What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
Moderator: Capos
What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
Some of the obvious ones:
- Exactly when and how did the mob start in Sicily, Calabria, and Naples?
- Did the first members have a ceremony for themselves or did they just start calling themselves members?
- Who were the very first leaders of the original USA families?
- What old time members were secretly informants (that we don't already know about)?
- How did the DeCavalcante family form?
- How did the Profaci family form?
- How did the Morello and Reina families split up?
- What has the Genovese family done with the official boss position since Gigante died?
- Who was part of the hit team on Angelo Bruno?
Most of these won't ever be answered, but those are some of the big ones I could think of and maybe it'll open up discussion. I am sure people have many more, both small and large, old and new.
- Exactly when and how did the mob start in Sicily, Calabria, and Naples?
- Did the first members have a ceremony for themselves or did they just start calling themselves members?
- Who were the very first leaders of the original USA families?
- What old time members were secretly informants (that we don't already know about)?
- How did the DeCavalcante family form?
- How did the Profaci family form?
- How did the Morello and Reina families split up?
- What has the Genovese family done with the official boss position since Gigante died?
- Who was part of the hit team on Angelo Bruno?
Most of these won't ever be answered, but those are some of the big ones I could think of and maybe it'll open up discussion. I am sure people have many more, both small and large, old and new.
- HairyKnuckles
- Full Patched
- Posts: 2360
- Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 12:42 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
A good list of unanswered questiones there B.
I would love to have access to a fully accurate and complete list of the names of all made members (NY Families from ca 1920 til today). I´d pay a fortune for a list describing the structure with all bosses, underbosses, consiglieres and crew leaders.
I would love to have access to a fully accurate and complete list of the names of all made members (NY Families from ca 1920 til today). I´d pay a fortune for a list describing the structure with all bosses, underbosses, consiglieres and crew leaders.
There you have it, never printed before.
- Hailbritain
- Full Patched
- Posts: 2013
- Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:17 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
This is what I've been able to piece together regarding the relatively scant info on the Genovese hierarchy over the past 25 years...
May 1990 - Barney Bellomo made acting boss after Vincent Gigante is indicted in the Widows case.
June 1996 - Barney Bellomo indicted. Dominick Cirillo becomes acting boss.
May 1998 - Dominick Cirillo steps down after a heart attack. Frank Serpico follows as acting boss but steps down some time between then and April 2001 when he's indicted as the "former" acting boss. Whenever that was, apparently Ernie Muscarella followed as acting boss.
January 2002 - Ernie Muscarella indicted as acting boss.
Artie Nigro was reported to be acting boss in November 2003 so he probably succeeded Muscarella.
If what former FBI agent Jack Garcia said was correct, Pasquale DeLuca was probably acting boss at some point during this time, since it would fall within the December 2002 - March 2005 time frame of Garcia's undercover work; though it's not clear for how long since we don't know exactly when Dominick Cirillo resumed his the role after he recovered.
April 2005 - Dominick Cirillo indicted as acting boss.
July 2005 - Matthew Ianniello indicted as "an" acting boss, as opposed to "the" acting boss. This is wording is probably intentional by the feds, which suggests he was on the ruling panel.
December 2006 - Danny Leo identified as acting boss (from his previous position on the ruling panel) and indicted as such in May 2007.
June 2009 - NY Daily News article identifies Benny Mangano, Ernie Muscarella, Barney Bellomo, and Larry Dentico on a "rotating panel" of recently released senior members running the family.
September 2009 - NY Times article identifies Tino Fiumara as being on a "three man panel" running the family.
February 2010 - Artie Nigro indicted as the "former" acting boss.
February 2014 - Wall Street Journal article reports that the family still likely uses a rotating panel of leaders.
May 1990 - Barney Bellomo made acting boss after Vincent Gigante is indicted in the Widows case.
June 1996 - Barney Bellomo indicted. Dominick Cirillo becomes acting boss.
May 1998 - Dominick Cirillo steps down after a heart attack. Frank Serpico follows as acting boss but steps down some time between then and April 2001 when he's indicted as the "former" acting boss. Whenever that was, apparently Ernie Muscarella followed as acting boss.
January 2002 - Ernie Muscarella indicted as acting boss.
Artie Nigro was reported to be acting boss in November 2003 so he probably succeeded Muscarella.
If what former FBI agent Jack Garcia said was correct, Pasquale DeLuca was probably acting boss at some point during this time, since it would fall within the December 2002 - March 2005 time frame of Garcia's undercover work; though it's not clear for how long since we don't know exactly when Dominick Cirillo resumed his the role after he recovered.
April 2005 - Dominick Cirillo indicted as acting boss.
July 2005 - Matthew Ianniello indicted as "an" acting boss, as opposed to "the" acting boss. This is wording is probably intentional by the feds, which suggests he was on the ruling panel.
December 2006 - Danny Leo identified as acting boss (from his previous position on the ruling panel) and indicted as such in May 2007.
June 2009 - NY Daily News article identifies Benny Mangano, Ernie Muscarella, Barney Bellomo, and Larry Dentico on a "rotating panel" of recently released senior members running the family.
September 2009 - NY Times article identifies Tino Fiumara as being on a "three man panel" running the family.
February 2010 - Artie Nigro indicted as the "former" acting boss.
February 2014 - Wall Street Journal article reports that the family still likely uses a rotating panel of leaders.
- Hailbritain
- Full Patched
- Posts: 2013
- Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:17 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
The Bruno murder is intersting , if I had to guess I would say tony caponigro did it himself . George freselone stated if caponigro wanted somebody dead he did it himself
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
At first I didn't think Tony pulled the trigger on Bruno...but now I am thinking it was more than likely him running away with a shotgun...lol...
- Pogo The Clown
- Men Of Mayhem
- Posts: 14219
- Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2014 7:02 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
A lot of mine have already been mentioned. Another one is who where the hitters in the murdersof the Mangano brothers and just who was involved (and who gave the order) in the the Colombo shooting.
Pogo
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
-
- Full Patched
- Posts: 3136
- Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2014 9:48 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
I'd like to know who was the first non-sicilian to be made into cosa nostra and the politics surrounding it. Also is there any truth to that 'combineesh' thing.
-
- Sergeant Of Arms
- Posts: 614
- Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2014 10:08 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
There are too many questions I would like to have answers for. But the first coming to mind is I would like this confusion with "front bosses" and "powers behind the throne" in the Chicago Outfit and the Genovese family be finally cleared up;
things like "could Aiuppa order a hit against Accardo's wishes?" or "Did Funzi Tieri engineer the Bruno murder plot independently from Lombardo or not?"
To sum it up: I would like exact information about power balances in those 2 groups, who was really the leader and how much power did he actually hold over the "colleagues".
things like "could Aiuppa order a hit against Accardo's wishes?" or "Did Funzi Tieri engineer the Bruno murder plot independently from Lombardo or not?"
To sum it up: I would like exact information about power balances in those 2 groups, who was really the leader and how much power did he actually hold over the "colleagues".
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
Who pulled the triggers on Giancana and Hoffa.
Who threw Abe Reles out the window.
How common were sleeper members, who, why and how were they able to maintain that status.
Who threw Abe Reles out the window.
How common were sleeper members, who, why and how were they able to maintain that status.
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
Or what I pieced together and you're more than welcome to repost....Hailbritain wrote:This is what I've been able to piece together regarding the relatively scant info on the Genovese hierarchy over the past 25 years...
May 1990 - Barney Bellomo made acting boss after Vincent Gigante is indicted in the Widows case.
June 1996 - Barney Bellomo indicted. Dominick Cirillo becomes acting boss.
May 1998 - Dominick Cirillo steps down after a heart attack. Frank Serpico follows as acting boss but steps down some time between then and April 2001 when he's indicted as the "former" acting boss. Whenever that was, apparently Ernie Muscarella followed as acting boss.
January 2002 - Ernie Muscarella indicted as acting boss.
Artie Nigro was reported to be acting boss in November 2003 so he probably succeeded Muscarella.
If what former FBI agent Jack Garcia said was correct, Pasquale DeLuca was probably acting boss at some point during this time, since it would fall within the December 2002 - March 2005 time frame of Garcia's undercover work; though it's not clear for how long since we don't know exactly when Dominick Cirillo resumed his the role after he recovered.
April 2005 - Dominick Cirillo indicted as acting boss.
July 2005 - Matthew Ianniello indicted as "an" acting boss, as opposed to "the" acting boss. This is wording is probably intentional by the feds, which suggests he was on the ruling panel.
December 2006 - Danny Leo identified as acting boss (from his previous position on the ruling panel) and indicted as such in May 2007.
June 2009 - NY Daily News article identifies Benny Mangano, Ernie Muscarella, Barney Bellomo, and Larry Dentico on a "rotating panel" of recently released senior members running the family.
September 2009 - NY Times article identifies Tino Fiumara as being on a "three man panel" running the family.
February 2010 - Artie Nigro indicted as the "former" acting boss.
February 2014 - Wall Street Journal article reports that the family still likely uses a rotating panel of leaders.
All roads lead to New York.
-
- Full Patched
- Posts: 3136
- Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2014 9:48 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
Is the New Orleans family really the oldest?
I'd also like to know something/anything about the Birmingham Family.
Maybe a list of the guys who bought their button from Frank Scalise.
I'd also like to know something/anything about the Birmingham Family.
Maybe a list of the guys who bought their button from Frank Scalise.
- Hailbritain
- Full Patched
- Posts: 2013
- Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:17 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
Cheers pal , this is pretty much spot on , I would like to know who the other two captsins were wen fiumara was on a 3 man panel
-
- Sergeant Of Arms
- Posts: 539
- Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2014 10:56 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
Who shot Jerome Johnson after he shot Joe Colombo ? And was this the plan?
- Hailbritain
- Full Patched
- Posts: 2013
- Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:17 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
The guy who shot Johnson was a colombo bodyguard called Phillip chubby rossillo
- Pogo The Clown
- Men Of Mayhem
- Posts: 14219
- Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2014 7:02 am
Re: What are the biggest unanswered questions you have?
How exactly did the position of Consiglieri comme about?
How exactly did the Rochester family come about?
How did the Newark family come about and why did NY decide to disband them and how was that implemented?
Pogo
How exactly did the Rochester family come about?
How did the Newark family come about and why did NY decide to disband them and how was that implemented?
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.