Is Barney truly a "boss"?

[sharpieone]

In the classic sense of the head of a criminal enterprise, receiving tribute from underlings, and orchestrating the dealings of the enterprise, is Barney truly a boss?

It seems accepted theory that he does not commonly meet with anyone, appoints panels and street bosses to deal with the day-to-day, does not attend making ceremonies, may not receive a scheduled tribute, lives in Florida, produces legitimate income, and has essentially made it so each crew in the enterprise is an autonomous cell, not linked to the central workings of the family nor other crews.

Is that truly a boss? If he's only being contacted for the highest-of-the-high advice, isn't he a semi-retired counselor at this point? I'd assume the vast majority of new members have never met him, that he does not meet with captains, and that he uses a rotating panel of high-level figures to run the daily operations. And even then, is he meeting with that person for even weekly briefs? If he has no vested interest in the earnings, doesn't know members on a personal basis, and doesn't need to show power and authority at this age, then what is he the boss of?

This is not a knock. In fact, it would more be a compliment to the longevity and strength of his enterprise, and should be an example of how criminals should operate in 2020.

I just wonder, with Vince Esposito holding members names and a slush fund, and absolutely no mention of BB in any recent indictments, how much is he actually in the picture? I don't think he has some secret anti-surveillance capability that has eluded all other modern criminals; I think he's just very removed, to the point at which it seems he's more of figurehead than a boss. I personally think he's nearly 100% crime-free and if he pisses off and puzzles the FBI for investigating a ghost who doesn't commit crimes, well then that's just fine for everybody in the Genovese.

[JohnnyS]

From all info we've got on him in recent years he still runs the family but from behind the scenes. In this day and age you want to operate in the shadows and have as less exposure as possible. It's good to have capable guys you can pass messages through and Barney has had that in Petey red, Ragusa, Muscarella and whoever else has held leadership roles since he took over. His influence is still felt in the family too, look at what Capeci wrote on Carmine Polito and how Barney being a fan of his helped him rise to being a respected acting captain within 2 years of being inducted.

[Pogo The Clown]

The only way to run a family these days is bunker style.


Pogo

[Frank]

Not to long ago he was the only boss of the NY city families on the streets. So I assume he is really cautious. But nobody knows if doesnt take tribute.

[Wiseguy]

In the classic sense of the head of a criminal enterprise, receiving tribute from underlings, and orchestrating the dealings of the enterprise, is Barney truly a boss?

It seems accepted theory that he does not commonly meet with anyone, appoints panels and street bosses to deal with the day-to-day, does not attend making ceremonies, may not receive a scheduled tribute, lives in Florida, produces legitimate income, and has essentially made it so each crew in the enterprise is an autonomous cell, not linked to the central workings of the family nor other crews.

Is that truly a boss? If he's only being contacted for the highest-of-the-high advice, isn't he a semi-retired counselor at this point? I'd assume the vast majority of new members have never met him, that he does not meet with captains, and that he uses a rotating panel of high-level figures to run the daily operations. And even then, is he meeting with that person for even weekly briefs? If he has no vested interest in the earnings, doesn't know members on a personal basis, and doesn't need to show power and authority at this age, then what is he the boss of?

This is not a knock. In fact, it would more be a compliment to the longevity and strength of his enterprise, and should be an example of how criminals should operate in 2020.

I just wonder, with Vince Esposito holding members names and a slush fund, and absolutely no mention of BB in any recent indictments, how much is he actually in the picture? I don't think he has some secret anti-surveillance capability that has eluded all other modern criminals; I think he's just very removed, to the point at which it seems he's more of figurehead than a boss. I personally think he's nearly 100% crime-free and if he pisses off and puzzles the FBI for investigating a ghost who doesn't commit crimes, well then that's just fine for everybody in the Genovese.

A lot of what you posted above are things we don't know and can only speculate. A figurehead is a nominal leader with no real power. Does that sound like what we've read about Barney? Even if he's passing orders through someone, they're still coming from him. Fat Tony ran much of the day to day and only had to consult with Chin on major issues. Moreover, how many people is Barney supposed to meet with on a regular basis to be considered a boss (even if we could know such a thing)? If sources in both law enforcement and the underworld affirm he's the boss, that about sums it up.

[Frank]

When the Chin died nothing has ever come out about anyone making a move to take over as official boss. I think age and the fact that Barney was second in command when he went to prison and respected by not only the Chin, but the other older leaders led the way for him becoming official boss. Also alot of older leaders were in prison when the Chin died.

[SonnyBlackstein]

In the classic sense of the head of a criminal enterprise, receiving tribute from underlings, and orchestrating the dealings of the enterprise, is Barney truly a boss?

It seems accepted theory that he does not commonly meet with anyone, appoints panels and street bosses to deal with the day-to-day, does not attend making ceremonies, may not receive a scheduled tribute, lives in Florida, produces legitimate income, and has essentially made it so each crew in the enterprise is an autonomous cell, not linked to the central workings of the family nor other crews.

Is that truly a boss? If he's only being contacted for the highest-of-the-high advice, isn't he a semi-retired counselor at this point? I'd assume the vast majority of new members have never met him, that he does not meet with captains, and that he uses a rotating panel of high-level figures to run the daily operations. And even then, is he meeting with that person for even weekly briefs? If he has no vested interest in the earnings, doesn't know members on a personal basis, and doesn't need to show power and authority at this age, then what is he the boss of?

This is not a knock. In fact, it would more be a compliment to the longevity and strength of his enterprise, and should be an example of how criminals should operate in 2020.

I just wonder, with Vince Esposito holding members names and a slush fund, and absolutely no mention of BB in any recent indictments, how much is he actually in the picture? I don't think he has some secret anti-surveillance capability that has eluded all other modern criminals; I think he's just very removed, to the point at which it seems he's more of figurehead than a boss. I personally think he's nearly 100% crime-free and if he pisses off and puzzles the FBI for investigating a ghost who doesn't commit crimes, well then that's just fine for everybody in the Genovese.

I read the title of this thread and rolled my eyes yet after reading your very interesting post I find myself agreeing with you on several very valid observations.

In my opinion Barney (or anyone) could not be rightfully considered the boss unless the following criteria were met:
1) A boss must be receiving regular tribute. Tribute is in return for the protection the boss offers. If tribute is not being offered or accepted then the likely inference is that person is not offering their protection and therefor functioning in capacity as boss.
2) Members don’t know or have not met Barney. You can’t be a member of a Borgata and have not met, be introduced too or are aware of who the representative of your family is. And when people who want to respond point out Fat Tony Salerno, it was only OTHER families who were unaware who the WS boss was. There is no evidence to my knowledge that WS members themselves were unaware who the boss was. Correct me if I’m wrong. This is an important distinction.
3) the Capos can’t meet with Barney. The key word here is can’t not don’t. It’s one thing for Barney to operate through a messengero, AB/UB or panel in order to operate but if the Capo’s are forbidden under any circumstances to meet with Barney, this surely disqualifies Barney as a boss if crew leaders are restricted under any circumstances to forever meet the head of the family.

There are a lot of hypotheticals in this scenario as we are starved of information. BUT, if Barney doesn’t receive tribute, members and Capos can’t meet with him, he’s only consulted occasionally, has purely legitimate income, lives in Florida, then a damn good argument can be made that he’s boss in name only. Or more importantly, not boss at all but a senior advisor.

And we’re talking in a practical sense here, not a technical one. YES THE FBI STILL CARRIES HIM AS ‘BOSS’, but they also carry Peter fucking Gotti as the boss of the Gambino’s, sooooooo....

Great thread sharpione

[Frank]

Do we know if any of this even apply to Barney.

[NYNighthawk]

Is the purpose of this thread to "tickle the wires"?

[Frank]

Is the purpose of this thread to "tickle the wires"?

Lol

[SonnyBlackstein]

Do we know if any of this even apply to Barney.

Nobody knows anything.

[Wiseguy]

1) A boss must be receiving regular tribute. Tribute is in return for the protection the boss offers. If tribute is not being offered or accepted then the likely inference is that person is not offering their protection and therefor functioning in capacity as boss.

These sources say Bellomo earns substantial rental income every month from numerous apartment buildings worth millions of dollars that he owns in the Bronx and northern suburb, where he still resides when he is not in his Miami Beach condo on Collins Avenue.

Obviously him having his own legit income doesn't automatically mean he's not receiving tribute. But, if receiving tribute is a prerequisite to be boss, what is the minimal tribute he needs to take to qualify? We know Chin supposedly didn't take much, if any, money off many of his underlings.

Also, where did the idea come from that Bellomo is living in Florida full time now? According to the GL article back in 2016 above, he was still living in NY when not at his condo (i.e. a vacation home) in Florida.

Merlino lives in Florida, no? Does that bring into question his position as boss?

2) Members don’t know or have not met Barney. You can’t be a member of a Borgata and have not met, be introduced too or are aware of who the representative of your family is.

It seems everyone knows Bellomo is the boss. And there have been plenty of members who have never met their own boss.

3) the Capos can’t meet with Barney. The key word here is can’t not don’t. It’s one thing for Barney to operate through a messengero, AB/UB or panel in order to operate but if the Capo’s are forbidden under any circumstances to meet with Barney, this surely disqualifies Barney as a boss if crew leaders are restricted under any circumstances to forever meet the head of the family.

Sources say Bellomo is using longtime Lower East Side capo Peter (Petey Red) DiChiara to relay orders and information to Genovese family members. DiChiara, the sources, say is serving as, "street boss" or acting boss for Bellomo, relaying messages to and from capos and important family soldiers.

"Barney's the boss," said one law enforcement official. "He's the reason why people from Brooklyn and the Bronx have been showing up in lower Manhattan in the last few years."

Obviously we don't know if he doesn't meet with captains. Simply that the above is how he was relaying orders 5+ years ago. And, possibly, the same with Ragusa now. But even if Bellomo had his own policy of only meeting with one guy, be it his street boss or whoever, that wouldn't disqualify him as the boss. Him not meeting with captains on a regular or even semi-regular basis doesn't mean he's never met them at least once over the years. Is there a certain number of times he supposed to meet with them to qualify as boss in your mind?

There are a lot of hypotheticals in this scenario as we are starved of information. BUT, if Barney doesn’t receive tribute, members and Capos can’t meet with him, he’s only consulted occasionally, has purely legitimate income, lives in Florida, then a damn good argument can be made that he’s boss in name only. Or more importantly, not boss at all but a senior advisor.

And we’re talking in a practical sense here, not a technical one. YES THE FBI STILL CARRIES HIM AS ‘BOSS’, but they also carry Peter fucking Gotti as the boss of the Gambino’s, sooooooo....

Gotti is effectively doing life. Bellomo isn't. Capeci reported that Gotti is seen as a figurehead. He hasn't said anything remotely the same about Bellomo.

I'd argue you would have much more of a point if we were talking about, say, a street boss. In a practical sense, they have to be readily accessible on the street to run the day to day. It's why the feds labeling Ralph DeLeo as the street boss of the Colombos for a time, while he was spending most of his time in Boston, was one of the rare times I took exception to the official narrative. But an official boss has the luxury of hanging in the background to a large degree if he wants. It's why we have considered guys who have gotten a life sentence in some far away prison to still be the boss, i.e. Gotti, Gigante, Amuso, Persico, etc.

[jmack]

The only way to run a family these days is bunker style.


Pogo

You peer out through the slit

[Adam]

If Bellomo decides someone has to go(granted, a rarity) and passes that order on, is it going to happen? If the answer is yes, he's the boss.

[PolackTony]

If Bellomo decides someone has to go(granted, a rarity) and passes that order on, is it going to happen? If the answer is yes, he's the boss.

+1. This is I think a crucial distinction. Regardless of whether Bellomo is consistently receiving envelopes from the organization, meeting with capos, etc. -- if he ultimately has the last word on who gets taken out or other critical decisions like appointments/demotions to the admin, promotions to capo, crew structure, etc., then he's the boss. Essentially, the buck stops with him.

Beyond responsibility for day-to-day operations of the organization or income from criminal activities, the boss is the ultimate executive authority. The other responsibilities can be delegated, but what matters is the recognition of executive authority. This is what would make Bellomo different than a Pete Gotti-type "figurehead", no matter how insulated or removed from the active criminal enterprise or membership of the organization the former might be.

This is a very interesting discussion, and as with many others on the forum hinges on the organizational/operational (i.e. formal/functional or de jure/de facto ) distinction. At one level, the "boss" is the formal "rappresentante" of the family under LCN protocol. This can be the case even if one is just a figurehead in functional/operational terms, as presumably is the case with Pete Gotti (hence his continued recognition by the Feds as "boss"). On another level, of course, the "boss" is the office invested with supreme executive authority, which speaks for the family as an entity at the highest level. A pop culture reference that serves as a useful illustration here is the DiMeo family. Throughout most of the series at least, old man DiMeo is the de jure boss of the family, as reflected in the FBI charts that we see, while Jackie Aprile, Junior, and Tony are at least in the formal sense "acting bosses". As DeMeo seems to have absolutely no input in the affairs of the family, however, these formally "acting" bosses really are de facto bosses, as ultimately their word is what matters. If it came down at some point in the series that DeMeo -- despite being isolated from the day-to-day role, meeting with capos, receiving envelopes, etc. -- was still getting word out (via a streetboss, lieutenant, trusted relative) on critical decisions (to whack someone, to decide whether Junior or Tony would succeed Jackie, going to war with the Luppertazzis, etc.) -- then our picture of his role in the family as well as Tony's would be quite different. DeMeo would not be simply a figurehead on a chart, but rather both de jure and de facto boss as the ultimate executive authority speaking for the family.

Families like the Genovese and Chicago have a long tradition of delegating many of the typical "boss" responsibilities to a second-in-command of course. The ultimate executive authority was always invested in the top boss, however. As others have noted, despite all of the uncertainty and dearth of info, Bellomo's role is likely continuous with previous Genovese practices. Another example is the status of Johnny DiFronzo in the '90s. While Johnny Apes was in charge of the day-to-day responsibilities, and DiFronzo was largely insulated from the Outfit as an active criminal enterprise (and while still receiving envelopes he was bringing in major income from legit business interests), he was still the "boss", as recognized by the membership (e.g. Nick Calabrese's testimony, Frank Calabrese wiretaps).