What’s left of the mob nationally?

[Pogo The Clown]

Funny you mention arrogance since are not disagreeing with us but with the FBI and state and local authorities. It is the height of arrogance to think you are in a better position from behind your computer screen to know about the state of Buffalo over all of them. Especially in your case since you have a habit of disregarding what they say and just going with your own guesses and theories and being repeatedly being proven wrong in doing so.


Pogo

[Lupara]

Nickle is being reasonable here while you guys are acting spicy. Why do you care so much that some people would like to believe (with reasonable enough evidence) that there might still be something going on? It's a question left unanswered with sincerity.

That's just it. He's not being reasonable. Look how much he reads into a "No comment." Early on I thought Nickle was at least being semi-reasonable. But his post above smacks of the same wishful thinking that we've seen with other posters about other families (especially Detroit). You said it..."would like to believe." If you want to find something, that kills objectivity. Kids would like to believe there's really a Santa Claus up in the North Pole.

And there's "something going on" in lots of places. The assassin van thing in New Orleans was "something going on." Some old associates of the Pittsburgh family being charged with gambling is "something going on."

I totally visualize you ballbreaking a toddler telling him with a strict face that there's zero evidence of Santa Clause's existence and that he should stop believing in fairy tales and focus on the facts.

Speaking of fairy tales and facts, is there any evidence that Jesus ever existed?

As I said, some would like to believe that there's still some activity of the Buffalo family based on reasonable evidence (Violi's wiretaps). For some reason debunking this is such a huge matter of importance to the two of you that you're even upped it a notch now saying that he was just talking out his ass. Evidently LE saw it otherwise and took those statements seriously. Speaking about being unreasonable here..

Anyway, in case you haven't noticed, you aren't going to change people's minds just yet. You and Pogo just have to accept for the time being that Buffalo is a very viable, sophisticated, active and masculine family. Learn to cope with those facts. [emoji3]

[Wiseguy]

I totally visualize you ballbreaking a toddler telling him with a strict face that there's zero evidence of Santa Clause's existence and that he should stop believing in fairy tales and focus on the facts.

No, because they're kids. I assume all of us here are adults. At least technically.

Speaking of fairy tales and facts, is there any evidence that Jesus ever existed?

Yes, actually, but that's got nothing to do with the topic at hand.

For some reason debunking this is such a huge matter of importance to the two of you that you're even upped it a notch now saying that he was just talking out his ass.

I take exception to him saying the feds are saying something they're not.

Evidently LE saw it otherwise and took those statements seriously.

And now you're doing it.

Anyway, in case you haven't noticed, you aren't going to change people's minds just yet.

Oh, believe me, I'm used to people digging their heels in no matter how much evidence is thrown at them. People still second-guessing the feds, despite virtually always being wrong as a result, doesn't surprise me anymore. Pogo and I have been shown to be right on Detroit over the past 13 years. And Buffalo will be no different.

[SonnyBlackstein]

Funny you mention arrogance since are not disagreeing with us but with the FBI and state and local authorities. It is the height of arrogance to think you are in a better position from behind your computer screen to know about the state of Buffalo over all of them. Especially in your case since you have a habit of disregarding what they say and just going with your own guesses and theories and being repeatedly being proven wrong in doing so.


Pogo

Is that the case is it? Nice straw man there bud. Has not nor is my argument at any stage. Good work staying on point. 🥴

[Wiseguy]

Funny you mention arrogance since are not disagreeing with us but with the FBI and state and local authorities. It is the height of arrogance to think you are in a better position from behind your computer screen to know about the state of Buffalo over all of them. Especially in your case since you have a habit of disregarding what they say and just going with your own guesses and theories and being repeatedly being proven wrong in doing so.


Pogo

Is that the case is it? Nice straw man there bud. Has not nor is my argument at any stage. Good work staying on point. 🥴

No, before, the argument was the feds stance on Buffalo could be wrong in light of new evidence (based on Violi bust and wiretaps). Now, the argument is apparently they have changed their stance (based on their "No comment").

But, apparently, they'll never bring a case since Todaro is such a mastermind. The feds said the Buffalo mob's "organized crime activities didn't exist anymore" and "some had legitimate businesses" but I guess Todaro has them all fooled.

I you guys wonder why we get annoyed with this horseshit?

[Stroccos]

Funny you mention arrogance since are not disagreeing with us but with the FBI and state and local authorities. It is the height of arrogance to think you are in a better position from behind your computer screen to know about the state of Buffalo over all of them. Especially in your case since you have a habit of disregarding what they say and just going with your own guesses and theories and being repeatedly being proven wrong in doing so.


Pogo

Is that the case is it? Nice straw man there bud. Has not nor is my argument at any stage. Good work staying on point. 🥴

No, before, the argument was the feds stance on Buffalo could be wrong in light of new evidence (based on Violi bust and wiretaps). Now, the argument is apparently they have changed their stance (based on their "No comment").

But, apparently, they'll never bring a case since Todaro is such a mastermind. The feds said the Buffalo mob's "organized crime activities didn't exist anymore" and "some had legitimate businesses" but I guess Todaro has them all fooled.

I you guys wonder why we get annoyed with this horseshit?

1.It could be possible violi was full of crap
2. It could be possible Todaro is still the boss but doesn’t commit any criminal activity he just has the title
3 if Todaro was pizza man 99.99 of the time how would the feds catch him with out a wired ci? It’s not line the Buffalo fbi is going to throw millions of dollars to watch a pizza man 24/7

[Lupara]

I you guys wonder why we get annoyed with this horseshit?

Yes I do wonder why. You keep on going at it as if your campaigning for office.

Nickle and Sonny have been very reasonable and are open to the idea that you may be right, but for now want to simply entertain the idea that what Violi said to another made member has merit. I'm not ashamed to admit that I enjoy this idea as well as it would explain the situation in Canada better, which has been a clusterfuck for years now. My interpretation is that the members in Buffalo are semi-retired but still politically involved and with remaining influence in Canada through their Canadian crew that has continued its activities under the Buffalo banner. You refute this as well? Then there's no point discussing this any further.

[Pogo The Clown]

1.It could be possible violi was full of crap
2. It could be possible Todaro is still the boss but doesn’t commit any criminal activity he just has the title
3 if Todaro was pizza man 99.99 of the time how would the feds catch him with out a wired ci? It’s not line the Buffalo fbi is going to throw millions of dollars to watch a pizza man 24/7

This whole thing is a repeat of the Rochester situation. In that case we had a Boss (with ties to the Bonannos, Cleveland and possibly Buffalo) making a new member and it was cought on tape. Like Violi Marotta was soon indicted for dealing drugs. Like now people back then blew it all out of proportion and were using this minor bust, the "Boss" label and the induction as evidence that the Rochester family was still around and resurging.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://newsmine.org/content.php?ol=secu ... ia-man.txt

Cleveland mobster Anthony Delmonti couldn't believe what he was hearing.

In the summer of 1999, he was winding down a meeting in a hotel room with Rochester, N.Y., mob boss Tommy Marotta about laundering money and moving some cocaine. Delmonti also had a line on some contraband food stamps. They were planning some golf for later . . . then Marotta became curiously quiet.

He suggested "making" Delmonti on the spot.

Delmonti was floored. Get "straightened out" right here, right now? Marotta just stared, tightening his steel-blue eyes. He was the boss, he said. He could do whatever he wanted.

There had been discussions about officially making Delmonti a member of the Mafia. He had been a good "earner" for the Rochester arm of New York City's Bonanno family. Marotta had permission from Delmonti's Cleveland mob boss to make him. But what about the ceremony? Delmonti asked. The sponsor? Burning the holy card? The speeches in Sicilian?

Marotta waved it off. He was still on probation and not supposed to associate with any of the guys. The ceremony was unnecessary. Made guy Joe T. would be the sponsor. He explained to Delmonti what being "made" entailed, its privileges and responsibilities.

This family comes first. Even before Delmonti's own family. No other member could kill him without permission from Marotta. Delmonti would turn over all his earnings to Marotta. He would be getting a share of whatever the family was bringing in. No fooling with drugs. Delmonti was never to mess with the wives or girlfriends of any other made guys. That was sacred. No made guys would ever mess with Delmonti's wife or girlfriend.

Delmonti was in shock. Marotta was a legend. An old-school wiseguy. He did nine years on a racketeering violation in 1987 and survived two different attempts on his life in 1983. He caught eight bullets from a .22 and was still walking.

And now he was officially bringing Delmonti into the family. Emotionally, Delmonti was all over the map. He was awed and humbled. It was something he never expected to happen. It was a wiseguy's dream come true.

Marotta got up from his chair and embraced Delmonti, kissing him on both cheeks. It was done. Marotta said there would be a reception later. Told him to bring his appetite. Pressed for time, Marotta said he had another appointment and left the room.

Delmonti sat dazed for a minute. He went to unlock the door that opened to the adjoining room. He paused, savoring what had just happened. He took a breath, opening the door wide.

"That's riiiiigght!" he said to the five FBI agents who were there with the video equipment. "I'm the big boss now. You saw it."

The agents cheered and high-fived Delmonti. They jokingly kissed his ring and laughed. He was already an outstanding informant. But this was unprecedented. An FBI informant being "made" by a mob boss. And it was all on tape. It was one of the undercover coups of all time. Delmonti was pumped.

[Stroccos]

1.It could be possible violi was full of crap
2. It could be possible Todaro is still the boss but doesn’t commit any criminal activity he just has the title
3 if Todaro was pizza man 99.99 of the time how would the feds catch him with out a wired ci? It’s not line the Buffalo fbi is going to throw millions of dollars to watch a pizza man 24/7

This whole thing is a repeat of the Rochester situation. In that case we had a Boss (with ties to the Bonannos, Cleveland and possibly Buffalo) making a new member and it was cought on tape. Like Violi Marotta was soon indicted for dealing drugs. Like now people back then blew it all out of proportion and were using this minor bust, the "Boss" label and the induction as evidence that the Rochester family was still around and resurging.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://newsmine.org/content.php?ol=secu ... ia-man.txt

Cleveland mobster Anthony Delmonti couldn't believe what he was hearing.

In the summer of 1999, he was winding down a meeting in a hotel room with Rochester, N.Y., mob boss Tommy Marotta about laundering money and moving some cocaine. Delmonti also had a line on some contraband food stamps. They were planning some golf for later . . . then Marotta became curiously quiet.

He suggested "making" Delmonti on the spot.

Delmonti was floored. Get "straightened out" right here, right now? Marotta just stared, tightening his steel-blue eyes. He was the boss, he said. He could do whatever he wanted.

There had been discussions about officially making Delmonti a member of the Mafia. He had been a good "earner" for the Rochester arm of New York City's Bonanno family. Marotta had permission from Delmonti's Cleveland mob boss to make him. But what about the ceremony? Delmonti asked. The sponsor? Burning the holy card? The speeches in Sicilian?

Marotta waved it off. He was still on probation and not supposed to associate with any of the guys. The ceremony was unnecessary. Made guy Joe T. would be the sponsor. He explained to Delmonti what being "made" entailed, its privileges and responsibilities.

This family comes first. Even before Delmonti's own family. No other member could kill him without permission from Marotta. Delmonti would turn over all his earnings to Marotta. He would be getting a share of whatever the family was bringing in. No fooling with drugs. Delmonti was never to mess with the wives or girlfriends of any other made guys. That was sacred. No made guys would ever mess with Delmonti's wife or girlfriend.

Delmonti was in shock. Marotta was a legend. An old-school wiseguy. He did nine years on a racketeering violation in 1987 and survived two different attempts on his life in 1983. He caught eight bullets from a .22 and was still walking.

And now he was officially bringing Delmonti into the family. Emotionally, Delmonti was all over the map. He was awed and humbled. It was something he never expected to happen. It was a wiseguy's dream come true.

Marotta got up from his chair and embraced Delmonti, kissing him on both cheeks. It was done. Marotta said there would be a reception later. Told him to bring his appetite. Pressed for time, Marotta said he had another appointment and left the room.

Delmonti sat dazed for a minute. He went to unlock the door that opened to the adjoining room. He paused, savoring what had just happened. He took a breath, opening the door wide.

"That's riiiiigght!" he said to the five FBI agents who were there with the video equipment. "I'm the big boss now. You saw it."

The agents cheered and high-fived Delmonti. They jokingly kissed his ring and laughed. He was already an outstanding informant. But this was unprecedented. An FBI informant being "made" by a mob boss. And it was all on tape. It was one of the undercover coups of all time. Delmonti was pumped.

That’s a good comparison . I agree with you pogo . And what a big joke delmonti getting made was . To bad he died we could of got him on this board he fit right I. With the giamcos. Tony could tell some tales .

[Confederate]

It's really very simple: Either Violi is a bullshitting exaggerator trying to impress someone or he is telling the truth about being the underboss of a 30 man Family, part of whom is in Canada. It really comes down to Violi's word against the Feds. Violi would have more of a motive to exaggerate and brag to someone than the Feds. Like I said earlier in this thread, when the new F.B.I. Director took over in the Chicago office, he said they had not forgotten about the Outfit and would put a final nail in their Coffin (I'm just paraphrasing from memory). The new F.B.I. agent in Buffalo didn't even mention any Buffalo Family as being any kind of priority. That's the thing that stands out for me more than what Violi said on tape because a lot of these sociopath Mob guys are big exaggerators/and or liars.
So who do you believe, Violi or the Feds? That is the bottom line. lol

[johnny_scootch]

Back to this argument again huh? It's like merry go round with the same 6 people riding in circles.
I commend you all for your persistence.

[Lupara]

It's really very simple: Either Violi is a bullshitting exaggerator trying to impress someone or he is telling the truth about being the underboss of a 30 man Family, part of whom is in Canada. It really comes down to Violi's word against the Feds. Violi would have more of a motive to exaggerate and brag to someone than the Feds. Like I said earlier in this thread, when the new F.B.I. Director took over in the Chicago office, he said they had not forgotten about the Outfit and would put a final nail in their Coffin (I'm just paraphrasing from memory). The new F.B.I. agent in Buffalo didn't even mention any Buffalo Family as being any kind of priority. That's the thing that stands out for me more than what Violi said on tape because a lot of these sociopath Mob guys are big exaggerators/and or liars.
So who do you believe, Violi or the Feds? That is the bottom line. lol

Being pathological liars is in their blood. But would it be a smart thing for Violi to make up such bold claims to a member of the Five Families, even claiming the Commission approved of his promotion? I think it would be pretty damn stupid. He could've been called to explain himself and who knows how that would've ended for him.

Anyway, even putting Buffalo's viability aside, the Violis as confirmed members of LCN working closely with the Bonannos is already interesting enough.

[Pogo The Clown]

What is more likely, that Violi was simply exaggerating and or hyping himself up with the "30 guy's" comment or that Buffalo has doubled its membership since 2006 all under the noses of the FBI and state and local LE at a time when every other family in the country has either shrunk or remained stagnant?


Pogo

[Wiseguy]

My interpretation is that the members in Buffalo are semi-retired but still politically involved and with remaining influence in Canada through their Canadian crew that has continued its activities under the Buffalo banner. You refute this as well? Then there's no point discussing this any further.

Some of that might be true, though you guys keep talking like the Canadian faction has been so active when it hasn't. Most of the remaining members are in the U.S. And, if you look at what cases there have been over the past 20 years, basically all of it has been on the U.S. side too. Without that single drug bust and Violi caught on tape, we're not even having this debate. And I'd be willing to bet the Musitano, Ivarone, and Luppino murders are connected to the Canadian fighting and have little at all to do with Buffalo.

It's really very simple: Either Violi is a bullshitting exaggerator trying to impress someone or he is telling the truth about being the underboss of a 30 man Family, part of whom is in Canada. It really comes down to Violi's word against the Feds. Violi would have more of a motive to exaggerate and brag to someone than the Feds. Like I said earlier in this thread, when the new F.B.I. Director took over in the Chicago office, he said they had not forgotten about the Outfit and would put a final nail in their Coffin (I'm just paraphrasing from memory). The new F.B.I. agent in Buffalo didn't even mention any Buffalo Family as being any kind of priority. That's the thing that stands out for me more than what Violi said on tape because a lot of these sociopath Mob guys are big exaggerators/and or liars.
So who do you believe, Violi or the Feds? That is the bottom line. lol

For the record, Sallet got bumped up to Associate Executive Assistant Director of the Finance and Facilities Division last month. Makes sense considering he started out as an accountant before joining the FBI. And accounting was a prime reason he got Massino, Cantarella, etc.

[scagghiuni]

fbi anyway knows little of canadian mob, that's sure, they dont even know all the bonanno members in montreal