Was this in reds book? I don't recall reading this partAntiliar wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:23 pm I'm not saying that Lombardo wasn't lying to Pat Spilotro, but it is possible that he was telling the truth. Stranger things have happened. Red said that Cozzo couldn't succeed Lombardo because he wasn't made, instead it went to the guy "out west" (Eboli). Then when Eboli died, Schweihs said he was in charge.
Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
Moderator: Capos
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
I agree with phat,I love those old fucks and he's right.we all got some cosa nostra in us.I personnely love the life.I think we on the forum would be the ultimate crew! - camerono
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
Not that the ccc is always right but the 97 chart they had him alongside apes and andriacchi right below difronzo. He was definitely a player. This was the supposed consolidation time frame centracchio over grand Ave and west suburbs, andriacchi over elmwood park and rush street, and monteleone over Cicero and 26th street. Either way he must have been very important to be up there with those guys. His rico charges were based on the territory he took over for Eboli.Antiliar wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:01 pmI don't have confirmation from a reliable source that Centracchio was a capo, but I don't rule him out as a possibility. If he was, then he came after Eboli (died 1987) as acting capo of the Grand Avenue (Joey Lombardo) crew. How long did Centracchio hold the position? He died in 2001, but Lombardo was out of prison in 1992. In Patsy Spilotro's testimony in the Family Secrets trial, he said that Lombardo told him he had been shelved. If that's true, then Lombardo lost his position when he went to prison in the 1980s, which totally contradicts the narrative about him that most people believe. If Lombardo was shelved (and that's a big "if"), it could have been related to Aiuppa telling him he could have started a war when he told the St. Louis boss, Tony Giordano, to "shit or get off the pot" over Morris Shenker. What do you think?Pete wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:37 pmWhat about centracchio? I had him as a capoAntiliar wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:17 pm I have a completely different interpretation. Mine is like this (not necessarily complete):
Battaglia > Alderisio > Nicoletti > Lombardo > Eboli (acting) > Cozzo (maybe, acting) > Lombardo (out of prison) > Vena
Aiuppa > Ortenzi (possibly/not sure) > Carlisi > Eboli > Marcello
Buccieri > Torello > Ferriola > Infelise > Monteleone > Sarno > DeLaurentis
D'Andrea > Roti > Caruso > Angelo LaPietra > James LaPietra > Monteleone > Caruso
Accardo > Capezio > Cerone > Gagliano > DiFronzo > Magnifichi > Andriacchi
The territories overlapped. Aiuppa and Battaglia both operated in Melrose Park (so did Cerone for a while); Aiuppa and Buccieri both operated in Cicero; Accardo and Capezio operated in Grand Avenue and the later bosses moved to Elmwood Park; Battaglia operated in Chicago proper, parts of Melrose Park, parts of the North Side/Rush Street, and Stone Park (and probably a few other places), and under Lombardo it was Grand Avenue. Buccieri had a very large crew and some of it was later split off to Chinatown (the LaPietras, Monteleone, Calabrese, etc. were previously under Buccieri). That's not everything, but that's how I see it.
On the tapes joey told shenker to shit or get off the pot. I know he said you go to who you need to go to which might have been in reference to giordano. I have trouble believing they would be worried about a war with St. Louis lol. Any links to aiuppa telling joey this though?
I agree with phat,I love those old fucks and he's right.we all got some cosa nostra in us.I personnely love the life.I think we on the forum would be the ultimate crew! - camerono
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
I thought I read something in his book about it.Antiliar wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:23 pm I'm not saying that Lombardo wasn't lying to Pat Spilotro, but it is possible that he was telling the truth. Stranger things have happened. Red said that Cozzo couldn't succeed Lombardo because he wasn't made, instead it went to the guy "out west" (Eboli). Then when Eboli died, Schweihs said he was in charge.
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
Red saying that Cozzo wasn't made is on page 139 of his book.
Aiuppa chewing out Lombardo is here: https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/ ... 7018f0b784
Aiuppa chewing out Lombardo is here: https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/ ... 7018f0b784
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
So Pete, Frank, Confederate and the rest of you guys, do you agree with Snakes adviser definition and roles?Villain wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:50 pmIm cool with it, although i also have to see what the other fellas think regarding the D'Amico/Tornabene situation...i mean if the guy presented a ceremony...i dont know...i think your post makes senseSnakes wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:01 pm Senior Advisor: "Senior Advisor" is a mostly unofficial role that we have granted to an Outfit member, or members -- usually of high stature -- who report directly to the bosses and are used by them on an advisory basis. This position has sometimes been identified by law enforcement sources (particularly in recent years) as the "consigliere," despite the Outfit's traditional non-usage of that term. Oftentimes, these members are older, more experienced members who may be semi-retired or restricted from having other roles in the organization, due to parole restrictions, declining health, or other reasons. Due to the unofficial nature of this position, the dates and names listed below are to the best of our knowledge considering the available sources.
Villain, I can't find a place for Tornabene here. D'Amico is mentioned on Scott's site as taking over the consigliere spot in 2005 and relinquishing it (temporarily) to Andriacchi before gaining it back in 2015. I have definitely seen Scott refer to Tornabene as a "former" consigliere but believe he may be doing so in error. If not, perhaps he shared the spot with Gus Alex because the latter was out of town so often? He also officiated over the ceremony, although I'm really not sure. I'm fine with leaving it the way it is below without him, though.
Villain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:48 pm Senior Adviser
Paul Ricca 1948-1955 (became top boss)
Tony Accardo 1955 1971 (became top boss)
Gus Alex 1971 1992 (imprisoned)
Joey Lombardo 1992 2005 (imprisoned) / Angelo LaPietra 1995 1999 (died)
Marco D'Amico 2005 2012 (replaced)
Joe Andriacchi 2012 2015 (became top boss)
-John Matassa, Jr. 2014 2015 (acting for Andriacchi)
Marco D'Amico 2015 present (possibly joined by John Matassa, Jr.)
Do not be deceived, neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God - Corinthians 6:9-10
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
Yes I have recently read that about D'Amico taking that role over from Lombardo. But everywhere else I read Tornabene, with D'AMICO taking spot when Tornabene died. It's obvious Tornabene came out of retirement and had some position of authority. WAS seen meeting around town ,being chauffeured around by one of the Caruso's. Is it possible he was acting boss for Marcello for awhile?? I don't know. It's a tough call.Villain wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:15 amSo Pete, Frank, Confederate and the rest of you guys, do you agree with Snakes adviser definition and roles?Villain wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:50 pmIm cool with it, although i also have to see what the other fellas think regarding the D'Amico/Tornabene situation...i mean if the guy presented a ceremony...i dont know...i think your post makes senseSnakes wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:01 pm Senior Advisor: "Senior Advisor" is a mostly unofficial role that we have granted to an Outfit member, or members -- usually of high stature -- who report directly to the bosses and are used by them on an advisory basis. This position has sometimes been identified by law enforcement sources (particularly in recent years) as the "consigliere," despite the Outfit's traditional non-usage of that term. Oftentimes, these members are older, more experienced members who may be semi-retired or restricted from having other roles in the organization, due to parole restrictions, declining health, or other reasons. Due to the unofficial nature of this position, the dates and names listed below are to the best of our knowledge considering the available sources.
Villain, I can't find a place for Tornabene here. D'Amico is mentioned on Scott's site as taking over the consigliere spot in 2005 and relinquishing it (temporarily) to Andriacchi before gaining it back in 2015. I have definitely seen Scott refer to Tornabene as a "former" consigliere but believe he may be doing so in error. If not, perhaps he shared the spot with Gus Alex because the latter was out of town so often? He also officiated over the ceremony, although I'm really not sure. I'm fine with leaving it the way it is below without him, though.
Villain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:48 pm Senior Adviser
Paul Ricca 1948-1955 (became top boss)
Tony Accardo 1955 1971 (became top boss)
Gus Alex 1971 1992 (imprisoned)
Joey Lombardo 1992 2005 (imprisoned) / Angelo LaPietra 1995 1999 (died)
Marco D'Amico 2005 2012 (replaced)
Joe Andriacchi 2012 2015 (became top boss)
-John Matassa, Jr. 2014 2015 (acting for Andriacchi)
Marco D'Amico 2015 present (possibly joined by John Matassa, Jr.)
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
Yes tornabene was acting boss from 2001-2003. That was discussed on the marcello wiretapsFrank wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:24 amYes I have recently read that about D'Amico taking that role over from Lombardo. But everywhere else I read Tornabene, with D'AMICO taking spot when Tornabene died. It's obvious Tornabene came out of retirement and had some position of authority. WAS seen meeting around town ,being chauffeured around by one of the Caruso's. Is it possible he was acting boss for Marcello for awhile?? I don't know. It's a tough call.Villain wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:15 amSo Pete, Frank, Confederate and the rest of you guys, do you agree with Snakes adviser definition and roles?Villain wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:50 pmIm cool with it, although i also have to see what the other fellas think regarding the D'Amico/Tornabene situation...i mean if the guy presented a ceremony...i dont know...i think your post makes senseSnakes wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:01 pm Senior Advisor: "Senior Advisor" is a mostly unofficial role that we have granted to an Outfit member, or members -- usually of high stature -- who report directly to the bosses and are used by them on an advisory basis. This position has sometimes been identified by law enforcement sources (particularly in recent years) as the "consigliere," despite the Outfit's traditional non-usage of that term. Oftentimes, these members are older, more experienced members who may be semi-retired or restricted from having other roles in the organization, due to parole restrictions, declining health, or other reasons. Due to the unofficial nature of this position, the dates and names listed below are to the best of our knowledge considering the available sources.
Villain, I can't find a place for Tornabene here. D'Amico is mentioned on Scott's site as taking over the consigliere spot in 2005 and relinquishing it (temporarily) to Andriacchi before gaining it back in 2015. I have definitely seen Scott refer to Tornabene as a "former" consigliere but believe he may be doing so in error. If not, perhaps he shared the spot with Gus Alex because the latter was out of town so often? He also officiated over the ceremony, although I'm really not sure. I'm fine with leaving it the way it is below without him, though.
Villain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:48 pm Senior Adviser
Paul Ricca 1948-1955 (became top boss)
Tony Accardo 1955 1971 (became top boss)
Gus Alex 1971 1992 (imprisoned)
Joey Lombardo 1992 2005 (imprisoned) / Angelo LaPietra 1995 1999 (died)
Marco D'Amico 2005 2012 (replaced)
Joe Andriacchi 2012 2015 (became top boss)
-John Matassa, Jr. 2014 2015 (acting for Andriacchi)
Marco D'Amico 2015 present (possibly joined by John Matassa, Jr.)
I agree with phat,I love those old fucks and he's right.we all got some cosa nostra in us.I personnely love the life.I think we on the forum would be the ultimate crew! - camerono
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
So is it possible that at one time D'Amico and Tornabene shared the senior adviser role same as the previous and future examples? Or maybe it was only one of them two, meaning between 2005 and 2012?
Do not be deceived, neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God - Corinthians 6:9-10
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
By the way Pete thank for the info about surveillance on Ferriola, Carlisi, Marcello and Infelice. On Tornabene I was referring to the time period after the Family Secrets indictments. Where he came out of retirement. Most report he replaced Lombardo, but there is conflicting info that states D'AMICO replaced the clown. Maybe Tornabene took over Marcello's crew from Zizzo I don't know, just speculating. He came back to some position of power. Maybe he shared position with D'Amico like Villian said.Pete wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:26 amYes tornabene was acting boss from 2001-2003. That was discussed on the marcello wiretapsFrank wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:24 amYes I have recently read that about D'Amico taking that role over from Lombardo. But everywhere else I read Tornabene, with D'AMICO taking spot when Tornabene died. It's obvious Tornabene came out of retirement and had some position of authority. WAS seen meeting around town ,being chauffeured around by one of the Caruso's. Is it possible he was acting boss for Marcello for awhile?? I don't know. It's a tough call.Villain wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:15 amSo Pete, Frank, Confederate and the rest of you guys, do you agree with Snakes adviser definition and roles?Villain wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:50 pmIm cool with it, although i also have to see what the other fellas think regarding the D'Amico/Tornabene situation...i mean if the guy presented a ceremony...i dont know...i think your post makes senseSnakes wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:01 pm Senior Advisor: "Senior Advisor" is a mostly unofficial role that we have granted to an Outfit member, or members -- usually of high stature -- who report directly to the bosses and are used by them on an advisory basis. This position has sometimes been identified by law enforcement sources (particularly in recent years) as the "consigliere," despite the Outfit's traditional non-usage of that term. Oftentimes, these members are older, more experienced members who may be semi-retired or restricted from having other roles in the organization, due to parole restrictions, declining health, or other reasons. Due to the unofficial nature of this position, the dates and names listed below are to the best of our knowledge considering the available sources.
Villain, I can't find a place for Tornabene here. D'Amico is mentioned on Scott's site as taking over the consigliere spot in 2005 and relinquishing it (temporarily) to Andriacchi before gaining it back in 2015. I have definitely seen Scott refer to Tornabene as a "former" consigliere but believe he may be doing so in error. If not, perhaps he shared the spot with Gus Alex because the latter was out of town so often? He also officiated over the ceremony, although I'm really not sure. I'm fine with leaving it the way it is below without him, though.
Villain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:48 pm Senior Adviser
Paul Ricca 1948-1955 (became top boss)
Tony Accardo 1955 1971 (became top boss)
Gus Alex 1971 1992 (imprisoned)
Joey Lombardo 1992 2005 (imprisoned) / Angelo LaPietra 1995 1999 (died)
Marco D'Amico 2005 2012 (replaced)
Joe Andriacchi 2012 2015 (became top boss)
-John Matassa, Jr. 2014 2015 (acting for Andriacchi)
Marco D'Amico 2015 present (possibly joined by John Matassa, Jr.)
- Confederate
- Full Patched
- Posts: 3404
- Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:39 am
- Location: Pensacola Beach & Jacksonville, FL
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
Yes, his definition is as good as it can be for the Outfit in my opinion.Villain wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:15 amSo Pete, Frank, Confederate and the rest of you guys, do you agree with Snakes adviser definition and roles?Villain wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:50 pmIm cool with it, although i also have to see what the other fellas think regarding the D'Amico/Tornabene situation...i mean if the guy presented a ceremony...i dont know...i think your post makes senseSnakes wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:01 pm Senior Advisor: "Senior Advisor" is a mostly unofficial role that we have granted to an Outfit member, or members -- usually of high stature -- who report directly to the bosses and are used by them on an advisory basis. This position has sometimes been identified by law enforcement sources (particularly in recent years) as the "consigliere," despite the Outfit's traditional non-usage of that term. Oftentimes, these members are older, more experienced members who may be semi-retired or restricted from having other roles in the organization, due to parole restrictions, declining health, or other reasons. Due to the unofficial nature of this position, the dates and names listed below are to the best of our knowledge considering the available sources.
Villain, I can't find a place for Tornabene here. D'Amico is mentioned on Scott's site as taking over the consigliere spot in 2005 and relinquishing it (temporarily) to Andriacchi before gaining it back in 2015. I have definitely seen Scott refer to Tornabene as a "former" consigliere but believe he may be doing so in error. If not, perhaps he shared the spot with Gus Alex because the latter was out of town so often? He also officiated over the ceremony, although I'm really not sure. I'm fine with leaving it the way it is below without him, though.
Villain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:48 pm Senior Adviser
Paul Ricca 1948-1955 (became top boss)
Tony Accardo 1955 1971 (became top boss)
Gus Alex 1971 1992 (imprisoned)
Joey Lombardo 1992 2005 (imprisoned) / Angelo LaPietra 1995 1999 (died)
Marco D'Amico 2005 2012 (replaced)
Joe Andriacchi 2012 2015 (became top boss)
-John Matassa, Jr. 2014 2015 (acting for Andriacchi)
Marco D'Amico 2015 present (possibly joined by John Matassa, Jr.)
My only comment is that there can be SEVERAL Senior Advisors at any given time so I'm not sure that it is accurate to name ONLY one and call him the Consigliere. But for simplicity sake, maybe that is best for your chart and then you can use the description that Snakes made to explain that there can be MORE THAN ONE Senior Advisor at any time depending upon different circumstances.
" Everything Woke turns to shit".
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
That's what I intended with the definition; I made sure to note that it was not a specific position and was somewhat undefined.
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
Yes I like the definition. And I think we should have Tornabene and D'Amico both as advisors till Tornabene died. They needed guys with experience at that time. It makes sense that D'Amico would replace the Clown. But Tornabene was brought out of retirement also because he was respected and they needed him.Confederate wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:11 pmYes, his definition is as good as it can be for the Outfit in my opinion.Villain wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:15 amSo Pete, Frank, Confederate and the rest of you guys, do you agree with Snakes adviser definition and roles?Villain wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:50 pmIm cool with it, although i also have to see what the other fellas think regarding the D'Amico/Tornabene situation...i mean if the guy presented a ceremony...i dont know...i think your post makes senseSnakes wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:01 pm Senior Advisor: "Senior Advisor" is a mostly unofficial role that we have granted to an Outfit member, or members -- usually of high stature -- who report directly to the bosses and are used by them on an advisory basis. This position has sometimes been identified by law enforcement sources (particularly in recent years) as the "consigliere," despite the Outfit's traditional non-usage of that term. Oftentimes, these members are older, more experienced members who may be semi-retired or restricted from having other roles in the organization, due to parole restrictions, declining health, or other reasons. Due to the unofficial nature of this position, the dates and names listed below are to the best of our knowledge considering the available sources.
Villain, I can't find a place for Tornabene here. D'Amico is mentioned on Scott's site as taking over the consigliere spot in 2005 and relinquishing it (temporarily) to Andriacchi before gaining it back in 2015. I have definitely seen Scott refer to Tornabene as a "former" consigliere but believe he may be doing so in error. If not, perhaps he shared the spot with Gus Alex because the latter was out of town so often? He also officiated over the ceremony, although I'm really not sure. I'm fine with leaving it the way it is below without him, though.
Villain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2018 1:48 pm Senior Adviser
Paul Ricca 1948-1955 (became top boss)
Tony Accardo 1955 1971 (became top boss)
Gus Alex 1971 1992 (imprisoned)
Joey Lombardo 1992 2005 (imprisoned) / Angelo LaPietra 1995 1999 (died)
Marco D'Amico 2005 2012 (replaced)
Joe Andriacchi 2012 2015 (became top boss)
-John Matassa, Jr. 2014 2015 (acting for Andriacchi)
Marco D'Amico 2015 present (possibly joined by John Matassa, Jr.)
My only comment is that there can be SEVERAL Senior Advisors at any given time so I'm not sure that it is accurate to name ONLY one and call him the Consigliere. But for simplicity sake, maybe that is best for your chart and then you can use the description that Snakes made to explain that there can be MORE THAN ONE Senior Advisor at any time depending upon different circumstances.
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
Unless Tornabene came out of retirement originally to be acting boss and represent Marcello till the decided on Sarno. But that's pure speculation with no hard evidence. But he was meeting with alot of members at the time.
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
I agree what Frank said about Tornabene sharing the spot with D"Amico
Do not be deceived, neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God - Corinthians 6:9-10
Re: Chicago Outfit Lineage Chart 1928-2017
I don't have anything anywhere saying that he shared it with anyone.