1983 list (Brooklyn)

[Angelo Santino]

In your article you say it's not clear whether it was D'Aquila or Mineo who took over directly for Lupo, which is sort of like the discussion about whether the Lucchese or Genovese are "technically" the continuation of the Morello family, but it doesn't seem clear to me that a new family was created at that time either, only that Mineo and D'Aquila were bosses from that point forward. Is there a source who specifically says Mineo (or possibly D'Aquila) took over a new family, or is there any possibility that this "second" Palermitani family existed pre-1911 and Mineo simply took it over as the new boss?

The Profaci family (which is probably the Mineo family) can trace its Villabate roots to Giuseppe Fontana, said to be an influential member under D'Aquila. If the Mineo family split off and eventually became the Profaci family, then I would guess it included Fontana's people. I've never been completely sold on the idea that Fontana was "just" a captain in the D'Aquila family, though... I believe he was a boss in Villabate and reports have him meeting with the highest ranking members in both Sicily in the US.

It's confusing territory with these bosses from Sicily coming to the US, though. This came up in the Vincenzo Troia topic when we found out he was the boss of San Giuseppe Iato when he fled to the US. He was recognized as a top figure in the US at the time of the Castellammarese war but it's not clear if he was boss of a small US family or if his status as boss of SGI was simply recognized in the US for political reasons. Maranzano is another example, as he was a top boss in Sicily and apparently became a soldier in the US but held the influence of a top leader before he became the official boss. If Fontana was a boss in Sicily, it's hard not to imagine he had more influence than the average member. What that influence amounted to, who knows.

D'Arco is always good at mucking up these types of discussions with his "history"... in his book he says that original Vario crew captain Salvatore Curiale went back to the days when there was one family in Brooklyn. It's not hard to imagine the Gambino and Profaci Brooklyn groups were part of one family, but hard to say with the other families. Would be interesting if what D'Arco is referring to is the Mineo family. Curiale could have switched families during/after the war, and the Frankie Yale crew would end up with ties to both the Profaci and Genovese family, so that group could have been under Mineo previously. The Bonanno family doesn't seem to have come from Mineo at all, but that was a much different part of Brooklyn. It doesn't seem completely insane to me that Mineo may have had most of South and East Brooklyn under his control, or at least the dominant presence there.

Did we say that? Because we have continuity of members (Fontana, Fanara) and a captain (Virzi) who were under Lupo and then under D'Aquila. That's cut and dry established. Now with the Mineo, we don't have virtually any names of anyone under him, so no one we can link to Lupo or anyone else. It's not until 1930 when a Colombo member provided information which included taking orders from Mineo.

We searched for potential predecessors for Mineo and couldn't find anyone. In 1912 there was a meeting which involved a "break up" and in 1913 you first hear about "The Mineo Gang" as a separate entity from "The D'Aquila Gang." It seems logical because before 1905, the numbers wouldn't have justified another family. But due to a string of earth quakes and other events transpiring in Italy at the time, there was a surge in immigration in 1904-1906 and continued steadily until the mid 1920's. We know that when mafiosi came to NYC they had to "transfer" into an existing group, they couldn't go around as free agents. So given that Palermo was the port city and Sicily's largest premier city, it's probable the majority of immigrants and ergo majority of mafiosi hailed from Palermo. With less immigrants coming from the Sicilian interior and the Trapani region it's plausible Gambino membership shot upward out of control. We don't have numbers but I could see in 1910 the totals being 150-300 for the Gambinos with the Genoveses being half that and the Bonannos slightly smaller. Going back to what I normally harp on about Mafia Families not being in a race to have the largest group, I think that perhaps played a part in the 1912 formal split. And interestingly enough, Mineo's bro in law Palermo Boss was in Palermo in 1910 when the Palermo groups formally splintered 2-3 sometimes 4 different ways into new groups (which later would semi-rejoin under the mandamenti system.

In New York City, Villabate was like Bisacquino, people from these towns could go with one or the other depending on who their contacts were. If I'm Castellammarese and all my mafia contacts are in Palermo and I don't know anyone in Castellammare there's a good chance I'd end up with the Gambinos. But quite generally, people from the same towns know each other and that's why you have clumps of people aligned from close areas in Sicily. And that tradition continued for the most part: following the mafia's arrival in America when they began to recruit on US soil, they made people close to them, from the same neighborhoods or at least had been in the area for a certain amount of time or came with connections somewhere else. That Colombo acting boss made out of nowhere a few years back with no connections to NYC is a very rare scenario.

[Angelo Santino]

This may be a little off topic, but you mentioned Maranzano was a Boss in Sicily and then came over to New York as a soldier before becoming a Boss.
I thought the Boss, Underboss, Consigliere, Capo, Soldati structure came about AFTER the war with Joe Masseria was over. Maranzano was the one who implemented this Structure and said there were 5 Families with himself being the boss of one of the Families and the Boss of Bosses. Then, after Maranzano was killed, Luciano became a Boss and implemented the National Commission which extended across the Country and said there would be NO Boss of Bosses. Am I correct?

The 5 families and the structure existed long before Maranzano.


Pogo

Indeed! Yet two points to make:

1) Undeniably there's examples of the hierarchy existing as early as 1870 Sicily as well this same system: underboss, consigliere, capodecina in NYC since the early 20's.

But..

2) Both Gentile and Valachi credit Maranzano with forming this system in NYC in 1931. (Which is contradictory on Gentile's part given he identifies people holding these ranks as early as 1915 in the same work in which he credits Maranzano 16 years later of having conceived.)

As researchers we got to state both. I guess to make peace out of the two, maybe the Families in NYC were in different states, maybe Mineo didn't have capos or Masseria created additional non-mafia ranks (speculation, certainly no evidence of either) and in 1931 Maranzano aligned everything to be uniform. Highly doubtful considering it's not normal practice to dictate how another family is ran. Anyone's guess is as good as mine. Which brings us to 1931 and what exactly changed? When zooming out and looking at events and their impacts, whatever Luciano and/or Maranzano did was a drop in the bucket in terms of shaping the mafia's destiny. Everything they are credited with existed before they came onto the scene, including a national governing body which ironed out disputes and acted a jury to death warrants. The only thing that changed in '31 was a committee of 7 members presiding over the national governing body as opposed to one leader. We can argue if one is willing, that Luciano was instrumental in making that work, but he didn't conceive of the idea. After Masseria, Vincenzo Troia suggested such an arrangement but Maranzano shot it down and became gabodeigap'.

[Confederate]

So, was the structure of the Camorra different at that time? If so, then all the New York Cosa Nostra Italian men who were from Naples or Calabria adapted to the Sicilian structure. Is that correct?
If memory serves me correctly, Valachi was not Sicilian and his knowledge of History, in general, probably was limited.

[Angelo Santino]

So, was the structure of the Camorra different at that time? If so, then all the New York Cosa Nostra Italian men who were from Naples or Calabria adapted to the Sicilian structure. Is that correct?
If memory serves me correctly, Valachi was not Sicilian and his knowledge of History, in general, probably was limited.

Mainland group structures played no part in the New York LCN which was strongly Sicilian influenced due to demographics and thus Mafia related. They brought in mainlanders but they had to adopt to the system. As time wore on and everyone became Italian, the Mafia system continued.

[Confederate]

So, was the structure of the Camorra different at that time? If so, then all the New York Cosa Nostra Italian men who were from Naples or Calabria adapted to the Sicilian structure. Is that correct?
If memory serves me correctly, Valachi was not Sicilian and his knowledge of History, in general, probably was limited.

Mainland group structures played no part in the New York LCN which was strongly Sicilian influenced due to demographics and thus Mafia related. They brought in mainlanders but they had to adopt to the system. As time wore on and everyone became Italian, the Mafia system continued.

Thank You. Very Informative.

[Angelo Santino]

Going back to the first Mafia War of 1913, the two official victims were D'Aquila members, committed by the "Mineo and Lo Monte gangs." These are Giuseppe Fanara of Resuttana (who goes back to Lupo and the Barrel Murder) and Giuseppe Fontana of Villabate (not the same G.F. in the Barrel Murder but there have been older Italian sources which state (without evidence) that the two men of the same name were cousins. There was also an attempt on Saverio Virzi who, in 1910, was raising money for Lupo's defense, he lived and instead his son was either wounded or killed.

Clemente gives no reasons for how or why this war started, only that the Mineo-LoMonte and Schiro groups were "against" D'Aquila. Everyone assumes it was a hostile D'Aquila trying to take over Morello territory but it may not have started out as that. In fact, given that D'Aquila wasn't a suspect in the Lo Monte's a year later we can assume the 1913 war was over by this point, otherwise D'Aquila would have been the prime suspect.

Following 1913 we don't hear again of Mineo until 1921 when he travels to Sicily the same time Morello, Lupo and others did due to their death warrants. He's not heard from again until the 1930's when he's taken over D'Aquila's family at some point after 1928.

But given the main characters involved- D'Aquila, Mineo, Fanara, Fontana, Virzi were all Palermitan, I would argue whatever transpired in 1913 was a dispute between this faction (of two separate Families) that erupted and the other 2 families got involved and took Mineo's side. It was somehow squashed. If one wanted to argue that Mineo "went under" D'Aquila following this war I can't argue against it but would only again fast forward to 1930 and point out that when Colombo members were getting their marching orders from Mineo. I cannot argue against a theory that a group formed, disappeared and in 1928 another group formed headed by DiBella Profaci with members who answered to Mineo. I'd disagree but can't argue against such a theory.

We also- Antiliar and I- debated one scenario in 1890's Palermo where you had a Boss (with an underboss) over one group who was also underboss of another neighboring family with a Boss. This info came from Francesco Siino the Provincial Boss turned informant so it's most likely accurate. But even so, it's the only instance we have on file of this occurring.. anywhere. So to suggest that D'Aquila and Mineo shared the same arrangement cannot be disputed but it's highly, highly unlikely. Both men appear to have been locked into the Palermo Mafia and that may have played a part in why Mineo go the position he got in 1928. We also don't know what relationship both men enjoyed over an 18 year period or if they had known each other prior in Sicily (I would say most likely given they were a 5 minute walk apart). I don't believe either one could have killed the other and faced Palermo. Not that Palermo would have sent hitmen to kill one but perhaps refuse to recognize him and guarantee his safety should he visit Palermo if he couldn't provide a legitimate reason for the hit, in which case he could voluntarily step down or remain a Boss recognized in America but non grata in Palermo. Politics played a roll we can surmise but without having been there, we're limited beyond speculation.

[Selig]

It's very refreshing here how informed and intelligent the conversation is. A far cry from some other forums. I don't always agree with everything, but I always come away from a thread with things to think about.

[johnny_scootch]

I could read Christies posts on this topic for hours!

I'm currently adding Staten Island to the map.

[B.]

Did we say that? Because we have continuity of members (Fontana, Fanara) and a captain (Virzi) who were under Lupo and then under D'Aquila. That's cut and dry established. Now with the Mineo, we don't have virtually any names of anyone under him, so no one we can link to Lupo or anyone else. It's not until 1930 when a Colombo member provided information which included taking orders from Mineo.

We searched for potential predecessors for Mineo and couldn't find anyone. In 1912 there was a meeting which involved a "break up" and in 1913 you first hear about "The Mineo Gang" as a separate entity from "The D'Aquila Gang." It seems logical because before 1905, the numbers wouldn't have justified another family. But due to a string of earth quakes and other events transpiring in Italy at the time, there was a surge in immigration in 1904-1906 and continued steadily until the mid 1920's. We know that when mafiosi came to NYC they had to "transfer" into an existing group, they couldn't go around as free agents. So given that Palermo was the port city and Sicily's largest premier city, it's probable the majority of immigrants and ergo majority of mafiosi hailed from Palermo. With less immigrants coming from the Sicilian interior and the Trapani region it's plausible Gambino membership shot upward out of control. We don't have numbers but I could see in 1910 the totals being 150-300 for the Gambinos with the Genoveses being half that and the Bonannos slightly smaller. Going back to what I normally harp on about Mafia Families not being in a race to have the largest group, I think that perhaps played a part in the 1912 formal split. And interestingly enough, Mineo's bro in law Palermo Boss was in Palermo in 1910 when the Palermo groups formally splintered 2-3 sometimes 4 different ways into new groups (which later would semi-rejoin under the mandamenti system.

In New York City, Villabate was like Bisacquino, people from these towns could go with one or the other depending on who their contacts were. If I'm Castellammarese and all my mafia contacts are in Palermo and I don't know anyone in Castellammare there's a good chance I'd end up with the Gambinos. But quite generally, people from the same towns know each other and that's why you have clumps of people aligned from close areas in Sicily. And that tradition continued for the most part: following the mafia's arrival in America when they began to recruit on US soil, they made people close to them, from the same neighborhoods or at least had been in the area for a certain amount of time or came with connections somewhere else. That Colombo acting boss made out of nowhere a few years back with no connections to NYC is a very rare scenario.

This was the line from your article that got me thinking: "The other possibility is that either Mineo or D'Aquila succeeded Lupo and a second Palermitani crime family was formed in that time period..."

Sounds like you were just allowing for the possibility of other theories, but the rest of the articles matches everything you just said above. It's still hard for me to wrap my brain around this early era and I'm still absorbing the article. These posts are a great supplement to that.

On Mineo becoming boss of another family, I have to point out that it was much more common for relative strangers to show up in cities and become the new boss for whatever political reason. Gentile talks about going to different cities and becoming an administration member and even boss and it doesn't seem anyone batted an eye. There are other examples around the country of guys taking over families even when they don't seem to have paesani or much of a support base in the city they're going to. Given that Mineo was located in the same city for over 15 years and had plenty of paesans around, it probably wasn't that crazy for him to take over the family at the time. Wasn't there speculation that Pinzolo was promoted to boss of the Luccheses from another family, possibly the D'Aquila/Mineo/Mangano family?

Thanks for reminding about Yale, Pogo. Though I wonder if he had ties to a specific family before the Masseria family was created.

[Confederate]

It's very refreshing here how informed and intelligent the conversation is. A far cry from some other forums. I don't always agree with everything, but I always come away from a thread with things to think about.

Yes, I know what you mean. I had checked out that gangsterbb site and it was mostly a bunch of ridiculous bullshit run by an ultra liberal Jew. LOL
The only good parts were from some of the Posters who are on this Site.
These guys are more serious researchers and dig into deep details that you would not find in a book.
For example, if you had read the Valachi Papers book, you would have come away with the idea that Maranzano basically revolutionized the American Mafia when the war with Masseria was over, when in fact, most of what existed had already been in place long before Maranzano.

[Angelo Santino]

On Mineo becoming boss of another family, I have to point out that it was much more common for relative strangers to show up in cities and become the new boss for whatever political reason. Gentile talks about going to different cities and becoming an administration member and even boss and it doesn't seem anyone batted an eye. There are other examples around the country of guys taking over families even when they don't seem to have paesani or much of a support base in the city they're going to. Given that Mineo was located in the same city for over 15 years and had plenty of paesans around, it probably wasn't that crazy for him to take over the family at the time. Wasn't there speculation that Pinzolo was promoted to boss of the Luccheses from another family, possibly the D'Aquila/Mineo/Mangano family?

Thanks for reminding about Yale, Pogo. Though I wonder if he had ties to a specific family before the Masseria family was created.

Yes, but Gentile was in the USA and a member since 1906 who had previously been to Kansas City and was also intimate with the members there. So him becoming boss, if he did, does have some historical background to it. With the others (Magaddino, Milazzo, etc etc all the way to Lanza out in Frisco, we don't know the circumstances. They could have moved there and became boss gradually or they could have went there to become boss, perhaps non-NY families seen having admin members with close ties to NY a plus. So much we don't know.

As for why Mineo became boss over the Gambinos, it's again speculation. But going back to the Gambinos/Colombos and their significance to Palermo I'd say it's a likely factor that cannot be ignored. For the record, one could argue that Mangano was with the Mineo group and went with him into the Gambinos. There's no proof for it and I can't argue against it. The Colombo Family had more members with Palermitan roots than Villabate, but by 1930 all the old stuff we covered: Corleonese, Castellammarese, Palermitan etc was largely irrelevant. It mattered in how members congregated, you seen compaesani being connected to one another, but someone's origin didn't by this point- if it ever did- prevent them from occupying offices within the society. Anastasia's a prime example: Calabrese yet underboss and later official boss of the dominant Palermitan faction, same with Gotti decades later. I'd argue it was a similar scenario with the Villabate Profacis and Maglioccos presiding over a dominant Palermitan group and end with a quote from Antonino Calderone: "If a man has the right qualities to enter the society then he has the right qualities to lead it."

Pinzolo, yes, that was Antiliar's thing, not my strongest area.

[B.]

Also, you mentioned Bisacquino and I was going to bring it up earlier. Cascio Ferro is a good example of someone who seems to have had significant status in Sicily, so it makes me wonder what his exact influence/affiliation was in the US. Like Fontana, he seems to have operated at the highest levels of the mafia while in the US.

Bisacquino immigrant Vincenzo DiLeonardo ended up with the D'Aquila family and his grandson Mikey Scars said that Cascio Ferro sent Vincenzo and his father (Scars' great-grandfather) to the US. This is somewhat reinforced by a letter from 1909 sent from Vincenzo DiLeonardo of Brooklyn to his "compare" Cascio Ferro. In one version of this letter I saw, Ribera also seems to be mentioned. Was Cascio Ferro living in Ribera at any point after he returned to Sicily? Either way, the letter supports the idea that the DiLeonardos were closely connected to their paesan Cascio Ferro, which is a sign that he may have also been a Lupo/D'Aquila member like them when he lived in the US.

[Pogo The Clown]

Cascio Ferro made Carlo Gambino and sent him to the US.


Pogo

[Angelo Santino]

Also, you mentioned Bisacquino and I was going to bring it up earlier. Cascio Ferro is a good example of someone who seems to have had significant status in Sicily, so it makes me wonder what his exact influence/affiliation was in the US. Like Fontana, he seems to have operated at the highest levels of the mafia while in the US.

Bisacquino immigrant Vincenzo DiLeonardo ended up with the D'Aquila family and his grandson Mikey Scars said that Cascio Ferro sent Vincenzo and his father (Scars' great-grandfather) to the US. This is somewhat reinforced by a letter from 1909 sent from Vincenzo DiLeonardo of Brooklyn to his "compare" Cascio Ferro. In one version of this letter I saw, Ribera also seems to be mentioned. Was Cascio Ferro living in Ribera at any point after he returned to Sicily? Either way, the letter supports the idea that the DiLeonardos were closely connected to their paesan Cascio Ferro, which is a sign that he may have also been a Lupo/D'Aquila member like them when he lived in the US.

Cascio Ferro was 'somebody' but didn't become a prominent boss until after he returned to Sicily. This was confirmed by Clemente who remained in contact with Cascio Ferro's nephew who stated that he had "become boss of the Mafia in Sicily." I believe this was in 1911 or 1912 no later than 1915. But previously, while in the USA, he hung around the Corleonese, first with Clemente and Stella Frauto involved in their counterfeiting network (a very low level occupancy given alleged superboss status I've seen attribute to him) and then later directly with Morello and La Duca. He didn't hang around the Palermitans and the only time he was in vicinity with Lupo, Inzerillo etc was when he went with Morello to attend meetings. He was respected but certainly not equal in their status circa 1902. Given that the mafia had already existed in the city for nearly 3 decades any notion that V.C.F. "set up" New York or sent people here to "take over" is absolute insanity.

Again, cities like Bisacquino, Bagheria and others could go with whoever for any number of reasons. Relatives, connections, maybe they have their choice and opt to go with the more powerful boss and that's why Cascio Ferro was with the Morellos and the DiLeonardo's went with D'Aquila. But just because two Bisacquinesi join two different families doesn't make them non-compaesani. We could open up an entire thread on members who went with one group over the other. Masseria was arrested with Bonanno-linked associates and came from Menfi, he had all the right bonafides to become a Bonanno, instead he went with Genovese. Luciano of Lercara Friddi hung around E 13th and roomed with Joe Biondo, why didn't he go with the Gambino family? Tommy Lucchese, Palermitan with mafia lineage, a good fit for the Gambinos, went instead with the (then) Corleonese dominant Reina group. This could go on and on. We could ask the same of the Profaci's given the Gambino history of having members from Villabate (Fontana). But remember, Villabate is a suburb of Palermo, it's walkable and ergo feasible that both cities share relatives.

[Pogo The Clown]

For the record, one could argue that Mangano was with the Mineo group and went with him into the Gambinos. There's no proof for it and I can't argue against it.

The Mangano brothers took over for Don Battista Balsamo, the first Godfather. They took over the Mineo family after Maranzano became the Boss of Bosses.


Pogo