes you part of the community I am speaking of . I am not talking about joe jerkoff who grew up 30 mins from the city had a vowel at the end of his name but can’t tell you the first thing about being Italians . No idea where his family if from or any of the true stuff that makes u Italian
The beliefs , the values , the culture

U wudnt know cause yur a hick from twatsville
I never claimed to know shit about providence or Ct
I know a little bit about Boston but A lot more than U and yur other fuck face friend wiseguy

Yur forum sucks cause u belittle all the good posters who may know more than u . Yur a cunt and yur mother was probably a whore .u can Go fuck yurself and this worthless forum

[scott22]

Detroit mob:
Top guys w/buttons
(not in any particular order)
1Jackie Giacalone ("The Kid") BOSS
2Joey Giacalone
3Jackie Giacalone ("The Nose") FLA
4Vinnie Giacalone
5Tony LaPiana UB
6Peter Tocco CONSIG
7Gene Barrata
8Joe D'Anna
9Mimmo D'Anna
10Davey Aceto
11Butch Stramaglia
12/13 Rugiero bros. (Patrick & Anthony)

SMB

[HairyKnuckles]

Yea Einstein wen u Live in a mob area u hear things
People love to gossip like little school girls
Everyone knows Some1 who knows Some1 who can’t wait to tell u there business . Hearing gossip and info dosnet make u a connected guy

I hear streeet info all the time dosnet make me connected
That’s how I know about the search warrants that were executed. I even know a couple of they guys who got there houses searched again doesn’t make me connected
But it does make me more insightful than u and wiseguy who live in the middle of Hicksville America and only repeat what you read online

U 2 both know shit about the Boston oc scene
End of Subject

"I know a guy who got his house searched so let me tell you the overall current state of the New England mob."

The point is you don’t know how fast info travels in this small little Italian community . When stuff happens you hear about it , when guys get straightened out you hear about it but you wouldn’t know cause your out there in Utah fucking yur cows or cousin not reaally sure wat u guys do out there . Hicks

Anyways I am done with this thread enjoy the plagiarized wiki info from wiseguy the cow fucker .

Eddie, I´m giving you an official warning for insulting two fellow members of this forum. You should know the rules by now. Take shit to the Graveyard section and keep it there! Another warning and you will be shelved. HK

[Wiseguy]

See u just proved how little u know and how fucking stupid you are Pogo. There is not 800k in the community I speak of . Walking around with a vowel at the end of yur name Dosent make u part of the community . Being from the neighborhood, understanding Italian culture and life makes you part of the community I am speaking of . I am not talking about joe jerkoff who grew up 30 mins from the city had a vowel at the end of his name but can’t tell you the first thing about being Italians . No idea where his family if from or any of the true stuff that makes u Italian
The beliefs , the values , the culture

U wudnt know cause yur a hick from twatsville
I never claimed to know shit about providence or Ct
I know a little bit about Boston but A lot more than U and yur other fuck face friend wiseguy

Yur forum sucks cause u belittle all the good posters who may know more than u . Yur a cunt and yur mother was probably a whore .u can Go fuck yurself and this worthless forum

LOL! This is Dan-level rage/rant.

[thesociety 89]

Eddie Mush hahaha, legend

[Lomartella13]

Both Pogo and Wiseguy are phenomenal contributors to this community, and they always do great research before posting. I thoroughly enjoy reading both your work. However, both of you are beginning to act like jerks. Just because you are some of the best contributors here doesn’t mean that you know everything. Is LCN as a whole currently weaker? Yes. Is the New England family shrinking in membership compared to years past? Yes. But do the two of you know everything there is to know about the Present day New England family? Not at all.

I’ll never take someone’s word as concrete truth just because they live there, but if they are Italian and have dabbled in crime in their past within that city then they might know something you don’t. For example, I am born and raised in Rochester and I know a made member from the past who you did not mark on that list in this thread. So maybe you don’t know everything, okay?

[Ozgoz]

Both Pogo and Wiseguy are phenomenal contributors to this community, and they always do great research before posting. I thoroughly enjoy reading both your work. However, both of you are beginning to act like jerks. Just because you are some of the best contributors here doesn’t mean that you know everything. Is LCN as a whole currently weaker? Yes. Is the New England family shrinking in membership compared to years past? Yes. But do the two of you know everything there is to know about the Present day New England family? Not at all.

I’ll never take someone’s word as concrete truth just because they live there, but if they are Italian and have dabbled in crime in their past within that city then they might know something you don’t. For example, I am born and raised in Rochester and I know a made member from the past who you did not mark on that list in this thread. So maybe you don’t know everything, okay?

I think you’re missing the point.

Anyone could write what you just wrote. Unless you have some proof or validity to what you just said, it means nothing and you can’t expect to be taken seriously.

There is no way around this.

[stubbs]

Anyone disagreeing with Wiseguy and Pogo probably don't know the meaning of the word "confirmed".

[Wiseguy]

Both Pogo and Wiseguy are phenomenal contributors to this community, and they always do great research before posting. I thoroughly enjoy reading both your work. However, both of you are beginning to act like jerks. Just because you are some of the best contributors here doesn’t mean that you know everything. Is LCN as a whole currently weaker? Yes. Is the New England family shrinking in membership compared to years past? Yes. But do the two of you know everything there is to know about the Present day New England family? Not at all.

I’ll never take someone’s word as concrete truth just because they live there, but if they are Italian and have dabbled in crime in their past within that city then they might know something you don’t. For example, I am born and raised in Rochester and I know a made member from the past who you did not mark on that list in this thread. So maybe you don’t know everything, okay?

I think you’re missing the point.

Anyone could write what you just wrote. Unless you have some proof or validity to what you just said, it means nothing and you can’t expect to be taken seriously.

There is no way around this.

And even if the person is telling the truth about knowing a made guy in (pick a city), how does that translate to them having any special knowledge of the organization overall?

That's a rhetorical question, by the way. One I've mentioned about a million friggin' times.

[JoeCamel]

All due respect, but I live here.

So what? How does living in a given area give you special insight to the inner workings of a secret criminal organization you're not a part of?

Like I’m starting to form the opinion you live in Utah or Montana or something and in terms of actually living in proximity to the real people in the towns you just read about it, there’s absolutely no way you can relate.

Ah, the geography card. Like old times. I do live in Utah. But when it comes to this issue - the current state of the New England LCN - I could live in Egypt and it wouldn't make any difference. More sources are available to anyone, wherever they may be, than by benefit of simply living in an area. I don't need to live in Providence or Boston to see the decline in membership, indictments, etc.

I’m not talking shit, I’m just saying these guys are real people which in many cases I know victims, family members, the cops who really chase them. My Lawyer even has represented some of them. I’ve literally met known members and associates that have been listed on here: it maybe a concept for you, but for some of us it really is reality.

Richard Gambale maintains a residence in York Maine when not in Florida. You can go on a people finder website and see for yourself.

Billy Angelesco lives in Saco, check out the news stories on the last arrest

There’s another dude in Portland that has never popped up on these lists but the street carries as a made guy (apparently) I’m just not going there. If you look hard enough in the last 20 years of justice department press releases and pore
Over lists of known associates I know you can figure it out.

Notwithstanding that’s two. I have successfully defended myself. I win.

If that's the case, what that tells me is these guys are basically inactive. It's not a case of individual members, or the family in general, setting up an outpost in Maine.

Both of you are more then welcome to fly into Logan Airport and check out the scene.

I could move there for the rest of my life and it wouldn't give me any greater insight.

Like literally both of you guys are geniuses and legit factotums/encyclopedias on LCN. I will never take that away from and I can’t, but I’ve noticed every time you guys are threatened with the unknown or the undeniable realization that maybe just maybe guys like Cavita, Bobby Batts, Scott, myself might actually have a greater grasp on LCN in the present in our own home metro areas then you do wherever you live and in whatever subculture of society you inhabit. I have never seen any personal admissions from you guys, and the sheer negativity on top of the defensive tone you take with
Anyone who brings it up, I am now convinced you are both not only so far removed from reality, which is ironic because you accuse all of us of being delusional, despite some of us literally living in the same neighborhoods as these guys and you living literally in Idaho or Utah and once again I will be the first to say, you both are basically scholars and historians on this stuff, but it’s
Time
To
Stop picking everyone else’s opinions or personal life experiences apart, and time to start getting out

To these LCN stronghold cities and sell some
Heroin or do some bookmaking and Loansharking and running underground poker games and buy a garbage truck or run a little extortion so some of these guys you make charts of actually show up and you actually experience something you are so obsessed with to the point you demean guys who follow this stuff as a hobbie for having a different opinion then you

BobbyBatts? The guy who says there are still 15 (or so) members in Kansas City (when there were only 20 members 30 years ago)? He lives in the area, and I find it believable he may know some people, but I've never seen how that equates to him having an inside breakdown of who's burned a saint. But that's me.

Scott? Do we really need to go there?

I'm not trying to be negative or pick on anyone but this issue - people making exaggerated claims about a family and having nothing to support it but their address and anecdotes - is as old as the hills.

Like Pogo you are a real smart guy, but NYempire is right. You are avoiding the fact that a lot of us have committed crime our whole lives and have special insight into our regional underworld. Some of us might have gone to school with made guys or kids of made guys. Some of us literally wave to made guys on our way to the mailbox. This isn’t just a concept far removed from Nebraska. It is our real lives and real friends and Neighbors

NewYorkEmpire? They guy who insists there is still a functioning family with 30+ members in Buffalo? I'm not sure he's been right about anything since he started posting on this forum.

Just to be a smart ass I hit up one of those background check websites and found out some interesting figures relating to this section of the conversation.

6 confirmed living and made Patriarca members either currently live in Maine or have had a current part time residence in southern Maine in the last 2 years.

2 confirmed and living members live in New Hampshire, including one who lives 15 minutes from me incidentally and interestingly enough, Carmen Tortora, lives in Whitefield NH, which is 10 minutes from Vermont, an hour from the Canadian border, and just under 3 hours from Montreal……(he could be the super secret New England Liaison to the Rizzutos/Controni/Bonnanos in Canada……not to mention……wait for it…….the main Patriarca ambassador to the Arm in Buffalo.

Just wait. After the flood of fawning PMs I received for going head to head with you I’ve developed a following and this info getting dropped is sure to lead to a 100 page thread at Gangster BB.

Honestly Wiseguy Most guys on the board have a huge amount of respect for you and all myself and a few others were trying to accomplish with you and pogo was simply attempting to get our points across that as individuals that are often directly connected and if not maybe 1 or 2 degrees removed from members of our real life Broader communities and local underworlds that you believe you know better then us, a large percentage of the community at the blackhand club is afraid to even offer an opinion or engage in healthy debate. Also, I am of the inclination that as someone on the outside looking in when it comes to the so called underworld or criminal lifestyle, it is almost impossible for you to recognize the banality that the average career criminal IE member/associate of LCN or similar organization views/experiences their life with. The difference between you and many of us is that you cannot grasp the subjects of discussion past a one dimensional paradigm. Your empathetic point of reference is a gangland news article or Goodfellas or Underboss (Maas not Lehr). It is at best a fantasy to you, leading you to perceive that it couldn’t be reality for any of the rest of us, including the gangsters that you study.

Most of us just want you to treat us like people. Not driveling retards from faraway cities the mafia hasn’t existed in since the early 90s who’s opinions and experiences are beneath your validation.

This isn’t about the status of the New England Mob. It’s about your treatment of other board participants, including many who not only like and respect you and value your knowledge, but maybe even look up to you and the unwavering qualities of leadership you show.

Can’t we all just get along?

[johnny_scootch]

That is a lucid, well thought out and intelligent post. I’m sure while sitting on his mafia throne high up in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada mountains wiseguy will yell OVERRULED!


Was in the bagel store earlier Nicky dragonetti (Gambino) is a few people ahead of me and Sal Canistraci (Colombo) is right behind me. I bullshit with Sal a little he’s a good guy but not Nicky he’s a jerkoff!

[Pogo The Clown]

That is a lucid, well thought out and intelligent post. I’m sure while sitting on his mafia throne high up in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada mountains wiseguy will yell OVERRULED!

What is a yute?


Pogo