Pre Sabella's

[Antiliar]

Didn't Bill Bonanno say he was inducted with a gun and a knife?

[Angelo Santino]

Ok, another possible connection.

Joseph "Bruno" Locascio, murdered in 1925. US born, parents from Messina. (I can't read the town's name but it's close to Novara where Avena was born.) Before he was killed he served a prison sentence for narcotics and one of the people he wrote was a "John Dinatale" at 735 Christian St. This could potentially be John Avena that he wrote to. Wasn't Avena suspected of being involved in narcotics?

[bronx]

Chris.. any relation to frank loc?

[B.]

Interesting. I was searching around in Chester and encountered quite a bit of Scarfo surnames living there. Not sure the connection if any but I did notice that Scarfo was later "technically" in that crew was he not?

The Chester crew or Piccolo (Philly) crew? We know he was in the Skinny DiTullio/AC crew by the 1960s, but it's not clear to me if he was originally made into that crew. FBI reports have him working in numbers under his uncle Piccolo and asking to quit that job, which is granted and he goes on to bartend in AC while still living in Philly. So he may have originally been under his uncle in the 1950s to early 60s but he definitely wasn't with the Chester crew at any point. After DiTullio's death he was under Iezzi, who had AC interests himself.

The top Calabrian as we stated in Scopelliti but he was out of the picture by 1928 after an attempted murder on his life and moving to Atlantic City. The names we have are Domenico Festa, Joe Sciglitano Snr, Demetrio Pennestri and Giuseppe Perugino of Chester; Angelo Cherico, Frank Piccolo (not sure of/if a relation), Mike Romeo, Joe Rugnetta, Joe Ida and Rocco DiCondina. There's also Marco Reginelli who would have fallen under this faction. Also perhaps Ignazio Amato, Frank Greco and Frank Serno but I can't find records on them. Joe Caro was arrested in 1927 so I don't think the one from Stowe is the same guy. This Joe Caro appears to be involved early on, as do alot of these individuals. Arguably eastern Sicilians fell under this network too: John Avena, Joe Bruno, Eduard Caminiti, Luigi Quaranta. Who Avena made, others made I have no idea.

Frank Piccolo was actually Sicilian, so no relation to other Piccolos. I want to say Messinese, though, so that could still put him with this group if the Messinesi were as closely aligned with the Calabrians as we're thinking. Angelo Cherico was said to have been originally part of the Lanzetti gang, so he wouldn't have been aligned with the formal family until the mid-to-late 1930s. At least a couple future members started out with the Lanzettis. Curious if they convinced them to turn on the Lanzettis or if they were brought in after the conflict was settled. I know Riccobene was suspected of at least one Lanzetti murder.

Did you see the article above about Pennestri being involved in prostitution? That makes Bruno, Ida and Rugnetta.

Yeah, all of that makes it even more questionable that Saverio Rugnetta was killed for being involved in prostitution. These guys who were arguably more involved in the organization (whether made or not at the time) got by seemingly without issue (or at least not being gunned down), so there must be more to the story than Rugnetta being killed for prostitution.

Yes but he faded in 1928 with the attempt on his life. Potentially Sabella and Scopelliti may have been out of power in 1928 if one scenario is correct. I keep coming back to the Zanghi hit because I feel it has more significance than previously suspected. We may never know the true details, but there's something there. If there's any credence to Sabella and Scopelliti suffering reprisals as a result of this hit: it was either due to the heat and exposure, or Zanghi was significant enough and possibly even a member.

What have you found on Scopelliti fading post-1928 aside from his move to AC and his name not showing up? JD posted a photo and little bio on Scopelliti some time back (might have been the last board) and I vaguely recall him mentioning him falling out as well, but I can't remember the details. Just wondering if there is concrete info on Scopelliti losing standing in the organization or if it's just assumed based on circumstance. Is it possible he willingly kept a lower profile because of the Zanghi hit?

If Sabella was deposed as a result of the hit, the question would be... who deposed him and why? Various bosses in different cities have handled hits poorly and while it may have reflected poorly on him, would the membership have been "allowed" to vote to take him down , if it's even possible for the membership to do that for that reason? Did D'Aquila take him down before he died? Did Masseria break him down? We can't answer this, but I don't really buy the idea that he was deposed solely for his handling of the Zanghi hit. I also don't buy that he was taken down as part of the so-called "re-structuring" of 1931, either, obviously. Maybe a little bit of one, a bit of the other. You just have to wonder who exactly would have deposed him if he indeed was deposed.

Which if true means Ida was a member before 1930 (reasonable). Ida followed Bruno to Bristol so the two men were close. It appears under Bruno Reginelli was underboss.

Did you know in 1939 there was another internal Philadelphia mafia war? Anthony Piccarelli, Nicholas Bartilucci, Danny 'Day' Deodato and Frank Piccolo were casualties of this war. Riccobene claims he moved to Bristol with Bruno for safety. He never explains the reasons/background for this war. According to Morello after this war Joe Bruno was pretty much without power, leaving Reginelli and the captains free to do as they'd like until his death. Do you know any more about this?

Where did you see that Reginelli was Bruno's underboss? That seems too early, but maybe you've seen something.

Frank Piccolo's murder was said to be for some sort of infraction or breaking of unspecified rule(s), curious about the other associates you mentioned. This would have been following the war with the Lanzettis, and if this was a war, it looks like the Philly family had three "wars" between the late 1920s through the late 1930s. In line with some of our conversations, though, none of these appear to have been between Sicilians and Calabrians/mainlanders... the first two conflicts involved high-profile Sicilian and Calabrian mafiosi collaborating against independents, and it doesn't seem this issue with Piccolo was ethnically-based either.

Another conflict was based in Camden in the mid-1950s. Soldier Manny Gottobrio was killed, and before this associate Tony "Battles" DiBenedetto and I believe at least one other associate were killed. There had apparently been problems building for some time in that territory, with Gottobrio and possibly the other murdered associates trying to usurp some of the Camden rackets that had formerly been under Reginelli's control. I don't think I've ever seen any suspects ID'd, but it was believed to have been sanctioned by the organization.

[Angelo Santino]

Frank Piccolo was actually Sicilian, so no relation to other Piccolos. I want to say Messinese, though, so that could still put him with this group if the Messinesi were as closely aligned with the Calabrians as we're thinking. Angelo Cherico was said to have been originally part of the Lanzetti gang, so he wouldn't have been aligned with the formal family until the mid-to-late 1930s. At least a couple future members started out with the Lanzettis. Curious if they convinced them to turn on the Lanzettis or if they were brought in after the conflict was settled. I know Riccobene was suspected of at least one Lanzetti murder.

I'm kinda beginning to think the Messinese were a pretty compact group. They do appear to be very close with the Calabresi but... err... they seem to be their own pretty compact unit unto themselves. And I know enough to know I don't know anything. At this point I'd put the Lanzetti's as potential Philadelphia associates that were in the Scopelliti-Avena faction, same with Zanghi who may have even been a member. In fact I read somewhere that Calabrians Scopelliti was arrested with earlier would later become members of the Lanzetti's. Again, it's all up in the air right now from my viewpoint.

Yeah, all of that makes it even more questionable that Saverio Rugnetta was killed for being involved in prostitution. These guys who were arguably more involved in the organization (whether made or not at the time) got by seemingly without issue (or at least not being gunned down), so there must be more to the story than Rugnetta being killed for prostitution.

Agreed.

What have you found on Scopelliti fading post-1928 aside from his move to AC and his name not showing up? JD posted a photo and little bio on Scopelliti some time back (might have been the last board) and I vaguely recall him mentioning him falling out as well, but I can't remember the details. Just wondering if there is concrete info on Scopelliti losing standing in the organization or if it's just assumed based on circumstance. Is it possible he willingly kept a lower profile because of the Zanghi hit?

You know you're right, I stand corrected. He could have vacated his position and moved. Very possible.

If Sabella was deposed as a result of the hit, the question would be... who deposed him and why? Various bosses in different cities have handled hits poorly and while it may have reflected poorly on him, would the membership have been "allowed" to vote to take him down , if it's even possible for the membership to do that for that reason? Did D'Aquila take him down before he died? Did Masseria break him down? We can't answer this, but I don't really buy the idea that he was deposed solely for his handling of the Zanghi hit. I also don't buy that he was taken down as part of the so-called "re-structuring" of 1931, either, obviously. Maybe a little bit of one, a bit of the other. You just have to wonder who exactly would have deposed him if he indeed was deposed.

This is why I'm curious who Zanghi was. The guy had some pull, he was apparently paid 25 to 50k to change his testimony and still have NYC contacts. If Zanghi was made that could have a full range of ramifications. However, I do suspect there's credence to Sabella being forced down due to external factors. Perhaps he was too close to Maranzano and was forced to step down like Scalici was. All it would take is Traina to come down, he's probably who demoted Rugnetta in the 1950's.

Where did you see that Reginelli was Bruno's underboss? That seems too early, but maybe you've seen something.

Book 2, page 170:
"Bruno could fully appreciate his role in the shadows of the Philadelphia-South Jersey Family, appearing rarely in South Philadelphia and lurking confidently behind his underboss and captains who seldom mentioned his name as a threatening force. One heard the name of "Marco Reginelli" instead, giving rise to the myth that Reginelli was the boss, not Bruno."

I guess upon rereading it it could be ambiguous, she's not directly calling him Underboss only saying that his name was more well known. I don't know but he was allegedly a member before 1930 so it's plausible.

Frank Piccolo's murder was said to be for some sort of infraction or breaking of unspecified rule(s), curious about the other associates you mentioned. This would have been following the war with the Lanzettis, and if this was a war, it looks like the Philly family had three "wars" between the late 1920s through the late 1930s. In line with some of our conversations, though, none of these appear to have been between Sicilians and Calabrians/mainlanders... the first two conflicts involved high-profile Sicilian and Calabrian mafiosi collaborating against independents, and it doesn't seem this issue with Piccolo was ethnically-based either.

You know more than I do. I have to research it. Appreciate any help.

Another conflict was based in Camden in the mid-1950s. Soldier Manny Gottobrio was killed, and before this associate Tony "Battles" DiBenedetto and I believe at least one other associate were killed. There had apparently been problems building for some time in that territory, with Gottobrio and possibly the other murdered associates trying to usurp some of the Camden rackets that had formerly been under Reginelli's control. I don't think I've ever seen any suspects ID'd, but it was believed to have been sanctioned by the organization.

Again I did not know that. Pretty awesome... I think the most we'll ever be able to do is get a list of murders and trace the victims ancestry which may give us a clue over who was going ah matz with who. We'll never know the reasons unless more specific info comes out from an inside source. Something was going on in the 1920's, alot of Messinesi were being killed. And then a Messinese becomes boss. I'm not saying there's something to that it's just "one of those things" like why every other Philly mobster changed his surname to Bruno.

[B.]

Yeah, I wouldn't trust Morello re: Reginelli as Bruno's underboss. It does sound like she' saying that, but her whole statement is almost exactly what she also says about Reginelli's relationship with Joe Ida when he was boss, which fits known info much more closely. It's likely that Reginelli even as a captain (assuming that was his position under Bruno) was a more well-known, feared name than Bruno, so that fits if it's what she's saying.

Here's the doc where the informant claims there weren't underbosses or captains until Joe Bruno became boss in 1936, with the boss being in "sole command": https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.htm ... lPageId=29

The same doc/informant claims Sabella was removed as boss in 1930.

However, this informant (unmade but highly connected associate) claims Joe Bruno was Avena's underboss and that Avena was boss as early as 1926, which is not correct so that brings the Bruno = underboss info even more into question: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.htm ... lPageId=13

[Angelo Santino]

Yeah, I wouldn't trust Morello re: Reginelli as Bruno's underboss. It does sound like she' saying that, but her whole statement is almost exactly what she also says about Reginelli's relationship with Joe Ida when he was boss, which fits known info much more closely. It's likely that Reginelli even as a captain (assuming that was his position under Bruno) was a more well-known, feared name than Bruno, so that fits if it's what she's saying.

Here's the doc where the informant claims there weren't underbosses or captains until Joe Bruno became boss in 1936, with the boss being in "sole command": https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.htm ... lPageId=29

The same doc/informant claims Sabella was removed as boss in 1930.

However, this informant (unmade but highly connected associate) claims Joe Bruno was Avena's underboss and that Avena was boss as early as 1926, which is not correct so that brings the Bruno = underboss info even more into question: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.htm ... lPageId=13

Reginelli noted. You've looked into this and I trust your judgement.

Regarding no captains/underbosses, it needs to be said that an informant stated that but it's highly unlikely given that "Philadelphia" was a multi-state group spanning multiple cities. If it were 20 guys within 2 square miles it would be much more likely. Families with smaller numbers don't need to compartmentalize as much. It's similar to the 5 Family set up in 1931, how did Masseria and Maranzano dominant 600 and 400 soldiers if not without a bullhorn?

These informants seem to have their dates and specifics mixed up. Fair enough. I don't have anything that can prove one way or the other. Joe Ida followed Bruno to Bristol and then to Jersey and appeared to be in his inner circle. Makes me wonder if he was consig but then we don't even know if that position existed before Rugnetta.

[B.]

Never considered Ida as a potential consigliere earlier on but I could see it. I would guess he was at least a captain and maybe admin member. I'd have to double check but I believe I've seen him mentioned as an underboss to Bruno. Still funny to me he wanted to be a Calabria-based capodecina of the Philly family in his old age.

We do have at least one source claiming that Dominick Oliveto was the consigliere before Reginelli died and Oliveto then assumed the role of underboss, which fits what we know about Oliveto's stature at the time.

Given that Reginelli looks to have gotten his push from Ida, I really am starting to wonder if that whole group from Camden were brought around the organization by Ida. If so, Ida's early influence in the organization went far beyond his later role as a "figurehead boss."

[Angelo Santino]

Scafidi ID'd Reginelli as a pre-1930 member and if Ida "brought him around" then it stands that Ida's membership predates Reginelli's. What's the intel that he owes his place to Ida?

[B.]

Scafidi ID'd Reginelli as a pre-1930 member and if Ida "brought him around" then it stands that Ida's membership predates Reginelli's. What's the intel that he owes his place to Ida?

Morello goes into it a bit in one of her books and claims he sponsored him into the family, something along those lines. Not sure her source on it but I tend to trust the overall point she's making. I'm trying not to cherry pick her info that fits my view of things and reject the stuff that doesn't, though.

[Angelo Santino]

She also claims Ida depended on Bruno because he was Sicilian and could get places as Ida could not. If the 1927 hit showed everything it showed a closely linked criminal underworld full of players who knew each other and got along until they didn't. I'm on Book 3 where she goes into it and I'll read what she says.

[Angelo Santino]

I didn't see it in there. She starts going into his background on page 46 in Book 3. It's interesting, connected to Luciano and Anastasia, his lawyer later on was the former campaign manager for the Nixon campaign. But I'm seeing no description of the Ida-Reginelli relationship other than that his "place in the LCN was secured by his loyalty to his boss Joe Ida and his fellow paesani like Massi and DiTullio" with no examples or sources.

*Update: Page 68: "Marco, the underboss to Joe Bruno and Ida, was a known killer..."

This isn't a gotcha, if you feel this is incorrect, like I said, the things Morello said need to be reevaluated much like William Balsamo's would if nothing else had ever been published on NYC. Not because she's a liar but because she's biased in favor of western Sicilians portraying them with admirable qualities spinning their crimes as part of some deeprooted culture (that she tries to legitimize) whereas everyone else is a shitbag criminal who ruined the Mafia with their mainland ways. It all appears to be joined much earlier than she stated. And to ignore these other factions would be like someone focusing exclusively on the early Corleonesi element of the Genoveses and ignoring Yale, Dyke and the other factions.

Another thing, beginning in 1908, Sabella spent 3 years at Milan prison for murder. If he (or any other Sicilian) did time, it was with Italians from various regions. He would have been introduced to and around Calabrians, Neapolitans, Abruzzesi since they probably have criminals there too, Triesti etc. Sabella, like Stanfa, seem to have gained attributes that I don't see. Was he really that clannish, that turned off to people of other Italian origins? We have her word to go on only. And in her world if Sabella and Ida were both caught burning down different buildings the narratives would read: "Sabella, rappresentante, took actions into his own hands for unknown reasons. Was he shown disrespect? Did the Boss feel he had to send a message? This Sicilian proverb probably explains the western Sicilian Mafioso Sabella's reasoning: 'if a man takes your bread, take his life,'" and then jump to Ida, "a pimp from the mainland of Italy where there was never a Mafia culture was caught in a lowly act of blowing up a building without care of the lives he endangered, actions like these were common among the lowly ruffian element, it would be 10 years before this generic Italian gangster would join the American LCN under Boss John Avena." That's the narrative of her books.

[B.]

Maybe Reginelli was an underboss under Bruno, probably toward the later end if anything. If so, it's interesting that Ida would then jump over him and become boss while Reginelli stayed underboss yet had the street boss power.

I am sure she talks about Reginelli and Ida's relationship in a paragraph in book 2 or 3. I'll revisit it soon when I have some time.

Very interesting about Sabella doing time in Milan and possibly giving him connections or at least making him more comfortable with mainland criminals. Too true about the way Morello would interpret Sabella vs. Ida doing the same action, haha.

[Angelo Santino]

Maybe Reginelli was an underboss under Bruno, probably toward the later end if anything. If so, it's interesting that Ida would then jump over him and become boss while Reginelli stayed underboss yet had the street boss power.

Yeah, with what little information we have anything is possible. However, it states (without sources) that Bruno, Ida, Reginelli all had ties to Anastasia. Perhaps he had a hand in elevating or recommending this faction? We keep hearing about Anastasia in the 50's and it leads me to believe there's something there. As for Ida, Anastasia and Calabria, I do have my thoughts on that, we'll talk once I get everything compiled.

Very interesting about Sabella doing time in Milan and possibly giving him connections or at least making him more comfortable with mainland criminals. Too true about the way Morello would interpret Sabella vs. Ida doing the same action, haha.

The Bourbon prison system sent inmates all over. If you were from Palermo and committed a crime there was no guarantee you'd end up in a Palermo or Sicilian prison. Those with better connections (bosses) did hold some influence in where they were sent but were still around people from other areas. So atrocious violence aside, the other aspect was prison served as a networking opportunity. The same thing occurred in American Federal prisons in the 10's and 20's.