General Mob Questions

[JeremyTheJew]

Jeff canarie said that he is in the know and knows that genovese was beaten up in Havana for calling a meeting with Luciano and told lucky he was taking over and got beaten up instead …. Leading to Luciano getting busted

….anyone hear that….??? Hmmm….
This is pre Appalachian supposedly….

[Ivan]

Did John Gotti really say "Five, ten years from now they're gonna wish there was an American Cosa Nostra. Five, ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti." or is that just something they made up for the movie?

It certainly sounds like something he would say, so if it's fictional the writers did a good job of capturing his character in made-up dialogue. Was just wondering if it's real.

[DonPeppino386]

Did John Gotti really say "Five, ten years from now they're gonna wish there was an American Cosa Nostra. Five, ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti." or is that just something they made up for the movie?

It certainly sounds like something he would say, so if it's fictional the writers did a good job of capturing his character in made-up dialogue. Was just wondering if it's real.

I've always wondered this myself. Ive never seen an actual source that confirms he said this. The producers of the movie could have had access to a source that had much more info. then what is available to the public, but who knows.

[Ivan]

Did John Gotti really say "Five, ten years from now they're gonna wish there was an American Cosa Nostra. Five, ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti." or is that just something they made up for the movie?

It certainly sounds like something he would say, so if it's fictional the writers did a good job of capturing his character in made-up dialogue. Was just wondering if it's real.

I've always wondered this myself. Ive never seen an actual source that confirms he said this. The producers of the movie could have had access to a source that had much more info. then what is available to the public, but who knows.

What has me confused is that it sounds *exactly* like him but I've never seen it cited anywhere. So it's a fake quote that sounds real. Maybe.

[stubbs]

Can anyone tell me anything about a Charlie/Charles "Chuckie" Luisi? He appears in this photo with Trucchio and is labelled a Genovese soldier but I don't believe that to be true. I've also seen someone say he is a Lucchese associate. I haven't been able to find anything on this guy when I've looked these epast couple of days.

Is that Ja Rule?

[OcSleeper]

Yes

[TallGuy19]

In a recent interview with Vlad TV, former federal prosecutors Dan Dorsky and Mike Campi claimed that Allie Shades was going to help Gotti kill Chin so he could take over the Genovese family. Has anyone ever heard this before?

[JeremyTheJew]

In a recent interview with Vlad TV, former federal prosecutors Dan Dorsky and Mike Campi claimed that Allie Shades was going to help Gotti kill Chin so he could take over the Genovese family. Has anyone ever heard this before?

Allie is a interesting one
Great book on him and the garbage cartel called TAKEDOWN

[DonPeppino386]

In a recent interview with Vlad TV, former federal prosecutors Dan Dorsky and Mike Campi claimed that Allie Shades was going to help Gotti kill Chin so he could take over the Genovese family. Has anyone ever heard this before?

Allie is a interesting one
Great book on him and the garbage cartel called TAKEDOWN

Second that. Really great book that gives shows how Cosa Nostra controlled garbage in NYC. One of the only print sources of info for guys like Allie Shades, Joe Francolino, Angelo Ponte, etc. I highly recommend it.

[JeremyTheJew]

In a recent interview with Vlad TV, former federal prosecutors Dan Dorsky and Mike Campi claimed that Allie Shades was going to help Gotti kill Chin so he could take over the Genovese family. Has anyone ever heard this before?

Allie is a interesting one
Great book on him and the garbage cartel called TAKEDOWN

Second that. Really great book that gives shows how Cosa Nostra controlled garbage in NYC. One of the only print sources of info for guys like Allie Shades, Joe Francolino, Angelo Ponte, etc. I highly recommend it.

Yes and it compares the way the Gotti admin controlled the garbage and the Gigantes

For Gotti side they had…. Joe Francolino who took over from Jimy Brown Failia - I believe he did or something like that- interesting bc he was just a soldier running the racket.

Chin had Allie.

Then you had Angelo Ponte who was an associate.

I think that was Allie’s last case - anyone know if he’s active???

[chin_gigante]

In a recent interview with Vlad TV, former federal prosecutors Dan Dorsky and Mike Campi claimed that Allie Shades was going to help Gotti kill Chin so he could take over the Genovese family. Has anyone ever heard this before?

Jerry Capeci reported on it when some of the transcripts regarding Alan Longo came out about 20 years ago

[TallGuy19]

In a recent interview with Vlad TV, former federal prosecutors Dan Dorsky and Mike Campi claimed that Allie Shades was going to help Gotti kill Chin so he could take over the Genovese family. Has anyone ever heard this before?

Jerry Capeci reported on it when some of the transcripts regarding Alan Longo came out about 20 years ago

This is the first I've heard of it. I wonder if it caused any issues for Allie Shades when it first came out.

[JohnnyS]

In a recent interview with Vlad TV, former federal prosecutors Dan Dorsky and Mike Campi claimed that Allie Shades was going to help Gotti kill Chin so he could take over the Genovese family. Has anyone ever heard this before?

Jerry Capeci reported on it when some of the transcripts regarding Alan Longo came out about 20 years ago

This is the first I've heard of it. I wonder if it caused any issues for Allie Shades when it first came out.

Here's the article from 2001.

At the same time Genovese boss Vincent (Chin) Gigante was plotting to blow up arch rival John Gotti, the Dapper Don was plotting to whack Chin and replace him with a Genovese capo who was a longtime friend, Gang Land has learned.
Key players in the plot with Gotti were Genovese capo Alfonso (Allie Shades) Malangone and former Luchese underboss Anthony (Gaspipe) Casso, according to an FBI summary of tape recorded remarks that Genovese capo Alan (Baldie) Longo (right) made last fall during a three year FBI probe of the Genovese clan.

"John Gotti was taking over. (Be)cause our friend (Malangone) grew up with him, we could make a deal. He (Chin) was dead," Longo said, adding that the whole thing fell apart because Casso declined to take part.

"If Gaspipe could have been talked into killing our friend, you know who would have been our boss, Alley Shades … He was always up John's ass," said Longo, who was Malangone's bodyguard chauffeur in 1988, when the plot was hatched.

Casso, who began cooperating with the feds in 1994 but subsequently fell out of favor, has admitted being involved in a scheme with Gigante in a bomb plot to blow up Gotti, but has never been connected to a plot to whack Gigante. Chin hated Gotti because he violated a cardinal mob rule and killed his boss, Paul Castellano, without authority from the commission, the mob's board of directors.
Malangone, a former major player in the city's private sanitation business now serving 5-to-15 years for racketeering, often visited Gotti at the Ravenite Social Club and was videotaped with him there. He and Longo even attended Gotti's 49th birthday party there, according to court records.

"Longo described how one night (he) and Malangone met with Gotti after Gotti came from a meeting with Chin," FBI agent Michael Campi said in his report of an Oct. 18, 2000 conversation Longo had with undercover operative Michael (Cookie) Durso.

The Gotti-Gigante sitdown, the first and last one they ever had, took place in 1988 in Greenwich Village with leaders of the Gambino, Genovese and Luchese crime families. After that get-together, Longo, now 51, and Malangone, now 64, met with Gotti above the Ravenite in an apartment that Gotti often used for high-level talks

with underboss Salvatore (Sammy Bull) Gravano, according to the FBI report. A year later, an FBI bug in the apartment caught Gotti admitting three murders. Those tape recordings sunk him at his 1992 murder and racketeering trial.
"I just met your friend," Longo quoted Gotti as telling them. "Come up in the apartment. I want to tell you something. What would Chin say if he knew I told you everything Chin told me? What would he say if he ever knew you told me stuff?"

"That was John, that was John," said Longo.

Longo, one of two reputed members of the Genovese ruling committee nailed for a litany of racketeering charges in the probe, also told Durso – who was an associate and not a made member – about many high-level decisions and dealings he was either involved in, or knew of, involving his own family and other families. He said capo Ralph Coppola (left) – who has been missing and presumed murdered since October, 1998 – was disappointed he wasn't named acting boss and that Frank (Farby) Serpico, 57, (right) another Genovese ruling member nailed

with Longo in the investigation, got the post because he was friendly with Gigante's brother Mario. "When Mario went to jail, they put Farby there. That's how he got there," he said.
At the urging of Genovese capo Salvatore (Sammy Meatballs) Aparo, (right) Longo arranged a meeting with Colombo underboss John (Jackie) DeRoss over money the Colombos owed to capo Joseph Zito.

Longo stressed that he would resolve the dispute with the family's acting boss Alphonse (Allie) Persico, when he got out of prison. That hasn't happened, but Longo may get a chance to talk to Persico about it at the Metropolitan Detention Center, where they're both detained awaiting trial.

Longo "believes the Genovese family is so much stronger than the other families in the event there was a war," said the FBI report, adding that Longo said the Genoveses have "30 or 40 quality guys," naming codefendants Aparo, 72, Pasquale (Patty Boy) Falcetti, 42, and Peter (Petey Red) DiChiara, 58, among them.

"Don't let anyone tell you we're dead. Cause we're here," Longo said, telling Durso that he and other "tough guys" would soon be inducted to strengthen

the family even more, which the FBI report said refers to "people capable of murder."
"Whenever we step out and do something (murder, according to the FBI report ) we going to get the guys we can trust and do it," Longo said, according to the report.

Citing Longo's remarks and testimony by FBI agent Joy Adam, Assistant U.S. Attorney Paul Weinstein convinced Brooklyn Magistrate Judge Cheryl Pollak that Longo was a danger to the community. He was held without bail.

Weinstein and co-prosecutors Daniel Dorsky, Jill Feeney and Paul Schoeman detained nine of the 18 indicted defendants they sought to remand. There are 40 mobsters and associates in the case, charged with extortion, loansharking, gambling, marijuana dealing, labor racketeering, money laundering, wire fraud, stock fraud, and bank robberies, among other crimes. One is a fugitive.

"We never got to hear the tapes," said Longo's lawyer Joseph Sorrentino. "We think the words in the reports are taken out of context and that the conclusions made by the FBI are completely ridiculous. We are considering an appeal to the trial Judge in the case."

[TallGuy19]

In a recent interview with Vlad TV, former federal prosecutors Dan Dorsky and Mike Campi claimed that Allie Shades was going to help Gotti kill Chin so he could take over the Genovese family. Has anyone ever heard this before?

Jerry Capeci reported on it when some of the transcripts regarding Alan Longo came out about 20 years ago

This is the first I've heard of it. I wonder if it caused any issues for Allie Shades when it first came out.

Here's the article from 2001.

At the same time Genovese boss Vincent (Chin) Gigante was plotting to blow up arch rival John Gotti, the Dapper Don was plotting to whack Chin and replace him with a Genovese capo who was a longtime friend, Gang Land has learned.
Key players in the plot with Gotti were Genovese capo Alfonso (Allie Shades) Malangone and former Luchese underboss Anthony (Gaspipe) Casso, according to an FBI summary of tape recorded remarks that Genovese capo Alan (Baldie) Longo (right) made last fall during a three year FBI probe of the Genovese clan.

"John Gotti was taking over. (Be)cause our friend (Malangone) grew up with him, we could make a deal. He (Chin) was dead," Longo said, adding that the whole thing fell apart because Casso declined to take part.

"If Gaspipe could have been talked into killing our friend, you know who would have been our boss, Alley Shades … He was always up John's ass," said Longo, who was Malangone's bodyguard chauffeur in 1988, when the plot was hatched.

Casso, who began cooperating with the feds in 1994 but subsequently fell out of favor, has admitted being involved in a scheme with Gigante in a bomb plot to blow up Gotti, but has never been connected to a plot to whack Gigante. Chin hated Gotti because he violated a cardinal mob rule and killed his boss, Paul Castellano, without authority from the commission, the mob's board of directors.
Malangone, a former major player in the city's private sanitation business now serving 5-to-15 years for racketeering, often visited Gotti at the Ravenite Social Club and was videotaped with him there. He and Longo even attended Gotti's 49th birthday party there, according to court records.

"Longo described how one night (he) and Malangone met with Gotti after Gotti came from a meeting with Chin," FBI agent Michael Campi said in his report of an Oct. 18, 2000 conversation Longo had with undercover operative Michael (Cookie) Durso.

The Gotti-Gigante sitdown, the first and last one they ever had, took place in 1988 in Greenwich Village with leaders of the Gambino, Genovese and Luchese crime families. After that get-together, Longo, now 51, and Malangone, now 64, met with Gotti above the Ravenite in an apartment that Gotti often used for high-level talks

with underboss Salvatore (Sammy Bull) Gravano, according to the FBI report. A year later, an FBI bug in the apartment caught Gotti admitting three murders. Those tape recordings sunk him at his 1992 murder and racketeering trial.
"I just met your friend," Longo quoted Gotti as telling them. "Come up in the apartment. I want to tell you something. What would Chin say if he knew I told you everything Chin told me? What would he say if he ever knew you told me stuff?"

"That was John, that was John," said Longo.

Longo, one of two reputed members of the Genovese ruling committee nailed for a litany of racketeering charges in the probe, also told Durso – who was an associate and not a made member – about many high-level decisions and dealings he was either involved in, or knew of, involving his own family and other families. He said capo Ralph Coppola (left) – who has been missing and presumed murdered since October, 1998 – was disappointed he wasn't named acting boss and that Frank (Farby) Serpico, 57, (right) another Genovese ruling member nailed

with Longo in the investigation, got the post because he was friendly with Gigante's brother Mario. "When Mario went to jail, they put Farby there. That's how he got there," he said.
At the urging of Genovese capo Salvatore (Sammy Meatballs) Aparo, (right) Longo arranged a meeting with Colombo underboss John (Jackie) DeRoss over money the Colombos owed to capo Joseph Zito.

Longo stressed that he would resolve the dispute with the family's acting boss Alphonse (Allie) Persico, when he got out of prison. That hasn't happened, but Longo may get a chance to talk to Persico about it at the Metropolitan Detention Center, where they're both detained awaiting trial.

Longo "believes the Genovese family is so much stronger than the other families in the event there was a war," said the FBI report, adding that Longo said the Genoveses have "30 or 40 quality guys," naming codefendants Aparo, 72, Pasquale (Patty Boy) Falcetti, 42, and Peter (Petey Red) DiChiara, 58, among them.

"Don't let anyone tell you we're dead. Cause we're here," Longo said, telling Durso that he and other "tough guys" would soon be inducted to strengthen

the family even more, which the FBI report said refers to "people capable of murder."
"Whenever we step out and do something (murder, according to the FBI report ) we going to get the guys we can trust and do it," Longo said, according to the report.

Citing Longo's remarks and testimony by FBI agent Joy Adam, Assistant U.S. Attorney Paul Weinstein convinced Brooklyn Magistrate Judge Cheryl Pollak that Longo was a danger to the community. He was held without bail.

Weinstein and co-prosecutors Daniel Dorsky, Jill Feeney and Paul Schoeman detained nine of the 18 indicted defendants they sought to remand. There are 40 mobsters and associates in the case, charged with extortion, loansharking, gambling, marijuana dealing, labor racketeering, money laundering, wire fraud, stock fraud, and bank robberies, among other crimes. One is a fugitive.

"We never got to hear the tapes," said Longo's lawyer Joseph Sorrentino. "We think the words in the reports are taken out of context and that the conclusions made by the FBI are completely ridiculous. We are considering an appeal to the trial Judge in the case."

[johnny_scootch]

Chin didn’t trust Allie Shades he knew he was close to Gotti and that he went to the Ravenite all the time. I remember reading that when Chin and Vic agreed to kill Gotti it was the Genovese who were originally going to do the work. Chin said he would give it to his New Jersey guys because he was worried if he gave to his NY guys word would get back to Gotti. I don’t remember why but eventually the Lucchese family takes over the contract and Frankie DeCicco gets blown up.