Buffalo power

[JeremyTheJew]

Kinda same lines as Chicago:

What made BUFFALO so powerful and why the decline?? Probably one of the biggest declines in us lcn possibly.

They had a huge family in the early years - up to 200 members Iv seen

And 2 families broke off from Buffalo also so at one point there was 3 factions to the same Family and then you got Niagra Falls too

And is the decline tied to magaddino?

[furiofromnaples]

Kinda same lines as Chicago:

What made BUFFALO so powerful and why the decline?? Probably one of the biggest declines in us lcn possibly.

They had a huge family in the early years - up to 200 members Iv seen

And 2 families broke off from Buffalo also so at one point there was 3 factions to the same Family and then you got Niagra Falls too

And is the decline tied to magaddino?

I dont know where you found the numbers of 200 members but in 1967 the Fbi listed 50 confirmed made men and 19 suspected made men.

Anyway after Prohibition,the families made less easy to be inducted because you must be a good earner or a stone cold killer or both,be full blooded italian ecc for this reason many paid to be made.

[Pogo The Clown]

The factionalism of the late 1960s-1970s really weakened them on the national level. Couple that with the economic devastation that hit the rust belt soon after along with the big increase in generational attrition that hit most of the families during the same period is what really devastated them.


Pogo

[Augie]

Kinda same lines as Chicago:

What made BUFFALO so powerful and why the decline?? Probably one of the biggest declines in us lcn possibly.

They had a huge family in the early years - up to 200 members Iv seen

And 2 families broke off from Buffalo also so at one point there was 3 factions to the same Family and then you got Niagra Falls too

And is the decline tied to magaddino?

I believe at their peak they were around 80-90 made members. They are an interesting family. Outside of NYC and Chicago they were probably the most powerful in their heyday. They had union control as well and their history with one particular powerful union is interesting. As was stated generational attrition and changing demographics from old Italian neighborhoods to suburbs and different demographics are some of the biggest reasons of their decline.

[SonnyBlackstein]

Small demographic change happened to Chicago, Detroit, rust belt in the 70's+

Im sure it was for the better.

[Pmac2]

Guessing not more then 40 made guys whenever there peak was. 1960ish. Closer to new England size

[furiofromnaples]

Guessing not more then 40 made guys whenever there peak was. 1960ish. Closer to new England size

Pmac there are a FBI 1967 chart where listed 50 made men and 19 suspected members.
Maybe maybe in late 1960s there are old guy or retired but 50 made men is better than New England and Chicago.

[Snakes]

They had 49 in 1993. 1985 had 72, but included Rochester, which the '93 had separate (31 members). The 1960s lists can have accuracy issues, but I don't have that number off the top of my head.

I also can't attest to the accuracy of Rochester members being recognized as Rochester members, Buffalo members, or (in some cases) not at all.

[OcSleeper]

IIRC those 1985 and 1993 lists were missing quite a few guys as well.

[Wiseguy]

They had 49 in 1993. 1985 had 72, but included Rochester, which the '93 had separate (31 members). The 1960s lists can have accuracy issues, but I don't have that number off the top of my head.

I also can't attest to the accuracy of Rochester members being recognized as Rochester members, Buffalo members, or (in some cases) not at all.

Here's what I have...

1967 report: 73 listed members
1967 report: 68 listed members (48 confirmed, 20 suspected; included Rochester)
1985 FBI: 56 listed members
1989 FBI: 45 cited members
1993 FBI: 49 listed members
1997 Hamilton PD: 34 listed members (some missing)
2006 FBI: 23 listed members
2013 article: 20 estimated members

[NickleCity]

Here's what I have...

1967 report: 73 listed members
1967 report: 68 listed members (48 confirmed, 20 suspected; included Rochester)
1985 FBI: 56 listed members
1989 FBI: 45 cited members
1993 FBI: 49 listed members
1997 Hamilton PD: 34 listed members (some missing)
2006 FBI: 23 listed members
2013 article: 20 estimated members

Hey Wiseguy ... I'd take the NF Reporter article with a grain of salt. Here is a screenshot:


Everyone from the area knows the Niagara Fall Reporter was and is a rag to promote Hudson's and others' agenda in NF. Also, from what I understand Mike Hudson was an associate of Todaro Sr. ...Additionally, from what I've heard Parlato Jr. who took it over after Hudson's death is or was an associate as well. I'm not going to get into how I know this now and you can certainly take my street knowledge with a grain of salt as well.

Hudson is the one that wrote about Falzone taking over for Todaro as acting boss saying the FBI had adjusted their charts in 2006 and that Nicoletti was the underboss. As we know from the 2006 chart that I posted, the FBI had Falzone listed as a soldier not boss or even acting boss. Additionally, it has Nicolitti as a soldier as well.


Here is the 2006 FBI chart:

[Wiseguy]

Who's "everyone?" And what exactly is Hudson's "agenda?" Whatever you think of the paper, it's citing the FBI as a source. So it's really the FBI we're talking about.

[NickleCity]

Who's "everyone?" And what exactly is Hudson's "agenda?" Whatever you think of the paper, it's citing the FBI as a source. So it's really the FBI we're talking about.

See the 2006 chart that I've posted above. Would you rather believe what Hudson said the FBI did to the chart or the actual chart?

[Wiseguy]

Who's "everyone?" And what exactly is Hudson's "agenda?" Whatever you think of the paper, it's citing the FBI as a source. So it's really the FBI we're talking about.

See the 2006 chart that I've posted above. Would you rather believe what Hudson said the FBI did to the chart or the actual chart?

I can't say what chart Hudson was looking at or if it was the exactly same chart as posted above. In any event, to my point, if you look at the spacing within the redacted areas in the chart above, you're looking at about the same number of members. Incidentally, there was another chart the Hamilton PD put out in 1997 (it might still be on this forum somewhere) that showed 34 members (though admittedly some known ones were missing).

[NickleCity]

I get it… but I specifically foia requested 2006 to see what Hudson was talking about. I do have a request for all FBI Buffalo family charts from 1974 - present… been waiting a long time and still have a long wait in front of me for them.

My only point is take anything Parlato or Hudson write/wrote with a grain of salt. I quote them from time to time... but I definitely understand they have an agenda.