Detroit Family 1984 Discussion

[Adam]

I'll just mention that this is a very Detroit LCN minutiae topic that most won't find interesting. So in 1984 the FBI testified before congress that the Detroit family consisted of at least 23 members. One boss, one underboss, six captains and more than fifteen soldiers. And I still think its odd that they said "more than fifteen soldiers" instead of giving a number. In 1963 congressional hearings Detroit police officials presented a list of 63 Italian members of the Detroit family. That's the list that most people who research the Detroit mob know. I'll mention that a lot of people forget that there were three other people on that chart whose names were not listed so there were actually 66. I think its pretty much a given that two of them were Jack Tocco and Anthony Zerilli but they had never been convicted of a crime before so I think for legal reasons they didn't list them. I've always thought the third was probably either Anthony Corrado or Anthony Tocco. But that being said, I've often wondered if the FBI just took that list 21 years later and just crossed off everyone who had died and called that the Detroit family and presented that to congress to indicate some kind of progress. I really wouldn't put it past the Detroit office to do that(I'll note that they would not name Jack Tocco as the boss of the Detroit mob in that hearing. They would only say that there was a boss who was assisted by Zerilli the underboss and six captains.) They were getting grilled pretty hard by the senators in 1984 for how few convictions they'd gotten in the past ten years and how light the sentences were. So I wonder who the at least 23 people were. Now in 1990 the FBI said the family was 26 members and still one boss, one underboss and six captains. In 1990 this is the list that they had for the captains and higher:

Boss: Jack Tocco
Underboss: Anthony Zerilli
Captains: Anthony Giacalone, Vito Giacalone, Anthony Corrado, Anthony Tocco, Michael Polizzi, Joseph Matranga

Now I'm curious as to what that chart looked like in 1984 and who the "more than fifteen soldiers" were at the time. I'd also be curious as to which soldiers answered to who, but I really don't think Detroit operated on a strict hierarchy of "these soldiers report directly to this captain" kind of thing. These people from the 1963 list were definitely still alive so I'm kind of assuming the FBI had them on their list in 1984:

Rafaelle Quasarano
Sam Lucido
Anthony Giacalone
Dominic Corrado
MIchael Polizzi
Vincent Meli
Pete Vitale
Joseph Barbara Jr.
Vito Giacalone
Paul Vitale
Pete Cavataio
Frank Meli
Sam Finazzo
Mario Agosta
Dominic Bommarito
Dominic Allevato

So if we add in Jack Tocco, Anthony Tocco, Anthony Zerilli and Anthony Corrado that gets us to 20. They did name Domnic Licavoli as a member in their testimony(even though he wasn't on the 1963 list) so that gets us to 21. So I'm looking for who the FBI would have thought the last at least three were. And I honestly don't think Matranga would have been on the 1984 list. I don't think he would have been added until after he got busted for loan sharking and extortion with Polizzi in 1985. But that's just me. So who am I missing? I think I'm missing some people from the 1963 list who were still alive that I'm not sure of. I only say that because I don't think that the FBI was acknowledging any newly initiated members since 1963. So I don't think Frank Bommarito, Ronald Morelli, Bernard Marchesani, any of the Ruggirello brothers or other relatively younger guys who weren't considered members in the early sixties would have been on that list. So does anyone have any ideas? I will note that I think Pete Licavoli had already died in 1984 when they testified so I don't list him. But for the 1984 list I'm thinking this:

Boss: Jack Tocco
Underboss: Anthony Zerilli(identified by FBI in 1984)
Captains:
1. Anthony Giacalone(identified by FBI in 1984)
2. Vito Giacalone(identified by FBI in 1984)
3. Michael Polizzi(identified by FBI in 1984)
4. Dominic Corrado(will die in 1985 and seems to have been replaced by his brother Anthony)
5. Anthony Tocco(probably unless it was someone else who died between 1984 and 1990 like maybe Sam Lucido but I doubt that)
6. Not sure. Matranga is the sixth in 1990 but I still have trouble with that.

But I'm open to suggestions.

Adam R.

[Adam]

I realize now that this should have gone in the Mafia Charts section. If I could move it I would. Sorry.

Adam R.

[Pogo The Clown]

Boss: Jack Tocco
Underboss: Anthony Zerilli
Captains: Anthony Giacalone, Vito Giacalone, Anthony Corrado, Anthony Tocco, Michael Polizzi, Joseph Matranga

Just want to add that this hierarchy was also listed in a 1987 chart. So it was probably pretty similar if not the same for 1984.


Great info by the way.


Pogo

[Adam]

Boss: Jack Tocco
Underboss: Anthony Zerilli
Captains: Anthony Giacalone, Vito Giacalone, Anthony Corrado, Anthony Tocco, Michael Polizzi, Joseph Matranga

Just want to add that this hierarchy was also listed in a 1987 chart. So it was probably pretty similar if not the same for 1984.


Great info by the way.


Pogo

Thanks Pogo. I forgot that fact. In 1990 they said the 1987 chart was still accurate. Appreciate that clarification. Really I think the only difference between 1984 and 1987 would be Anthony Corrado replacing Dominic Corrado, and maybe Matranga not being on the 1984 list. Matranga being on any list as a captain is just plain odd to me. The last time he's mentioned in anything related to Detroit is a 1992 article in the Free Press about where Detroit mobsters lived in the Metro area. And even then he was listed as just a name with an unknown address or age. I don't think the Free Press even knew who he was. Just got his name off the 1987 list.

Adam R.

[JCB1977]

Nice info

[DoubleZ]

Once I'm off mobile, I'll get more in depth, but both the 1963 and 1984 charts are missing influential and obvious members. At their height (50-60s), the Detroit had approx 100 made men. Let's not try and get into a tizzy about that number, but considering the scope of the Detroit LCNs operations and influence at that time, and having the fourth largest Italian-American population in America at the time, it's realistic.

For approx 40-50 members die and not be replaced at a time of high activity between '60 and '84 is hard to believe. Billy Giacalone was caught on tape complaining of losing members, but that was before a slew of making ceremonies in the 80s.

[AlexfromSouth]

Once I'm off mobile, I'll get more in depth, but both the 1963 and 1984 charts are missing influential and obvious members. At their height (50-60s), the Detroit had approx 100 made men. Let's not try and get into a tizzy about that number, but considering the scope of the Detroit LCNs operations and influence at that time, and having the fourth largest Italian-American population in America at the time, it's realistic.

For approx 40-50 members die and not be replaced at a time of high activity between '60 and '84 is hard to believe. Billy Giacalone was caught on tape complaining of losing members, but that was before a slew of making ceremonies in the 80s.

what was the 2nd and 3rd highest italian population?

[AlexfromSouth]

Once I'm off mobile, I'll get more in depth, but both the 1963 and 1984 charts are missing influential and obvious members. At their height (50-60s), the Detroit had approx 100 made men. Let's not try and get into a tizzy about that number, but considering the scope of the Detroit LCNs operations and influence at that time, and having the fourth largest Italian-American population in America at the time, it's realistic.

For approx 40-50 members die and not be replaced at a time of high activity between '60 and '84 is hard to believe. Billy Giacalone was caught on tape complaining of losing members, but that was before a slew of making ceremonies in the 80s.

what was the 2nd and 3rd highest italian population?

To be clear my question was, what cities had the 2nd and 3rd highest italian american population? 1st being New York, of course. Thanks

[DoubleZ]

Once I'm off mobile, I'll get more in depth, but both the 1963 and 1984 charts are missing influential and obvious members. At their height (50-60s), the Detroit had approx 100 made men. Let's not try and get into a tizzy about that number, but considering the scope of the Detroit LCNs operations and influence at that time, and having the fourth largest Italian-American population in America at the time, it's realistic.

For approx 40-50 members die and not be replaced at a time of high activity between '60 and '84 is hard to believe. Billy Giacalone was caught on tape complaining of losing members, but that was before a slew of making ceremonies in the 80s.

what was the 2nd and 3rd highest italian population?

To be clear my question was, what cities had the 2nd and 3rd highest italian american population? 1st being New York, of course. Thanks

Chicago and Philly

[AlexfromSouth]

Once I'm off mobile, I'll get more in depth, but both the 1963 and 1984 charts are missing influential and obvious members. At their height (50-60s), the Detroit had approx 100 made men. Let's not try and get into a tizzy about that number, but considering the scope of the Detroit LCNs operations and influence at that time, and having the fourth largest Italian-American population in America at the time, it's realistic.

For approx 40-50 members die and not be replaced at a time of high activity between '60 and '84 is hard to believe. Billy Giacalone was caught on tape complaining of losing members, but that was before a slew of making ceremonies in the 80s.

what was the 2nd and 3rd highest italian population?

To be clear my question was, what cities had the 2nd and 3rd highest italian american population? 1st being New York, of course. Thanks

Chicago and Philly

Of course, thank you

[willychichi]

To be clear my question was, what cities had the 2nd and 3rd highest italian american population? 1st being New York, of course. Thanks

It's hard to say for sure Alex, the last census we have data from was taken in 1990 and at that time NYC had 1.8 million Italians followed by Boston, Philly and Chicago who all had about 490,000 Italians living in their respective cities, a lot can happen in 27 years. It was interesting to me and JCB probably knows this that Pittsburgh was number 5 at that time with about 380,000. Fort Lauderdale, Florida came in at #16 with 140,000 which was a surprise to me. Since that time people have flocked to the southern and western states to get out of the cold and find jobs so I'm sure the numbers are way down today from what they were in 1990.

[AlexfromSouth]

To be clear my question was, what cities had the 2nd and 3rd highest italian american population? 1st being New York, of course. Thanks

It's hard to say for sure Alex, the last census we have data from was taken in 1990 and at that time NYC had 1.8 million Italians followed by Boston, Philly and Chicago who all had about 490,000 Italians living in their respective cities, a lot can happen in 27 years. It was interesting to me and JCB probably knows this that Pittsburgh was number 5 at that time with about 380,000. Fort Lauderdale, Florida came in at #16 with 140,000 which was a surprise to me. Since that time people have flocked to the southern and western states to get out of the cold and find jobs so I'm sure the numbers are way down today from what they were in 1990.

Yes a lot can happen in 27 years, thank you for your post. Boston had that large of a population of italian americans? Someone like me (from europe) would think that irish are big in numbers there. Never thougt Boston would come at number two.

[Cheech]

http://www.niaf.org/culture/statistics/ ... americans/

[AlexfromSouth]

http://www.niaf.org/culture/statistics/ ... americans/

Everybody is Italian in Connecticut, lol. Thanks Cheech

[Cheech]

Welcome. Im from CT. I think its the close proximity to nyc