Why were the other families afraid of the Genovese?

[Luca]

Based on everything I’ve read all of the other families had much more dangerous killers. In NY and even places like Philly and Chicago all the other families seemed to have a stock of young and sometimes sadistic hitmen. But the Genovese just always seem like a bunch of old men. And some of the documented hits committed by the Genovese seem to contracted out to other families. If you go back to the mobs heyday, say 1980, if there was a shootout between the Genovese and any other ny family, or Chicago even, I’d think they would lose. But they still run shit, none of the more violent families ever come close to crossing them. Just something I’ve been thinking about….am I wrong?

[furiofromnaples]

Because they are the most Machiavellian of the 5 families and instead of using their men to kill someone, it is better to use someone else on whom the attention of the media and law enforcement will fall.
Why declare war on the Gambinos when the Luccheses can be used to kill Gotti's allies? Why kill Angelo Bruno when his deputy can be made to believe that NY would have supported him and appointed him boss?
For the bunch of old men,high ranking members are very old not the made men and when was time to pull the trigger they did it without problems like in the 1970s when the Westies wouldn't gave the control on the Jacovi Center and more important they always been a large family with a high number of associates so it would not have been so easy to go to war.

[SonnyBlackstein]

Based on everything I’ve read all of the other families had much more dangerous killers. In NY and even places like Philly and Chicago all the other families seemed to have a stock of young and sometimes sadistic hitmen. But the Genovese just always seem like a bunch of old men. And some of the documented hits committed by the Genovese seem to contracted out to other families. If you go back to the mobs heyday, say 1980, if there was a shootout between the Genovese and any other ny family, or Chicago even, I’d think they would lose. But they still run shit, none of the more violent families ever come close to crossing them. Just something I’ve been thinking about….am I wrong?

Read a Biography on Mike 'trigger Mike' Coppola.

[Wiseguy]

Based on everything I’ve read all of the other families had much more dangerous killers. In NY and even places like Philly and Chicago all the other families seemed to have a stock of young and sometimes sadistic hitmen. But the Genovese just always seem like a bunch of old men. And some of the documented hits committed by the Genovese seem to contracted out to other families. If you go back to the mobs heyday, say 1980, if there was a shootout between the Genovese and any other ny family, or Chicago even, I’d think they would lose. But they still run shit, none of the more violent families ever come close to crossing them. Just something I’ve been thinking about….am I wrong?

A shootout? Like they'd all meet up at the corner of Mulberry and Grand, High Noon style, with an old newspaper blowing across the street?

Seriously though...Tony Caponigro - repeatedly stabbed and strangled, Ralph Coppola - completely vanished, Larry Ricci - stuffed in a trunk with flies swarming around the car....to name a few.

Former FBI agent Bruce Mouw called the Genovese "a very tough, vicious family." They've never been some paper tiger.

[PolackTony]

It’s important to keep in mind with Chicago that it’s not simply that they had a bunch of vicious killers (which they did) but that for decades they were able to kill with near-impunity due to rampant judicial/political/LE corruption in the city/Cook county and various suburbs. So they were able to use murder as an instrument with little concern as to the consequences of it. Once the Feds smashed the Outfit’s corruption apparatuses in the 80s and 90s the Outfit’s use of murder plummeted accordingly.

With the NYC families, it seems reasonable to argue that the more prominent use of murder as a tactic is something like an index for the power and functionality of a family. The Colombos were cowboys compared to the Genovese because they were smaller and much weaker in terms of control of major institutions. They are also of course much more unstable and volatile. They played the card that was available to them. The fact that the Genovese may seem less violent/vicious comparatively speaks to their strength and ability to use other means of coercion to their advantage. That’s not to say they were not able to kill when they wanted to and to do so both viciously and effectively. As Wiseguy has already stated, they were very far from a bunch of toothless old men.

[PolackTony]

Based on everything I’ve read all of the other families had much more dangerous killers. In NY and even places like Philly and Chicago all the other families seemed to have a stock of young and sometimes sadistic hitmen. But the Genovese just always seem like a bunch of old men. And some of the documented hits committed by the Genovese seem to contracted out to other families. If you go back to the mobs heyday, say 1980, if there was a shootout between the Genovese and any other ny family, or Chicago even, I’d think they would lose. But they still run shit, none of the more violent families ever come close to crossing them. Just something I’ve been thinking about….am I wrong?

A shootout? Like they'd all meet up at the corner of Mulberry and Grand, High Noon style, with an old newspaper blowing across the street?

Presumably for a Chicago/Genovese war they would meet exactly halfway in Youngstown. Picture Tony Spilotro on the frontlines in full mustachioed glory while the German gets the drop on the Genovese from behind enemy lines while dressed in drag.

[UTC]

Wayne Bock parachutes in

[Ryan98366]

For once I agree with FURIOFROMNAPLES. The Genovese are very smart and wise. They may not have muscles or brawn. They are old men. But they are wise and smart. No one can ever seem to lay a direct punch on them. They always dodge it.

Not sure the idea of being "afraid" is correct. I think the other families are "wary" of the West Side.

[Luca]

I guess I didn’t mean a ‘shootout’ per se lol. But you know compared to the other families over the years they seem to have the least amount of experienced shooters, and commit the least amount of violence, and they also don’t seem to have the gritty hijacking armed robbery crews that every other family has…yet they are able to control and manage some really serious gangsters over the years. This is interesting to me.

[PolackTony]

Wayne Bock parachutes in

Rocky Infelise parachuting in next to him.

[furiofromnaples]

For once I agree with FURIOFROMNAPLES. The Genovese are very smart and wise. They may not have muscles or brawn. They are old men. But they are wise and smart. No one can ever seem to lay a direct punch on them. They always dodge it.

Not sure the idea of being "afraid" is correct. I think the other families are "wary" of the West Side.

I said that the high ranking members are very old but the capos and the made men are young (for the cosa nostra standards) plus they have many young associate. Its like Machiavelli said "be smart as a fox and strong as a lion".

[eboli]

I guess I didn’t mean a ‘shootout’ per se lol. But you know compared to the other families over the years they seem to have the least amount of experienced shooters, and commit the least amount of violence, and they also don’t seem to have the gritty hijacking armed robbery crews that every other family has…yet they are able to control and manage some really serious gangsters over the years. This is interesting to me.

In the 1980s and 1990s, Chin Gigante was probably the most feared and vicious boss in New York, which says something considering you had psychopaths like Persico and Amuso/Casso running other families. In the last 20 years, the Genovese crime family murdered more people than any other family in the States. You can see a full list in this thread: viewtopic.php?p=204650#p204650

[Grouchy Sinatra]

Presumably for a Chicago/Genovese war they would meet exactly halfway in Youngstown. Picture Tony Spilotro on the frontlines in full mustachioed glory while the German gets the drop on the Genovese from behind enemy lines while dressed in drag.

Next Seth Rogen/Johah Hill movie.

[Grouchy Sinatra]

Speaking to PolackTony's point about the shield of political corruption, I think this is still true for the Genovese as well. I swear these guys seem to get lenient sentences for crimes that you'd think would put them away for decades. Perhaps they're still making themselves useful to all the right people. I have to believe the federal government could do more to attack their Port Newark rackets, but it just seems to be easily replaceable guys getting arrested, and business goes on.

[dave]

The Genovese also probably have the most unsolved hits, considering they have the least amount of members flipped, which makes them appear the most non-violent to outsiders like us. They're the second biggest family in terms of numbers, so I'm sure they always had a substantial amount of killers.