SMALL TOWN MAFIA WARS

[Adam]

Detroit had what I would call two actual wars. The Vitale/Giannola war which kinda goes from 1917 to like 1921 or so, and the 1930-1931 Crosstown war which establishes the Detroit mob as we know/knew it.

I'd also mention the LA/Cohen war even though Cohen wasn't even fighting. Just getting eliminated.

[Newyorkempire]

So research has been a little boring lately....

Can we get a list of all mafia wars OUTSIDE NYC??

- Rochester wars (ABC War)

- Merlino vs Stanfa

- Buffalo (???)

- Detroit catalonette vs Vitale 1920s wars

I know I'm missing a few ...

Amazing there was the ABC war in Rochester. Just the right storm and ambition by odd sets of factions in a specifically rare era in my opinion.

Nothing really for Buffalo. Even during the end years for Maggadino no one really came at him strong after the dissidence started within the different crews. He died not too long after the rumblings started and he was accused of hoarding profits.

What about Trafficante Sr.? He was rank under the existing regime and then starting killing everyone to gain the top spot in Tampa

Here's a cool doc I found on Rochester wars:

https://youtu.be/4bCimSgnNuA

Trafficante snr flight against other Italians?? I remember he had the Cuban war with Charlie wall.

Antinori had the top Italian rank then the 3 of them started the Bolita Wars along with Trafficante winning against both.

[sdeitche]

Tampa had two distinct wars- though often grouped together as The Era of Blood.

1928-1940 - war between Mafia and Charlie Wall for control of bolita and other rackets. There were also Cubans and Spaniards involved on both sides.

1950-late 1950s (though most hits were in the early 1950s) - internal war between factions of the Mafia for control of Tampa rackets. I'd also throw in the killing of Jimmy Velasco in 1948 as part of this.

[Pogo The Clown]

Scarfo-Riccobene in 1982-1983.


Pogo

[JeremyTheJew]

Being a Small Town guy myself I'm not sure what a Big Town Mafia War is. Does the Cleveland/Pittsburgh War over Youngstown count?

This is one that I know next to nothing about. Is that Naples and Lenny strollo ???

I wouldn't call Joey and Lenny really being at war, more like two bosses in the same small town, never a good thing.
The real "war" was between Cleveland and Pittsburgh starting with Cleveland clipping/bombing the Naples family and some of their constituents and finally ending with Charlie Carabbia disappearing, for good

Do we have a actual thread breaking this down??? I'd start one but some ppl complain if we mistakenly make a duplicate lol.

Between you and JCB we should be able to have a decent thread of info.

I know next to nothing

[JeremyTheJew]

Here's a cool doc I found on Rochester wars:

https://youtu.be/4bCimSgnNuA

Thanks for this. Loved the part when "Gimme Shelter" by the Stones started playin lol

Ya made me think of Departed lol.
Nice avatar lol. Violent J I guess is retiring he has some sort of stomach problem possible cancer even.

[JeremyTheJew]

Detroit had what I would call two actual wars. The Vitale/Giannola war which kinda goes from 1917 to like 1921 or so, and the 1930-1931 Crosstown war which establishes the Detroit mob as we know/knew it.

I'd also mention the LA/Cohen war even though Cohen wasn't even fighting. Just getting eliminated.

And in between those wars was when Milazzo was gunned down involving the Castelmmarese war.

There was a decent book (the only book before Scotts) called The Violent Years by Paul Kavieff that went thru the whole 30 year period.

But it didn't really get into any of the modern names so i don't know how correct the info was back then. This was already 20nyesr old book.

The purple gang book was great too

[Villain]

Here's a cool doc I found on Rochester wars:

https://youtu.be/4bCimSgnNuA

Thanks for this. Loved the part when "Gimme Shelter" by the Stones started playin lol

Ya made me think of Departed lol.
Nice avatar lol. Violent J I guess is retiring he has some sort of stomach problem possible cancer even.

Thanks. He has heart issues, not cancer.

[Newyorkempire]

Tampa had two distinct wars- though often grouped together as The Era of Blood.

1928-1940 - war between Mafia and Charlie Wall for control of bolita and other rackets. There were also Cubans and Spaniards involved on both sides.

1950-late 1950s (though most hits were in the early 1950s) - internal war between factions of the Mafia for control of Tampa rackets. I'd also throw in the killing of Jimmy Velasco in 1948 as part of this.

Thanks Scott. Question...Any significant Italian cultural influence in Ybor City current day?

[FriendofHenry]

Being a Small Town guy myself I'm not sure what a Big Town Mafia War is. Does the Cleveland/Pittsburgh War over Youngstown count?

This is one that I know next to nothing about. Is that Naples and Lenny strollo ???

I wouldn't call Joey and Lenny really being at war, more like two bosses in the same small town, never a good thing.
The real "war" was between Cleveland and Pittsburgh starting with Cleveland clipping/bombing the Naples family and some of their constituents and finally ending with Charlie Carabbia disappearing, for good

Do we have a actual thread breaking this down??? I'd start one but some ppl complain if we mistakenly make a duplicate lol.

Between you and JCB we should be able to have a decent thread of info.

I know next to nothing

Reach out for JCB as he's the research expert on all things Pittsburgh. Remember I only have my personal relationships and experience to go on

[Newyorkempire]

Being a Small Town guy myself I'm not sure what a Big Town Mafia War is. Does the Cleveland/Pittsburgh War over Youngstown count?

This is one that I know next to nothing about. Is that Naples and Lenny strollo ???

I wouldn't call Joey and Lenny really being at war, more like two bosses in the same small town, never a good thing.
The real "war" was between Cleveland and Pittsburgh starting with Cleveland clipping/bombing the Naples family and some of their constituents and finally ending with Charlie Carabbia disappearing, for good

Do we have a actual thread breaking this down??? I'd start one but some ppl complain if we mistakenly make a duplicate lol.

Between you and JCB we should be able to have a decent thread of info.

I know next to nothing

Reach out for JCB as he's the research expert on all things Pittsburgh. Remember I only have my personal relationships and experience to go on

Henry, I appreciate your stance on not doing any research but am sort of confused on how anyone can simply state that there has been no making ceremonies in the 2000s and that when Ciancutti died stating he was the last member unless they know the underlying workings on a first hand basis. Meaning you were told directly by Genovese or Cinacutti that no one was made. Are you firm on there being no possibility there was any ceremonies based on your personal relationships or are you assuming based on other reasons?

[JeremyTheJew]

Being a Small Town guy myself I'm not sure what a Big Town Mafia War is. Does the Cleveland/Pittsburgh War over Youngstown count?

This is one that I know next to nothing about. Is that Naples and Lenny strollo ???

I wouldn't call Joey and Lenny really being at war, more like two bosses in the same small town, never a good thing.
The real "war" was between Cleveland and Pittsburgh starting with Cleveland clipping/bombing the Naples family and some of their constituents and finally ending with Charlie Carabbia disappearing, for good

Do we have a actual thread breaking this down??? I'd start one but some ppl complain if we mistakenly make a duplicate lol.

Between you and JCB we should be able to have a decent thread of info.

I know next to nothing

Reach out for JCB as he's the research expert on all things Pittsburgh. Remember I only have my personal relationships and experience to go on

Henry, I appreciate your stance on not doing any research but am sort of confused on how anyone can simply state that there has been no making ceremonies in the 2000s and that when Ciancutti died stating he was the last member unless they know the underlying workings on a first hand basis. Meaning you were told directly by Genovese or Cinacutti that no one was made. Are you firm on there being no possibility there was any ceremonies based on your personal relationships or are you assuming based on other reasons?

FOH .... Is.... The last made member bro ...

[Newyorkempire]

Being a Small Town guy myself I'm not sure what a Big Town Mafia War is. Does the Cleveland/Pittsburgh War over Youngstown count?

This is one that I know next to nothing about. Is that Naples and Lenny strollo ???

I wouldn't call Joey and Lenny really being at war, more like two bosses in the same small town, never a good thing.
The real "war" was between Cleveland and Pittsburgh starting with Cleveland clipping/bombing the Naples family and some of their constituents and finally ending with Charlie Carabbia disappearing, for good

Do we have a actual thread breaking this down??? I'd start one but some ppl complain if we mistakenly make a duplicate lol.

Between you and JCB we should be able to have a decent thread of info.

I know next to nothing

Reach out for JCB as he's the research expert on all things Pittsburgh. Remember I only have my personal relationships and experience to go on

Henry, I appreciate your stance on not doing any research but am sort of confused on how anyone can simply state that there has been no making ceremonies in the 2000s and that when Ciancutti died stating he was the last member unless they know the underlying workings on a first hand basis. Meaning you were told directly by Genovese or Cinacutti that no one was made. Are you firm on there being no possibility there was any ceremonies based on your personal relationships or are you assuming based on other reasons?

FOH .... Is.... The last made member bro ...

Based on what? Were you told by membership that was the case? Just to say it, unless you are admitting to first hand knowledge is like anybody else making claims they know something no one else does. So who told you? FOH?...no need to get dismissive because its something you feel so strongly about.

[FriendofHenry]

Being a Small Town guy myself I'm not sure what a Big Town Mafia War is. Does the Cleveland/Pittsburgh War over Youngstown count?

This is one that I know next to nothing about. Is that Naples and Lenny strollo ???

I wouldn't call Joey and Lenny really being at war, more like two bosses in the same small town, never a good thing.
The real "war" was between Cleveland and Pittsburgh starting with Cleveland clipping/bombing the Naples family and some of their constituents and finally ending with Charlie Carabbia disappearing, for good

Do we have a actual thread breaking this down??? I'd start one but some ppl complain if we mistakenly make a duplicate lol.

Between you and JCB we should be able to have a decent thread of info.

I know next to nothing

Reach out for JCB as he's the research expert on all things Pittsburgh. Remember I only have my personal relationships and experience to go on

Henry, I appreciate your stance on not doing any research but am sort of confused on how anyone can simply state that there has been no making ceremonies in the 2000s and that when Ciancutti died stating he was the last member unless they know the underlying workings on a first hand basis. Meaning you were told directly by Genovese or Cinacutti that no one was made. Are you firm on there being no possibility there was any ceremonies based on your personal relationships or are you assuming based on other reasons?

FOH .... Is.... The last made member bro ...

Based on what? Were you told by membership that was the case? Just to say it, unless you are admitting to first hand knowledge is like anybody else making claims they know something no one else does. So who told you? FOH?...no need to get dismissive because its something you feel so strongly about.

I'm afraid that you're both getting a little carried away.Let's start that I certainly was never made nor wanted to be made. Hell don't confuse my "friendships" with being part and parcel to anyone's crew, let alone being made! I am firm in saying that I have no knowledge of any "making ceremonies". I'm sure you know that they just don't send out invitations. Shortly after Ernie Biondillo was clipped and Henry was sent to town, more or less full time to keep an eye on Lenny as the last thing Michael wanted or needed was another round of killings. I was told by Bernie that Henry was now the man, meaning that he was made although I knew first hand that he never wanted "that thing" because he didn't want or need all the attention it would bring. The next time Henry came to visit he walked back to my office and told me that it was something he had to do. To the best on my knowledge Henry was the last guy Michael made and I have no other knowledge of Michael making anyone else. I just have no idea. Maybe ask JCB.

[Newyorkempire]

Being a Small Town guy myself I'm not sure what a Big Town Mafia War is. Does the Cleveland/Pittsburgh War over Youngstown count?

This is one that I know next to nothing about. Is that Naples and Lenny strollo ???

I wouldn't call Joey and Lenny really being at war, more like two bosses in the same small town, never a good thing.
The real "war" was between Cleveland and Pittsburgh starting with Cleveland clipping/bombing the Naples family and some of their constituents and finally ending with Charlie Carabbia disappearing, for good

Do we have a actual thread breaking this down??? I'd start one but some ppl complain if we mistakenly make a duplicate lol.

Between you and JCB we should be able to have a decent thread of info.

I know next to nothing

Reach out for JCB as he's the research expert on all things Pittsburgh. Remember I only have my personal relationships and experience to go on

Henry, I appreciate your stance on not doing any research but am sort of confused on how anyone can simply state that there has been no making ceremonies in the 2000s and that when Ciancutti died stating he was the last member unless they know the underlying workings on a first hand basis. Meaning you were told directly by Genovese or Cinacutti that no one was made. Are you firm on there being no possibility there was any ceremonies based on your personal relationships or are you assuming based on other reasons?

FOH .... Is.... The last made member bro ...

Based on what? Were you told by membership that was the case? Just to say it, unless you are admitting to first hand knowledge is like anybody else making claims they know something no one else does. So who told you? FOH?...no need to get dismissive because its something you feel so strongly about.

I'm afraid that you're both getting a little carried away.Let's start that I certainly was never made nor wanted to be made. Hell don't confuse my "friendships" with being part and parcel to anyone's crew, let alone being made! I am firm in saying that I have no knowledge of any "making ceremonies". I'm sure you know that they just don't send out invitations. Shortly after Ernie Biondillo was clipped and Henry was sent to town, more or less full time to keep an eye on Lenny as the last thing Michael wanted or needed was another round of killings. I was told by Bernie that Henry was now the man, meaning that he was made although I knew first hand that he never wanted "that thing" because he didn't want or need all the attention it would bring. The next time Henry came to visit he walked back to my office and told me that it was something he had to do. To the best on my knowledge Henry was the last guy Michael made and I have no other knowledge of Michael making anyone else. I just have no idea. Maybe ask JCB.

Good insight. Thanks