Arrests in NY, induction ceremony taped

[Lupara]

In the 1990s Paul Ragusa was on record with Baldo Amato who we know had ties with the Canadian membership.

I have a Thomas Zummo in my Bonanno madeguys list

He was an associate of the Bonannos.

Awhile back I planned to make a topic about Bonanno ceremonies but held off and then forgot about it. This indictment brings the subject back up and is directly related to something that stood out when going back over files on NY inductions post-1976.

None of the Bonanno CWs were made using the blood/saint method. Not one. From Massino in 6/77 to Cicale in 8/03, every made member who flipped had without exception been brought in using the verbal oath and tie-in method described in the DeCav info thread. Some were given the same vague 'way things are' (LE) kind of explanation for it. One of them was told to just imagine a gun and knife were on the table. Now ten years after the mass defections we get evidence of a more recent induction also being carried out that way.

The Bonannos seem to be the only ones in New York who were consistently using an unorthodox ceremony. Very few cases in the other Families (none in Gambino/Colombo so far).

That is peculiar since the Bonannos were for a long time considered the most traditional and Sicilian of the Five Families. It seems like this changed then after Bonanno retired. Any idea why they forfitted such an integral part of the ceremony?

[Lupara]

In the 1990s Paul Ragusa was on record with Baldo Amato who we know had ties with the Canadian membership.

I have a Thomas Zummo in my Bonanno madeguys list

He was an associate of the Bonannos.

Awhile back I planned to make a topic about Bonanno ceremonies but held off and then forgot about it. This indictment brings the subject back up and is directly related to something that stood out when going back over files on NY inductions post-1976.

None of the Bonanno CWs were made using the blood/saint method. Not one. From Massino in 6/77 to Cicale in 8/03, every made member who flipped had without exception been brought in using the verbal oath and tie-in method described in the DeCav info thread. Some were given the same vague 'way things are' (LE) kind of explanation for it. One of them was told to just imagine a gun and knife were on the table. Now ten years after the mass defections we get evidence of a more recent induction also being carried out that way.

The Bonannos seem to be the only ones in New York who were consistently using an unorthodox ceremony. Very few cases in the other Families (none in Gambino/Colombo so far).

That is peculiar since the Bonannos were for a long time considered the most traditional and Sicilian of the Five Families. It seems like this changed then after Bonanno retired. Any idea why they forfitted such an integral part of the ceremony?

[Lupara]

Do you guys think it's possible that the Buffalo family moved its operations across the border and its leaders are now based in Southern Ontario?

I don't think they moved their operations since Buffalo was always active in Hamilton. I think what we are seeing here is that the Hamilton Crew (or the remnants of the Hamilton Crew) still operating even though the family in Buffalo is gone.


Pogo

I know that. What I meant to say is that they may have swifted their powerbase to Southern Ontario. But this would not differ much from remnants of the Hamilton crew operating on their own.

What is interesting is that it seems that perhaps the Luppino family were also members of Buffalo just like Papalia.

[Hailbritain]

Just goes to show that nobody knows nothin about the modern American mob really , 80 % is just speculation and fresh street talk

[Fughedaboutit]

Jesus Christ with Pogo and Wiseguy quick to shoot down any discussion just because the FBI says so

This is interesting, new intel

Let the class discuss it without the hall monitor ruining all the fun

[johnny_scootch]

This does pose the question as to why he was made by a NY Capo (and an acting at that) (Zummo is from Roslyn Heights Brooklyn).

Roslyn Heights is on Long Island.

[SonnyBlackstein]

This does pose the question as to why he was made by a NY Capo (and an acting at that) (Zummo is from Roslyn Heights Brooklyn).

Roslyn Heights is on Long Island.

Cheers.
DA from Brooklyn is making the case so just assumed.

[Wiseguy]

Jesus Christ with Pogo and Wiseguy quick to shoot down any discussion just because the FBI says so

This is interesting, new intel

Let the class discuss it without the hall monitor ruining all the fun

Pointless discussions based on theories and fantasies, when we already know the answers, are what Gangstersbb is for.

[Fughedaboutit]

Jesus Christ with Pogo and Wiseguy quick to shoot down any discussion just because the FBI says so

This is interesting, new intel

Let the class discuss it without the hall monitor ruining all the fun

Pointless discussions based on theories and fantasies, when we already know the answers, are what Gangstersbb is for.

Yeah lets talk about the same old shit because it doesn't jive with an official report when there is new information. You are so boring it is ridiculous.

[johnny_scootch]

Here is a link that has a redacted transcript of the making ceremony:
http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/con ... -by-police

Based on the names of those atrested, I assume the Buffalo members are the Violi brothers. Following the murder of their father the family moved to Hamilton. It is likely that Giancomo or Jimmy Luppino would have arranged to have the two made into the Buffalo family quite early on for status, and more importantly protection (as the men that killed their father were Bonanno).

I really hope we get some idea about when they were made and whom by.

Great article and I agree with everything you said. I wonder what role if any the Violi brothers and/or the Buffalo family itself played in the Montreal war. It seems like there might be a lot more going on with them (Buffalo/Violi/Luppinos) then people realize. Will be interesting to see how this all unfolds.

[Sol]

Jesus Christ with Pogo and Wiseguy quick to shoot down any discussion just because the FBI says so

This is interesting, new intel

Let the class discuss it without the hall monitor ruining all the fun

Pointless discussions based on theories and fantasies, when we already know the answers, are what Gangstersbb is for.

Yeah lets talk about the same old shit because it doesn't jive with an official report when there is new information. You are so boring it is ridiculous.

Dont derail a good thread. Stay on topic.......Soliai

[Wiseguy]

Yeah lets talk about the same old shit because it doesn't jive with an official report when there is new information. You are so boring it is ridiculous.

What "new information" is there that changes anything or warrants a serious discussion about whether there is still a family in Buffalo? You know what's "boring?" Posters who ignore 15-20 years of evidence (or lack thereof) and then jump to conclusions because of a single bust. Wishful thinking anyone? Hey, if you want to ignore the feds and believe there's still a family in Buffalo, go ahead. Just don't expect anyone who's informed to take you seriously.

Funny how you talk down on GBB when you were banned, but posted every day when you werent. As sad as your FBI obsession really. A probation officer for 15 year olds is a far cry from the feds, you would never make the cut.

Not that it is a good site, but you were all over that site, so stop acting like you are all mighty. lmao

I "talked down" on GBB long before I was banned. I've always said that forum is long on quantity and short on quality. And I'm not sure what me being a JPO in the past (not anymore) has to do with anything. It's not about having an "obsession" with the feds. It's having been on these forums over a decade now and seeing time and time again how the feds are far and away the best and most consistent source of info on the LCN that we have. Far, far better than a bunch of jerkoffs on the internet trying to read the tea leaves.

[CabriniGreen]

Interesting stuff, let me throw some potatoes in the pot.......


1. Someone said the Bonnanos were known as the most Sicilian family. I would say yes, WHEN BONNANO, GALANTE, GARAFOLO, BONAVENTRE, when these guys were still powers in the family. After they retired or went to Arizona or back to Italy, what Bonnano members, born in America, had the extensive ties to Sicily? More to the point, DIRECT TIES TO SICILY.......

2. @ lupara

When you say the Bonnanos summoned Rizzuto for the three capo hits, why don't you consider the narco-politics that were in play?

The fact that the three capos were at the Bono wedding, they were the trusted American distributors for the Sicilian heroin. Then they went and tried to screw em. So the Sicilians had a vested interest in those hits, I mean they took out Vioil, they didn't do THAT just to turn around and have the SAME situation with Indelicato.

The question has always been, If the Bonnanos control Montreal through the Cotronis, and the Rizzutos control the heroin, DO THE COTRONIS CONTROL THE RIZZUTOS, AND BY EXTENSTION THE HEROIN, AND BY EXTENTION, DID THE BONNANOS CONTROL THE HEROIN. I contend that the Bonnanos came into play when the dope crosses the Atlantic, and it's time to move it into NYC. They were the trusted distributors. I've read that Sciascia didn't even require down payments from a lot of the distributors, it was always, " Just move the shit...pay me later I got more coming.."

Now, why do I think this??

Take a good look at the thread Felice started about the Gambinos.


Notice the documents said the Sicilian mafia requested that their heroin business be enlarged. Not the Bonnano family, the Sicilian mafia.

Cheech Gambino, the Cherry Hill guys, even Felice says that Mannino and his partner were very independent. Scarfo couldn't deal with Rosario Gambino how he wanted to initially because he was Sicilian mafia. I compared the Gambino-Spatola-Inzerillo-Mannino-DiMaggio clan to the Rizzuto-Manno-Renda-Sciascia clan before, to me they are very similar. Technically under the LCN umbrella, but EXTREMELY INDEPENDENT, based on moving a commodity, not territorial control.


It's pretty clear the SICILIANS ran the heroin trade, and on the supply end you had basically Gambino clan members, and the Caruana- Cuntrera clan running two parallel networks. The Gambino one was for Sicilian mafia members specifically. The Bonnano one was supplied by the Caruanas, headed by Catalano, and he was in charge of " The U.S. end of the pizza connection"' which actually means American mafia members allowed to deal heroin, basically Bonnano guys. But there seems to have been Zips sent over to move work too. When Catalano paid up, he was paying Castellano, im not sure, was he paying Napolitano, Massino, kicking up to Rastelli? I'm reminded of Fat Tony caught on Taps saying something like, ” The Bonnanos, they got a crew of 80 guys, all they do is move junk, junk guys...." I'm paraphrasing but you get what I mean.

Essentially, like Cheech Gambino, the Cherry Hill guys, you could say they were Gambino crews, but they did what they did, move dope, with IMPUNITY. That's the question I guess I have, Are you saying the Rizzutos didn't move narcotics with Impunity? That the Bonnanos actually were directing all the traffic internationally? I think that's just plain wrong....

It's just weird to me, how were the Gambino clan independent, but the Rizzutos weren't? Serious question here...


3. On the Violis and Buffalo..

I think they were made into Buffalo for protection,they absorbed whatever was left of the Luppino ndrine, kind of " inherited” control of the Valuable border between Buffalo and Canada, and with their Calabrian origins, have large scale narcotics connections, and are being courted by the Bonnanos in NYC.,who might be tired of playing the role of " Trusted distributors" and are looking to exert the same kind of reach the Gambinos are.

I see Buffalo being valuable for the same reason a town like Elpaso is to the Mexicans. In fact, not long ago there was a bust in Buffalo, a Sinaloa drug operation. It's a big enough town to support criminal activity. Y'all just take this shit personally, lol...

I dunno, this stuff is pretty interesting, let me ask this while everyone is looking, what was the deal with Sciascia and Cotronis son? That thing Ive never got the full story....

[Hailbritain]

This is what JD uncovered

Older info mentions that Massino talked about gerlando Sciascia's murder coming about because he killed a Canadian member's son without permission. Don't think it was ever posted because there was so little to go on but here's more detail: Sciascia's nephew got in a fight with Frank Cotroni's son. The nephew got his jaw broken and in retaliation Sciascia had Cotroni's son murdered. This is the main reason (maybe only reason) he was killed. Massino claimed the Graziano situation reflected worse on Graziano than on Sciascia, and it was pressure from Cotroni or his supporters that led to Sciascia being taken out.

[Clark]

This is what JD uncovered

Older info mentions that Massino talked about gerlando Sciascia's murder coming about because he killed a Canadian member's son without permission. Don't think it was ever posted because there was so little to go on but here's more detail: Sciascia's nephew got in a fight with Frank Cotroni's son. The nephew got his jaw broken and in retaliation Sciascia had Cotroni's son murdered. This is the main reason (maybe only reason) he was killed. Massino claimed the Graziano situation reflected worse on Graziano than on Sciascia, and it was pressure from Cotroni or his supporters that led to Sciascia being taken out.

It makes you wonder if we will ever get the full story. Montreal hitman Gerald Gallant was Cotroni's killer, and he later turned informant. He attributes it to the HA/Rock Machine War. As per an investigate piece on him, this is the story he told about it:

"When Gérald Gallant was commissioned by the Montreal Rock Machine to eliminate Paul Cotroni, nephew of former Montreal mob boss Vic Cotroni, he "froze".

"It's a big name. (...) This is the son of Frank Cotroni, a former influential member of a big mafia, so, at the time, it was ... For the vast majority of the world, this family is well known," he said in September 2006, without ever asking why the Hells Angels rivals wanted to liquidate him.

In the summer of 1998, Paolo "Paul" Cotroni was living in Repentigny, "a place I do not know much about," said the killer who became an informer. He therefore asked his most loyal accomplice, Gerard "Maggy" Hubert, to help him. At the time, Hubert had no idea that 13 years earlier, Gallant had sent him to jail denouncing him for a robbery of police officer André Hardy, of the SQ, which he was an informant during " several years".

Gallant remembers that his accomplice and he tried in vain to take out Cotroni while driving because "with his Corvette, he rolled excessively fast".

After discovering that their target was still returning home between 9 pm and 11 pm, they kept watch in the middle of the night, hidden in shrubs not far from his house on rue Pigalle, on August 23, 1998. The wait lasted "two, three hours". At the point where Gallant, dehydrated and "completely laid to the ground" without moving, said he had chewed tree leaves to "cool off a bit".

When the victim finally arrived with his Corvette, Gallant, "a little stiff," and his partner rushed to their target, they hit six projectiles, including three to the head. A few days later, they shared a $ 20,000 reward.

At that point, the investigators first looked at a track that Cotroni had been eliminated because he had a $ 250,000 debt to Asian organized crime. But they ended up suspecting the Rock Machine.

In particular their member Johnny Plescio, who had warned Cotroni not to frequent the Hells Angels, according to investigation reports. Cotroni was a friend of Hells Scott Steinert, who later suffered an internal purge. Plescio himself was shot the following month in Laval, during a settlement of account attributed to the Hells."

It makes you wonder if Massino was still just "selling" the Sciascia hit. The problem with the information from Gallant is that, like in most cases, the hitman only know so much. The hit definitely was ordered by the Rock Machine, but how or why it got going, we may never know. And the Montreal underworld is a small place with lots of different connections, so I don't think it can be discounted that someone like Sciascia influenced/ordered it (if Massino's account is true). The timing definitely lines up, but that could also just be another reason Massino was using it as an excuse.