The Cicale Files

[Rocco]

yet in 1988 they named (according to Pogo) Nick Rizzuto capo of the Montreal crew.

Let me make a correction on that. It was the NYPD's OC section that had him as a Capo. Their info probably was not as accurate as the Feds on that matter.


Pogo

Should be more accurate then the feds because the NY LCN had two NYPD detectives(the laurel and hardy bafoons) one or both were NYPD Task Force Detectives on their payroll pullin hits etc. lol

[Rocco]

yet in 1988 they named (according to Pogo) Nick Rizzuto capo of the Montreal crew.

Let me make a correction on that. It was the NYPD's OC section that had him as a Capo. Their info probably was not as accurate as the Feds on that matter.


Pogo

Should be more accurate then the feds because the NY LCN had two NYPD detectives(the laurel and hardy bafoons) one or both were NYPD Task Force Detectives on their payroll pullin hits etc. lol I think Fritzy had a FBI secretary too

[antimafia]

The thing is, the FBI already knew George was a capo by 1981, yet in 1988 they named (according to Pogo) Nick Rizzuto capo of the Montreal crew. However, it needs to be said that Sciascia did request for Canadian citizenship in the early 1990s. He was denied after Canadian authorities found out about his status in organized crime and he was not allowed to enter the country again. His son, Mark, however had moved to Canada before him and became a Canadian citizen. As far as I know he still lives in Montreal and owns a restaurant.

And in 1988, Nick Rizzuto Sr. was arrested in Venezuela and then imprisoned there for five years. Recall that in 1987 and possibly in early 1988, he spent a good chunk of his time living in Toronto, allegedly with Vito Rizzuto's father-in-law (Leonardo Cammalleri) or in a residence that he had purchased. I'm assuming that Canadian law enforcement was sharing intelligence with the FBI and other American law-enforcement agencies--if not, American law enforcement's identification of Nick Sr. as a captain in 1988 isn't as reliable or valid as it could be. There are some organized-crime authors and reporters who also believe that Nick Sr. still feared retribution after Paolo Violi's brother Rocco was killed in October 1980 and, as a result, was not in Montreal as much in the ensuing years.

There are lots of debatable points raised in this thread. I hope to contribute to the discussion later (maybe next week). Just a few thoughts for now:

- Rocco is correct in raising the point about how unwise (if not downright stupid) it would have been for Vito to travel to New York to meet with Massino. I recall that The Sixth Family book mentions Vito and Nick Sr.'s reluctance or refusal to travel to the US, even avoiding trips that would involve a layover in an American city. I will add that Massino must have been aware of how imprudent it would have been for Vito to travel to Queens, as part of Vito's reluctance had to do with his long being a suspect in the murders of the three Bonanno captains (of which Massino was also involved). In my opinion, Vito and Nick Sr.'s reluctance or refusal to travel to the US also had to do with how much information the specific agencies of the American government had amassed on the both of them (and the Caruana-Cuntrera family as well), much of which is referenced in The Sixth Family.

- Why did Sal Vitale have to go to the Montreal area, on Massino's orders, to meet with Vito? Why wasn't Vito ordered to go to New York? If Cicale's recollection is true, does this mean Massino wasn't scared of Vito, as claimed by Vitale? That it was the other way around? Your answers to these questions of course depend on how you view Vitale, how much you think he knew about Montreal, how truthful you think he was/is, and how you view informants in general. I don't believe what Vitale has said about Sciascia's having killed Lo Presti first before indirectly asking permission to kill Lo Presti--in fact, I don't think Sciascia killed Lo Presti or had him killed. Vito grieved for many months after Lo Presti was killed, and I'm led to believe that Sciascia and Lo Presti were also tight. If Sciascia did kill Lo Presti and was presumed by Vito and others in Montreal to have been involved in the murder, then Vito et al. wouldn't have supposedly severed their relationship with the New York Bonannos after Sciascia's murder.

- If Nick Sr. was a captain of the Montreal crew, before or after American law enforcement's identification of such, why did Vitale express frustration when Vito--in answer to Vitale's question about who the Montrealers respect and would respect as the new captain of the Montreal crew--suggested Nick Sr. take over as captain of the Montreal crew? Lots of speculation follows: Was Nick Sr. not even a Bonanno? If he wasn't, why did Vito even suggest his father? Was Nick Sr. viewed with disdain by the Bonanno administration? If Nick Sr. and Vito were Bonannos--the latter being assumed to be one by virtue of Vitale's indirectly asking Vito to become captain to replace fellow paesano Gerlando Sciascia--does this put to rest the debate about whether key members of the Rizzuto organization were made into the Sicilian CN rather than the American LCN?

Lots of questions. Very few definitive answers, if any.

[HairyKnuckles]

Maybe this is a little too much to ask, but AntiMafia, do you have an accurate timeline for Sciascia? When exactly did he settle in NY? Is it possible that when he fled to Canada he was given the Montreal crew and after his acquittal and return to NY, was given a NY crew to run, the Montreal crew going to someone else?

I´ve read somewhere that LoPresti was acting captain when he was killed in 1992. At that time, was LoPresti under Sciascia or did he belong to the Montreal crew?

[Lupara]

I believe Sciascia always lived in New York after coming over from Sicily.

Btw, apparantly Cicale was answering questions live on the Cosa Nostra blog:

http://www.cosanostranews.com/2015/01/m ... icale.html

[HairyKnuckles]

I believe Sciascia always lived in New York after coming over from Sicily.

Didn´t he leave for Canada in or around 1984 to escape an indictment?

[antimafia]

I believe Sciascia always lived in New York after coming over from Sicily.

Didn´t he leave for Canada in or around 1984 to escape an indictment?

From Estanislao Oziewicz's June 30, 1997 article "Family ties trip up would-be immigrant: Canada says applicant is member of American Cosa Nostra," published in The Globe and Mail:

Mr. Sciascia, who immigrated to the United States from his native Sicily in 1955, is named in a 1988 U.S. Senate subcommittee report on organized crime as a member of the Cosa Nostra Bonanno organized crime family in New York.

...

In 1983, according to Federal Court of Canada records, Mr. Sciascia was indicted by the FBI in connection with an alleged heroin-trafficking conspiracy. He fled to Montreal where he hid under alias until he was arrested by the RCMP. Mr. Sciascia was detained in Canada for two years until 1988 when he lost his fight to avoid extradition to the United States. That year, his son, Joseph Mark Sciascia, 33, arrived in Canada as an independent-category immigrant.

...

After his acquittal, Mr. Sciascia and his wife, Mary, a native of Scotland, applied to immigrate to Canada. Their son, Joseph, acted as a sponsor. Mr. Sciascia lived in the Bronx and worked as a general labourer in the construction industry. According to his lawyers, he was also an owner and operator of two restaurants and a car wash.

...

Ms. Burrows said no humanitarian or compassionate grounds would overcome Mr. Sciascia's inadmissibility to Canada. "Although you have a son living in Canada, he has not become a Canadian citizen while your daughter who remains in the United States is a citizen of that country. As well, you have maintained employment and own property in the United States."
__________________

Bear in mind, as well, that Sciascia had purchased a lot or lots on the same street where Nick Sr., Vito, Paolo Renda, and Giuseppe Lo Presti purchased lots. I don't have time to look up the source but I'm fairly certain that Sciascia never did build a house or houses on the lot or lots he bought.

[antimafia]

I'm enjoying the discussion about Sciascia so I'm going to copy and paste some more excerpts, this time from an article that Adrian Humphreys penned in the National Post on August 22, 2003. All of you will notice the intriguing and somewhat contradictory statement, which appears farther below, from an unnamed investigator.

Known in the United States as "George From Canada," Mr. Sciascia was the liaison between powerful New York City and Montreal mobsters. He made millions of dollars co-ordinating the importation of tonnes of heroin into the United States through Canada and laundering the illicit proceeds around the world.

Despite his prominence as a capo, or captain, in New York's Bonanno family, and his close ties to some of the most significant mobsters on both sides of the border, Mr. Sciascia, then 66, was riddled with bullets and dumped in The Bronx.

...

"At the time of his death, Sciascia was a longstanding and powerful captain in the Bonanno family and served as a member of the Bonanno family's ruling panel. Sciascia had a crew of Bonanno family soldiers located in Canada who, through Sciascia, reported to Bonanno family boss Massino," said Roslynn R. Mauskopf, U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of New York, when unveiling a 13- count indictment.

...

The indictments created waves in Montreal yesterday.

"I don't know what surprises me more, the fact that someone like Sciascia was hit in the first place or the fact that the murder was actually solved," said one investigator, who did not want to be named.

"This will have repercussions in Montreal," said another.

"Sciascia was the liaison officer between Montreal and New York. He was the representative of Montreal in New York. For him to be taken out by a boss would require permission from Montreal -- and all sorts of stuff can come from this getting out," he said.

Mr. Sciascia was born on Feb. 15, 1934, in Sicily and had deep roots in the Mafia before coming to Canada and applying for permanent residency in 1982, according to a Federal Bureau of Investigation report.

...

In Montreal, he joined a faction of Sicilian mafiosi who were moving heroin through the city and became a fixture in internal intelligence reports prepared by the FBI and the RCMP throughout the late 1980s and 1990s.

He started dividing his time between New York and Montreal, maintaining homes in the Bronx, in Brewster, N.Y., and in Montreal. He also owned a couple of restaurants in both countries.

[HairyKnuckles]

Thanks AM. That´s great info.

[Rocco]

Well there you have it. Seems he was MOntreal's Capo and when he was clipped Massino offered it to Vito which he turned down and said it should be his father Nick.

"At the time of his death, Sciascia was a longstanding and powerful captain in the Bonanno family and served as a member of the Bonanno family's ruling panel. Sciascia had a crew of Bonanno family soldiers located in Canada who, through Sciascia, reported to Bonanno family boss Massino," said Roslynn R. Mauskopf, U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of New York, when unveiling a 13- count indictment."
'

[Angelo Santino]

Thanks, antimafia! Great info!

Agreed with Rocco, sounds like he was the "official" capo over Montreal with those sources. So Nick Rizzuto was never capo perhaps?

[Wiseguy]

Rocco is correct in raising the point about how unwise (if not downright stupid) it would have been for Vito to travel to New York to meet with Massino. I recall that The Sixth Family book mentions Vito and Nick Sr.'s reluctance or refusal to travel to the US, even avoiding trips that would involve a layover in an American city. I will add that Massino must have been aware of how imprudent it would have been for Vito to travel to Queens, as part of Vito's reluctance had to do with his long being a suspect in the murders of the three Bonanno captains (of which Massino was also involved). In my opinion, Vito and Nick Sr.'s reluctance or refusal to travel to the US also had to do with how much information the specific agencies of the American government had amassed on the both of them (and the Caruana-Cuntrera family as well), much of which is referenced in The Sixth Family.

In the Cicale Files it said Rizzuto drove down, i.e. intentionally avoided flying, for the meeting.

[Angelo Santino]

In the Cicale Files it said Rizzuto drove down, i.e. intentionally avoided flying, for the meeting.

Vito turned down Massino's offer to replace Sciascia as captain and didn't buy the story about Sciascia being killed in a robbery or drug deal. It got to the point where rumors started to get back to Massino about Rizzuto and "he did not like what he was hearing so he immediately sent for Vito to get his ass down to Maspeth, Queens, in New York where Joe informed Vito who the boss was and that Canada was still under the control of the Bonanno family. Vito may not have agreed with what Massino said but he listened. The monies were still coming in from all the illegal activities in Canada, even after the murder of George Sciascia" (which is where many have speculated the break happened). "Vito had no choice. If he did not show, he could have easily gotten killed - even by someone close to him in Canada. Keep in mind that everyone is always looking to move up in the ranks. Rizzuto carried out other orders issued from New York.

Didn't read the book, but meeting in Maspeth sounds stupidly dangerous. But I have to remind myself that one "Genius" got recorded saying "I'm the underboss now, I'm over everybody." I'm not advocating that these get away with a criminal conspiracy but meeting in upstate NY would be safer. Unless forcing Vito to come to Maspeth had some "I call you come" symbolism implied,

[Rocco]

Rocco is correct in raising the point about how unwise (if not downright stupid) it would have been for Vito to travel to New York to meet with Massino. I recall that The Sixth Family book mentions Vito and Nick Sr.'s reluctance or refusal to travel to the US, even avoiding trips that would involve a layover in an American city. I will add that Massino must have been aware of how imprudent it would have been for Vito to travel to Queens, as part of Vito's reluctance had to do with his long being a suspect in the murders of the three Bonanno captains (of which Massino was also involved). In my opinion, Vito and Nick Sr.'s reluctance or refusal to travel to the US also had to do with how much information the specific agencies of the American government had amassed on the both of them (and the Caruana-Cuntrera family as well), much of which is referenced in The Sixth Family.

In the Cicale Files it said Rizzuto drove down, i.e. intentionally avoided flying, for the meeting.

I think Cicale is full of shit there...again just my opinion. Like every guy who flips there is some truth and allot of bullshit. Allot of what Cicale is saying even about Massino and Bascianos relationship doesn't add up to what Massino has said..which is pretty much that Massino didn't like Vinny and he avoided him when he even came to maspeth. Allot of what Cicale talks about he wasnt be privy too. Also he was pretty much a newbie in the family. I don't buy Rizzuto jumping when Massin says how hi etc... If that was the case Massino never would have sent Vitale up to Montreal from then getgo. He would have sent Vito down to NY...but he didn't. Also sending for Vito to come to NY was not Massinos lowkey style. Knowing full well Vito would be under Canadian and FBI survaliance. Doesn't add up. Remember Massino had spoken allot about the hit on George in the trial and his worries about retaliation from Montreal and even the NY zips. Vitale has spoke about this too. Both of these guys would have said they ordered Vito to NY...but they didn't...

[Lupara]

I agree, with all the evidence that is provided, Sciascia indeed seems to have been the official caporegime. But again I raise the question: when did he take over the Montreal crew considering that he was already a capo before Cotroni died?

With the all the contradictory information being given by different sources, there is only one solution: new research need to be done. On the one hand you have guys who are eager to believe that Montreal is this powerful, independent organization, represented by the Sixth Family authors, and on the other hand you have the conservative guys who believe Montreal remained a Bonanno crew. I lean towards conservative myself, although not entirely.

Anyway, what I wonder about now more than ever is why didn't the feds referred to Massino instead of Vitale? And if they did, why did the authors of the Sixth Family and others not base their information on Massino's statements? Vitale's words are just not credible enough because he basically admitted that he didn't have a clue. Cicale's word alone isn't strong enough either. Just as in court cases, we need another corroborating witness.