Double Affiliation

[CabriniGreen]

@ Frank

I've read it SOMEWHERE before, embarrassed to say I cant remember, but I have seen him on a couple charts, like th his one here...


http://mafiamembershipcharts.blogspot.c ... 6.html?m=1

[Frank]

@ Frank

I've read it SOMEWHERE before, embarrassed to say I cant remember, but I have seen him on a couple charts, like th his one here...


http://mafiamembershipcharts.blogspot.c ... 6.html?m=1

Thanks that's interesting. I haven't read much or know to much about him. Reading this thread got me interested in him. Read a little about him yesterday. Thought he was older than he is and figured he was dead. One of the things I read was, if this is the same guy, is that he was last a member of a Sicilian Family. He became an informant and is currently in hiding. Also seen something about him asking Toto if he could be made in a US Family and Toto said no. I assume that was in the 80s or early 90s. Maybe he wanted a transfer. I would assume he was already made in Sicily. Wasn't he Toto's rep in US?

[Frank]

Also I'm not sure what his job was. For example boss of the Zips?? I assume not the Zips made in US Families??. What about Zips that weren't made , but on record associates with US Families??

[CabriniGreen]

Actually, you are right, I think his membership came like, 90s or early 2000s, with the Luke's I mean...

[Frank]

Actually, you are right, I think his membership came like, 90s or early 2000s, with the Luke's I mean...

I think it's safe to say that if he did become a member of the Lucchese, it had to have happened after Rhina and his top leadership was taken off the streets.

[Frank]

Also I think you have to look at the drug business as a joint venture between different LCN Families in different countries. Kind of like the joint venture Casinos the American LCN had.Its a little different because the Casinos were places of business.

[Frank]

@Confederate

You happen to know the authors name? I've read a few books on this, but if there's info I haven't seen, I'd be glad to read it......

I do struggle organizing my thoughts, specifically on this topic, it's quite complex if you ask me, but I do think I explain myself, I just dont think you guys get what I'm saying...

John Dicke and Anna Sergi have kinda hinted at what I cant fully explain....

@ Confederate

You have to admit, the statement" they didnt have to be made into the Bonanno family to influence how the drug trade works".... actually let's stay here, it's a good starting point...




That statement there, echoes my ENTIRE POINT.
That a big part of my argument about the Rizzutos. That they were initially primarily, narcotics merchants. They diversified into other things eventually just like prohibition gangs, but the control of drugs, wasnt in the hands of American lcn, ACCESS TO NY MARKETS, WAS in American LCN hands.

But, with the exception of the Bonnanos, the American guys were shut out of the market by the Commision.

Let's look at Paul Semplice as as n example.

1. Made Gambino guy

2. Goes to Canada, Toronto meets with a crime family from Italy...

3. Question, Is this crime family an independent entity?
They apparently originate from Italy, so unless the Gambinos are going over there and making Italians, I assume they are independent...

4. Semplice is introducing these guys to other members, as " Gambino guys".... Like the formal introduction.... So what does that mean?

Is there a Gambino Toronto crew we know NOTHING ABOUT? I've NEVER seen a " Toronto" crew on a Gambino chart.

Sergi said that Calabrian mobsters were essentially using American lcn associates, like they were already some kind of integrated faction in NY.

I mean, did the Gambinos MAKE a bunch of Calabrians? OR, is there some sort of protocol in place that enables Calabrian gangsters to do business, with Gambino cache as if they are made members, even though technically they arnt.

okay, I'll stop there, Everyone, Wiseguy, Confederate Hairy, I would ACTUALLY LIKE to hear you guys opinions... What do you think the deal is here?

I think we need to read the two books Confederate mentioned. I think it's clear though that John Gambino answered to the Gambino Family. He ended up a made member and actually a acting boss of the Gambino's as a member of a ruling panel. I don't believe he had to answer to Naimo or Sicily back in the day. Unless I'm reading this wrong. I've always been of the opinion that Carlo Gambino brought the brothers over for business reasons. Maybe I'm wrong and they were sent over by Sicilian leadership. With them being related to Carlo maybe we ignore the loyalty to the Sicilians. Maybe once they were on record with the Gambino Family, they didn't have to answer to a guy like Naimo or the Sicilian lcn, except for Rosario Gambino. They were now American LCN property and a relation to Carlo.

[B.]

Felice, who is an expert in the Sicilian Mafia, has said that Naimo was a member of the Sicilian Mafia operating in the orbit of the Lucchese family, but not a Lucchese member. We have often seen this, with Giuseppe Ganci being a member of the San Giuseppe Iato family but operating under the Bonannos, the Casamento brothers being Sicilian members operating under the Gambinos, Rosario Gambino, etc. Not sure what made Naimo so influential in the US, only that he had a direct line to Riina. Felice has mentioned the Luccheses having something more of a zip connection than the few usual names we know of (Leo Giammona, Vincenzo Napoli, and Paolo LaDuca all being referred to as zips who were inducted into the Lucchese family), but I'm not sure about made members outside of those few. In one of his big threads he mentioned a Salvatore Cannavo as a Bronx Lucchese captain circa 1986 who was trafficking heroin in connection with the Sicilian Mafia. Never heard that name and not sure he was actually a captain but it would be interesting to know more.

Napoli was a former Gambino associate who seems to have unofficially left the Gambinos and was made by the Luccheses, which was some cause for dispute, and his well-known brother Gaetano would end up made with the Gambinos. Not sure if the third brother Antonino was made in Sicily or with the Gambino family. Can't remember if JD or Felice mentioned how Vincenzo was recruited into the Lucchese family or who his connections were in that family. The Napolis are from Villabate which would historically put them with the Profaci/Colombos but that family had virtually no Sicilian connections post-1960s.

How Giammona was recruited by the Luccheses is another question that I don't think has been answered on here though no doubt Naimo or another source would know if asked. Giammona is believed to have been a relative of Carlo Gambino given his relation to Giammonas in Sicily, though I don't know if that has been 100% confirmed. If they were related, it is strange he wouldn't have ended up in the Gambino family especially given that Carlo and especially his brother Paolo had strong ties to Sicily and were said to have encouraged if not recruited some of the Gambino zips themselves.

[CabriniGreen]

B.

All those guys you mentioned, what was their core business?

[Confederate]

B.

All those guys you mentioned, what was their core business?

My understanding from those books was that any Zips PURPOSELY sent over here to America from one of the Sicilian Mafia Clans was done for the core business of Heroin. They weren't sent to take bets on football games. lol
They were very focused and disciplined.

[CabriniGreen]

B.

Antonio Nspoli was close to Inzerillos underboss right?

[CabriniGreen]

supposed to be Napoli, goddamn phone....

[JeremyTheJew]

If i remmember correctly in Claire Sterling book Octopus: The Global reach of the Sicilian Mafia and Heroin; one of the Napoli brothers were who the undercover agent from Philly was introduced to and it was known they were representing John Gambino. But i believe it was a Enzo Napoli.

Cabrini, youll deff like that book. Goes into detail about Sicilian mafia wars as well as the Gambino.brothers and then Pizza connection.

[CabriniGreen]

@Jeremy

I went ahead and ordered that one too...

[JeremyTheJew]

@Jeremy

I went ahead and ordered that one too...

Your gonna like that book a lot. Very informative too. Its all about sicilian mafia heroin fams and the 2 wars. And covers the american side so its very good. I wish i still had my copy.

I wonder if Naimo is discussed. Can u look around a little for info on him?

The author wrote another book I cant remmember the title but its interesting bc its about the Pax Mafioso pact between Russian, LCN and Yakuza. But then she gets into the whole Red Attack theory. A lot about Ivankov i think as well.... Ivankov was assasinated not that long ago. As well as the author of that other book about the red invasion was assasinated too.