UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Discuss all mafia families in the U.S., Canada, Italy, and everywhere else in the world.

Moderator: Capos

User avatar
FriendofFamily
Full Patched
Posts: 1124
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:25 am
Location: Chicago & Cleveland

UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by FriendofFamily »

I thought that it was pretty interesting that this Confidential Informant File was protected so long from 1963 and just released in November 2017. So for our researcher I wonder who this Confidential Informant was? Why would they keep this file for so long? I will load the 12 pages in groups for your viewing pleasure.

docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_01.jpg
docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_02.jpg
docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_03.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Know which Game to Play
User avatar
FriendofFamily
Full Patched
Posts: 1124
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:25 am
Location: Chicago & Cleveland

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by FriendofFamily »

docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_04.jpg
docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_05.jpg
docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_06.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Know which Game to Play
User avatar
FriendofFamily
Full Patched
Posts: 1124
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:25 am
Location: Chicago & Cleveland

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by FriendofFamily »

docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_07.jpg
docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_08.jpg
docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_09.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Know which Game to Play
User avatar
FriendofFamily
Full Patched
Posts: 1124
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:25 am
Location: Chicago & Cleveland

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by FriendofFamily »

docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_10.jpg
docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_11.jpg
docid-32304755 cleveland_Page_12.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Know which Game to Play
User avatar
FriendofFamily
Full Patched
Posts: 1124
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:25 am
Location: Chicago & Cleveland

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by FriendofFamily »

I think this gives somewhat of an idea and a sense of an overview (although definitely not thorough) of what one person would know about certain parts of the operations especially other cities and who was in charge of the different cities for the Cleveland LCN.
Know which Game to Play
User avatar
Snakes
Full Patched
Posts: 4354
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 7:00 am
Location: Elvis Country

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by Snakes »

Here is the original, redacted document if anyone wants to use it as a reference:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.htm ... 1&tab=page
User avatar
Stroccos
Full Patched
Posts: 3503
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:23 am

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by Stroccos »

That informents info was on merry Ferrell already but belive the bottom pages were not included , good find ! I am sure we can figure out who it is if those crimes were in the paper .
"if he's such A sports wizard , whys he tending bar ?" Nicky Scarfo
User avatar
FriendofFamily
Full Patched
Posts: 1124
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:25 am
Location: Chicago & Cleveland

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by FriendofFamily »

Well for one thing it reveals that the CI was born in Italy in 1904 and came to the USA when he was 15 so around 1919-20. He was the Owner of a Restaurant that was losing money and he went to the Cleveland LCN for a $5,000-$10,000 Loan and they turned him down.
Remember $5,000-$10,000. could buy you a house back then. He probably was pissed that they didn't loan him any money so he goes to the FBI and starts talking (my conjecture).

He grew up with Babe Triscaro - so their is a lot that can be extracted from this UN-REDACTED File especially when you see what the difference is between the 1998 file and the 2017 File. He spent the various time in the Pen with various members and just that information should help pinpoint this guy. Also the years and other clues are revealed in the file.
Know which Game to Play
User avatar
Stroccos
Full Patched
Posts: 3503
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:23 am

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by Stroccos »

FriendofFamily wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:42 am Well for one thing it reveals that the CI was born in Italy in 1904 and came to the USA when he was 15 so around 1919-20. He was the Owner of a Restaurant that was losing money and he went to the Cleveland LCN for a $5,000-$10,000 Loan and they turned him down.
Remember $5,000-$10,000. could buy you a house back then. He probably was pissed that they didn't loan him any money so he goes to the FBI and starts talking (my conjecture).

He grew up with Babe Triscaro - so their is a lot that can be extracted from this UN-REDACTED File especially when you see what the difference is between the 1998 file and the 2017 File. He spent the various time in the Pen with various members and just that information should help pinpoint this guy. Also the years and other clues are revealed in the file.
Yeah and the cop killings , of course everybody is broke when he needs a loan , so your probably right he was pissed and didn’t mind blabbing to the Feds

I was bored guys so here is what I dug up 1929
Detective Stadler and Detective Lieutenant Benjamin Smith were shot and killed during a shootout with two suspects who were attempting to rob a payroll on West Chicago Street. Detective Stadler was struck twice in the face and once in the abdomen. He was transported to Highland Park Hospital where he was pronounced dead. Detective Lieutenant Smith was also shot and died the following day.
https://www.odmp.org/officer/12670-dete ... -l-stadler

The informent says his car may of been used in the robbery /murder Glen bates car was boworred and used in this robbery ,
But he doesn’t around very Italian ,
"if he's such A sports wizard , whys he tending bar ?" Nicky Scarfo
Frank
Full Patched
Posts: 2736
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 1:06 am

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by Frank »

Peter Licavoli was a founding fathers of the current Detroit mob. It sound like Milano brought the Licavoli to Ohio. Jack white Licavoli was made into Cleveland and later became boss. I assume Peter was still a member of Detroit. But it seems like he was also a boss in Ohio. Was his interests separate from Cleveland's and really under control of Detroit. I take it You is his brother. They Detroit, Cleveland and Los Angeles crossover also gets kind of confusing.
Frank
Full Patched
Posts: 2736
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 1:06 am

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by Frank »

Sorry you should be yonnie Licavoli fucking computer
User avatar
SILENT PARTNERZ
Full Patched
Posts: 1211
Joined: Tue Jun 27, 2017 9:14 am

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by SILENT PARTNERZ »

Jack White reporting to his cousin Pete Licavoli is interesting.
We know Pete Livcavoli was influential. He seemed to have juice
originally in St. Louis, then Detroit, Ohio, and Arizona. I wonder how much if
any influence Pete had within the Cleveland family, aside from
the control over Jack White.
'three can keep a secret, if two are dead'
User avatar
FriendofFamily
Full Patched
Posts: 1124
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:25 am
Location: Chicago & Cleveland

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by FriendofFamily »

Frank wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:24 pm Sorry you should be yonnie Licavoli fucking computer
I hate the Auro correct feature it thinks it knows what you want to say.
Know which Game to Play
User avatar
FriendofFamily
Full Patched
Posts: 1124
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:25 am
Location: Chicago & Cleveland

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by FriendofFamily »

FriendofFamily wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:05 pm
Frank wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:24 pm Sorry you should be yonnie Licavoli fucking computer
I hate the Auro correct feature it thinks it knows what you want to say.
See Autocorrect - effing computer
Know which Game to Play
Adam
Sergeant Of Arms
Posts: 660
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 2:20 pm
Location: East Lansing

Re: UN-REDACTED Cleveland Structure File 1963

Post by Adam »

I feel like a lot of these informant reports from the 60s really have to be taken with a grain of salt. Especially with the benefit of hindsight. Doesn't mean the informant doesn't believe what they're saying, but they could just be wrong. But it is interesting to see what the FBI believed at the time. A few things stick out for me in these pages(and thanks again for posting):

1. Why have I never heard of John Scalish's brother Tom who the informant is claiming John inherited his position from? Does that ring true with the people who follow Cleveland closely? I just feel if that were the case I would know a bit about him.

2. I have trouble seeing Jack White reporting to Pete Licavoli in 1963. I don't see how Jack wasn't reporting to Scalish by that point. And while I believe that Besase out of Toledo answered to Detroit(and I specifically mean Detroit, not the Licavolis), I just don't see Jack White and Tony Delsanter doing that. At that point I think they're just Cleveland guys.

3. I also find the idea of Yonnie Licavoli running things in Detroit and Pete acting for him fanciful. The Licavolis never ran things in Detroit. They were just part of the ruling council. If anyone ran things it would have been Zerilli-Tocco-Meli-Priziola. The informant's own claims have Yonnie trying to get people in Ohio to loan the informant money and being told no, and Pete Licavoli complaining about not having money to meet his financial needs. Bear in mind that Pete moved out of Detroit in I believe 1945 and after that his presence there seems to have been minimal. Everything he had in Detroit seems to have gone to Bommarito after he left and Bommarito was dead by 1963 and had been replaced by the Giacalones. Also, Yonnie had been in prison for over 25 years after a very short period of time as a prominent gambler/bootlegger in Detroit and Ohio in the 20s and 30s. Respected yes, but running things no. I'm sure Jack White had some joint ventures with Pete Licavoli in the 1960s, but I don't see much beyond that. Licavoli really comes across as essentially retired once he moves to Arizona. I mean as retired as a Detroit ruling council boss gets.

4. Detroit having a lot of influence in Wheeling is interesting. Makes sense considering that there are FBI reports that the Detroit family asked the Mannarinos to kill gambler Nick Miller who was found strangled in Wheeling in 1957. I've never been able to figure out why Detroit wanted him dead.

5. Interesting that he lists Tony Milano as having no power and on the fringe. Not saying it's wrong, but pretty sure that when Scalish dies 13 years later Milano is the underboss. Even if he wasn't really doing anything.

But interesting stuff.
Post Reply