Sammy the bull

[NickyEyes1]

hang it up Nicky time to go home

Agreed. I have nothing but the utmost respect for every organized crime member in New York.

No respect from me, most are scumbags. But not being a wimp and being a scumbag are not mutually exclusive

[gohnjotti]

hang it up Nicky time to go home

Agreed. I have nothing but the utmost respect for every organized crime member in New York.

No respect from me, most are scumbags. But not being a wimp and being a scumbag are not mutually exclusive

Would you call them scumbags to their face, though? That was your argument.

And all arguments aside, I agree but most accounts show that LoCascio took a lot of abuse from Gotti without doing a thing about it. The oranges thing in prison in an example.

[Confederate]

hang it up Nicky time to go home

Agreed. I have nothing but the utmost respect for every organized crime member in New York.

No respect from me, most are scumbags. But not being a wimp and being a scumbag are not mutually exclusive

Would you call them scumbags to their face, though? That was your argument.

And all arguments aside, I agree but most accounts show that LoCascio took a lot of abuse from Gotti without doing a thing about it. The oranges thing in prison in an example.

In reality, nobody is going to have a chance to say ANYTHING to any of these guys to their face. LOL
That being said, my opinion is that Gravano was the wimp who could dish it out but couldn't take it.
Not saying Locasio was a great a guy, but the fact that he did the time speaks VOLUMES over Gravano.

[gohnjotti]

hang it up Nicky time to go home

Agreed. I have nothing but the utmost respect for every organized crime member in New York.

No respect from me, most are scumbags. But not being a wimp and being a scumbag are not mutually exclusive

Would you call them scumbags to their face, though? That was your argument.

And all arguments aside, I agree but most accounts show that LoCascio took a lot of abuse from Gotti without doing a thing about it. The oranges thing in prison in an example.

In reality, nobody is going to have a chance to say ANYTHING to any of these guys to their face. LOL
That being said, my opinion is that Gravano was the wimp who could dish it out but couldn't take it.
Not saying Locasio was a great a guy, but the fact that he did the time speaks VOLUMES over Gravano.

Can’t argue with that at all Confederate.
“Let me see you say that to his face though.”

[Frank]

I’d hardly call Frank LoCascio a wimp.

I don't like LoCascio and his son, because they had Patsy Parillo's son killed. I thought that was pretty low of them. Even though I don't know these people and they are all crooks and murderers, I think that was not right. LoCascio's son was being out of line in Parillo's place of business.

[Angelo Santino]

Re Gravano's 1999 Drug Ring, was there ever a list of accomplices? 35-46 people were charged I believe.

Gravano
Debra Gravano - Laundering through Uncle Sal's?
Gerard Gravano
Karen Gravano
Michael Papa - Chief Lieutenant; leader of Devil Dogs street gang
Jovan Isailovic
David Seabrock - said to be only AA member of MD, but also Karen Gravano's baby daddy.
Dominick Sirico

[AlexfromSouth]

Re Gravano's 1999 Drug Ring, was there ever a list of accomplices? 35-46 people were charged I believe.

Gravano
Debra Gravano - Laundering through Uncle Sal's?
Gerard Gravano
Karen Gravano
Michael Papa - Chief Lieutenant; leader of Devil Dogs street gang
Jovan Isailovic
David Seabrock - said to be only AA member of MD, but also Karen Gravano's baby daddy.
Dominick Sirico

Who is Jovan Isailovic?

[Jeff]

Good question by the OP. Gravano had some legitimate reasons to be unhappy with Gotti but I think at the end of the day most guys who cooperate are looking for any excuse to do so.

One thing I always wondered about is (hypothetically) whether or not Gravano would have eventually made a move on Gotti had they not be indicted in 1990.

[bronx]

my opinion..is yes..unless sam killed all of his guys first..then nobody to help him.

[Angelo Santino]

my opinion..is yes..unless sam killed all of his guys first..then nobody to help him.

The Underboss depicts a self-reflecting Gravano yearning to stay in the shadows, always being "fair" with people and fervently hoping "John Gotti's Cosa Nostra goes back to the real Cosa Nostra." This sorta contrasts with their camera appearances together. Granted Gravano detailed holding the umbrella in his book as a show of respect, you can still see in photos and video his idolization for Gotti. It's in the eyes. Appeared to me like he was smitten with Gotti. Any thoughts on that?

[JeremyTheJew]

my opinion..is yes..unless sam killed all of his guys first..then nobody to help him.

The Underboss depicts a self-reflecting Gravano yearning to stay in the shadows, always being "fair" with people and fervently hoping "John Gotti's Cosa Nostra goes back to the real Cosa Nostra." This sorta contrasts with their camera appearances together. Granted Gravano detailed holding the umbrella in his book as a show of respect, you can still see in photos and video his idolization for Gotti. It's in the eyes. Appeared to me like he was smitten with Gotti. Any thoughts on that?

i agree bc i feel it was gotti who really gave him his power. yes he was around Paul as well but not influential at that time.

it is interesting even Scars said Gravano was the most scary person he ever met.

what about his claim to kill gotti if they won.... I think he deff wanted to... but i dont think he'd be able to actually doit

[SILENT PARTNERZ]

IMO Gravano was a smart, sly, treacherous and self-serving hood.
He sidled up to Gotti when he saw the benefit in the situation for
himself. Same when he opened the '19' business' that Gotti complained
about in the tapes. Gravano had DeeBee killed for his own financial benefit, not for
any supposed 'insubordination' bullshit. Every move Gravano made
was about the success of Gravano. Not success for Gotti, or the Gambino's.
This type of self interest can be said about most of the mob guys. Especially
the new Americanized generations. As far as whether he would have
tried to kill of Gotti and his supporters? Gotti had many brothers and
a son in the family. Gravano would had to have had support and assistance
from other Gambino heavies to pull off any kind of 'Gotti crew extermination'.
IF Gravano, et al were able to kill off Gotti and his supporters, then so many murders
would have to take place, that LE would end up jailing many if not all of the
conspirators. It could have caused an internecine war like the Colombo war did.
Eventually, decimating the Gambino Family.

[jimmy_beans8]

I still trying to figga where Frankie loc pops up from,,,,,seemed to come outta nowhere to make it to 3rd

[JeremyTheJew]

IMO Gravano was a smart, sly, treacherous and self-serving hood.
He sidled up to Gotti when he saw the benefit in the situation for
himself. Same when he opened the '19' business' that Gotti complained
about in the tapes. Gravano had DeeBee killed for his own financial benefit, not for
any supposed 'insubordination' bullshit. Every move Gravano made
was about the success of Gravano. Not success for Gotti, or the Gambino's.
This type of self interest can be said about most of the mob guys. Especially
the new Americanized generations. As far as whether he would have
tried to kill of Gotti and his supporters? Gotti had many brothers and
a son in the family. Gravano would had to have had support and assistance
from other Gambino heavies to pull off any kind of 'Gotti crew extermination'.
IF Gravano, et al were able to kill off Gotti and his supporters, then so many murders
would have to take place, that LE would end up jailing many if not all of the
conspirators. It could have caused an internecine war like the Colombo war did.
Eventually, decimating the Gambino Family.

makes me think of the Barbra Walters interview he did. he told her before he flipped he made a list of everyone he was gonna have to kill when he got out starting w gotti. but he said the list went up to 12 people and continued.

[Wiseguy]

IMO Gravano was a smart, sly, treacherous and self-serving hood.
He sidled up to Gotti when he saw the benefit in the situation for
himself. Same when he opened the '19' business' that Gotti complained
about in the tapes. Gravano had DeeBee killed for his own financial benefit, not for
any supposed 'insubordination' bullshit. Every move Gravano made
was about the success of Gravano. Not success for Gotti, or the Gambino's.
This type of self interest can be said about most of the mob guys. Especially
the new Americanized generations. As far as whether he would have
tried to kill of Gotti and his supporters? Gotti had many brothers and
a son in the family. Gravano would had to have had support and assistance
from other Gambino heavies to pull off any kind of 'Gotti crew extermination'.
IF Gravano, et al were able to kill off Gotti and his supporters, then so many murders
would have to take place, that LE would end up jailing many if not all of the
conspirators. It could have caused an internecine war like the Colombo war did.
Eventually, decimating the Gambino Family.

makes me think of the Barbra Walters interview he did. he told her before he flipped he made a list of everyone he was gonna have to kill when he got out starting w gotti. but he said the list went up to 12 people and continued.

It was Primetime with Diane Sawyer.