Angelo Monachino and Joseph Lanovara testimony notes/ Rochester discussion

[JoeCamel]

The break away Buffalo faction is different from Rochester? Any more info on that? Did they overlap. Sorry to the serious researchers, I try to follow along.

[chin_gigante]

The break away Buffalo faction is different from Rochester? Any more info on that? Did they overlap. Sorry to the serious researchers, I try to follow along.

In 1969, there was a faction of the family in Buffalo that renounced Magaddino as boss basically because of his greed. Key guys in this faction were Joseph Fino, Daniel Sansanese Sr, Sam Frangiamore, Roy Carlisi, Joe DiCarlo, Sam Pieri, John Cammilleri... Ronald Fino says his father was made acting boss of this faction with Sansanese as underboss and Frangiamore as consigliere. However FBI files from the time list Sam Pieri as acting boss of this faction, with Fino as acting underboss and DiCarlo as acting consigliere.

Ronald Fino was never a member so his information may be wrong but he says both his father and Sam Pieri talked to him openly about cosa nostra. Pieri specifically was looking to propose him for membership around 1977 and Fino remarks he was surprised by how open he was. Fino also quite adamantly states that even though Pieri is thought of as a boss he never actually was, "but in many ways his power was almost equal".

I'm not sure who the source was who provided the information about Pieri-Fino-DiCarlo being the information, though Ronald Fino claims both his father and Steve Cannarozzo were FBI informants, so conceivably it could be either of them. Maybe someone more educated about the Buffalo family knows who it was. If it was a member source, I'd be more likely to go with that information over Ronald Fino's. After all, it's possible he got the wrong end of the stick. Like how Michael Franzese insists that his father was the Colombo underboss during the 60s when we know he wasn't.

Fino says the actual leadership of the family was disputed from 1969 to 1972, when the leadership of the Buffalo faction was called to a commission meeting. Genovese acting boss Thomas Eboli then told them what they had done in ousting Magaddino was wrong. Prior to going to the meeting, Fino and the other faction leaders agreed to oppose the ruling if the commission went against them, but when it actually happened only Fino held out (and was forced to concede after everyone else did). He says Frangiamore was then made boss.

Fino also says that the breakaway Buffalo faction granted Rochester and Canada "autonomy", though Rochester refused to come back into the fold after the commission's ruling. In 1974, Cammilleri and Joe Fino planned to break away from Frangiamore and join up with Rochester to create a new family. Buffalo at this point reported to the Genovese family on the commission, but Ronald Fino's wording makes it sound like this Rochester-Cammilleri group was looking to fall under the influence of the Bonanno family. Fino writes that soldiers under his father and Cammilleri defected to the Frangiamore side, leading to Cammilleri's murder. Sam Pieri later told Fino that his father's life was spared because of him (Pieri). Pieri supposedly argued that without Cammilleri, Fino wouldn't pose a threat to the family leadership.

[NorthBuffalo]

I think Ron Fino somewhat alludes to his father joining the Feds once Eboli of the Genovese family ruled against him and for Randaccio - I read his book and thought it was excellent but agree he exaggerates a great deal about his father's influence and his personal relationships with mobsters in other cities like Chicago. I also noticed some of his details are off - he talks about a meeting at the Turf Club days after getting his spot on the Labor Unions - I know for a fact that anyone in organized labor would have been avoiding that place in the 1960s. He also misidentifies the true owners of the Turf Club.

[NorthBuffalo]

Turf Club was owned by Christy Gugliuzza who was also an officer in Union 210. It was an edict to avoid that place if you were in one of the locals in Buffalo.

[B.]

The FBI said in later reports that around the mid-1970s Frangiamore kept his position but unofficially Joe Pieri became the de facto boss of the Buffalo faction after the Frangiamore, Fino, and Pieri groups came to an agreement. Sam Pieri and Joe DiCarlo were carried as captains but were obviously the power behind Joe Pieri, who became consigliere sometime later. Joe Pieri was powerful in his own right of course but his brother's legal trouble and DiCarlo's age/health are likely the reasons he stepped up.

Niagara Falls stayed loyal to Magaddino and Ben Nicoletti was the "boss" of their faction. Magaddino was apparently still recognized as a Commission member into the early 1970s as the San Francisco Family was represented by them and Tony Lima said they were supposed to notify Magaddino about leadership changes but the relationship had fallen by the wayside. Guessing Magaddino's death in 74 is when Buffalo was taken off the Commission and assigned to the Genovese.

[JoeCamel]

The break away Buffalo faction is different from Rochester? Any more info on that? Did they overlap. Sorry to the serious researchers, I try to follow along.

In 1969, there was a faction of the family in Buffalo that renounced Magaddino as boss basically because of his greed. Key guys in this faction were Joseph Fino, Daniel Sansanese Sr, Sam Frangiamore, Roy Carlisi, Joe DiCarlo, Sam Pieri, John Cammilleri... Ronald Fino says his father was made acting boss of this faction with Sansanese as underboss and Frangiamore as consigliere. However FBI files from the time list Sam Pieri as acting boss of this faction, with Fino as acting underboss and DiCarlo as acting consigliere.

Ronald Fino was never a member so his information may be wrong but he says both his father and Sam Pieri talked to him openly about cosa nostra. Pieri specifically was looking to propose him for membership around 1977 and Fino remarks he was surprised by how open he was. Fino also quite adamantly states that even though Pieri is thought of as a boss he never actually was, "but in many ways his power was almost equal".

I'm not sure who the source was who provided the information about Pieri-Fino-DiCarlo being the information, though Ronald Fino claims both his father and Steve Cannarozzo were FBI informants, so conceivably it could be either of them. Maybe someone more educated about the Buffalo family knows who it was. If it was a member source, I'd be more likely to go with that information over Ronald Fino's. After all, it's possible he got the wrong end of the stick. Like how Michael Franzese insists that his father was the Colombo underboss during the 60s when we know he wasn't.

Fino says the actual leadership of the family was disputed from 1969 to 1972, when the leadership of the Buffalo faction was called to a commission meeting. Genovese acting boss Thomas Eboli then told them what they had done in ousting Magaddino was wrong. Prior to going to the meeting, Fino and the other faction leaders agreed to oppose the ruling if the commission went against them, but when it actually happened only Fino held out (and was forced to concede after everyone else did). He says Frangiamore was then made boss.

Fino also says that the breakaway Buffalo faction granted Rochester and Canada "autonomy", though Rochester refused to come back into the fold after the commission's ruling. In 1974, Cammilleri and Joe Fino planned to break away from Frangiamore and join up with Rochester to create a new family. Buffalo at this point reported to the Genovese family on the commission, but Ronald Fino's wording makes it sound like this Rochester-Cammilleri group was looking to fall under the influence of the Bonanno family. Fino writes that soldiers under his father and Cammilleri defected to the Frangiamore side, leading to Cammilleri's murder. Sam Pieri later told Fino that his father's life was spared because of him (Pieri). Pieri supposedly argued that without Cammilleri, Fino wouldn't pose a threat to the family leadership.

Wow I just got 3 serious ass informative posts for the price of 1 thank you guys I’m enjoying it

[chin_gigante]

The following notes are from Gary Craig’s April 2004 articles about Thomas Marotta for the Democrat and Chronicle:

- “Court records are unclear” on the exact date of Marotta’s induction ceremony but it took place in late 1971 or early 1972
- In December 2000, Marotta was caught on tape talking about his ceremony
- Salvatore Gingello told Marotta, “Get dressed up tonight, we gotta go somewhere”
- Gingello took Marotta to Frank Valenti’s home in Henrietta
- Over 30 people, including a local college professor, were waiting and asked Marotta is he wanted to join the organisation
- “I sat around with three guys I know are stool pigeons, and they’re OK’ing me”

Thoughts:

- This confirms that at least two different induction ceremonies were held at Valenti’s farm during his time as boss (I wouldn’t be surprised if more or perhaps all of the ceremonies Valenti conducted were held there)
- This also confirms that virtually the entire family was present for multiple ceremonies, a practice followed by other borgatas at different times (Los Angeles, Philadelphia, I’m sure more that I can’t think of right now)
- Again, confirmation that a local college professor was a member

Gary Craig also writes that the 1982 RICO indictment and some trial transcripts are available on the Democrat and Chronicle website. Obviously, since the articles are from almost 20 years ago, that material no longer seems to be available. Does anyone happen to have a preserved link to them or a download of the documents themselves from when they were available? I would be very interested in seeing the actual documents for myself.

[Pogo The Clown]

Gary Craig also writes that the 1982 RICO indictment and some trial transcripts are available on the Democrat and Chronicle website. Obviously, since the articles are from almost 20 years ago, that material no longer seems to be available. Does anyone happen to have a preserved link to them or a download of the documents themselves from when they were available? I would be very interested in seeing the actual documents for myself.

I don't have a link or download but I printed them out way back then. I posted the interesting parts on the first page of this thread.


Pogo

[Newyorkempire]

If a college professor can be made into Rochester a high school teacher can be made into Buffalo. More contrary evidence to certain poster's assumptions.

[Wiseguy]

If a college professor can be made into Rochester a high school teacher can be made into Buffalo. More contrary evidence to certain poster's assumptions.

Keep dreaming.

[Newyorkempire]

If a college professor can be made into Rochester a high school teacher can be made into Buffalo. More contrary evidence to certain poster's assumptions.

Keep dreaming.

"-Again, confirmation that a local college professor was a member"

These arent dreams. These are facts. Youve been refuted yet again. Similar to when you thought that elder age of a member means they arent active As much as it hurts you have to keep moving forward. You are not the beacon of enlightenment you wish you were.

[JCB1977]

I think Ron Fino somewhat alludes to his father joining the Feds once Eboli of the Genovese family ruled against him and for Randaccio - I read his book and thought it was excellent but agree he exaggerates a great deal about his father's influence and his personal relationships with mobsters in other cities like Chicago. I also noticed some of his details are off - he talks about a meeting at the Turf Club days after getting his spot on the Labor Unions - I know for a fact that anyone in organized labor would have been avoiding that place in the 1960s. He also misidentifies the true owners of the Turf Club.

Joe Fino was born and raised in Milwaukee, WI...he had been tracked by FBI agents in cities like Boston, Milwaukee, Cleveland off the top of my head, what's so far fetched about his relationships with members in other cities or Chicago?

[JCB1977]

I think Ron Fino somewhat alludes to his father joining the Feds once Eboli of the Genovese family ruled against him and for Randaccio - I read his book and thought it was excellent but agree he exaggerates a great deal about his father's influence and his personal relationships with mobsters in other cities like Chicago. I also noticed some of his details are off - he talks about a meeting at the Turf Club days after getting his spot on the Labor Unions - I know for a fact that anyone in organized labor would have been avoiding that place in the 1960s. He also misidentifies the true owners of the Turf Club.

Sam Giancana had a golf buddy who ran the Erie-Buffalo policy wheel named Sam Pardee...Fino may not have been exaggerating his dad's personal relationships with other members in other families.

[newera_212]

Gary Craig also writes that the 1982 RICO indictment and some trial transcripts are available on the Democrat and Chronicle website. Obviously, since the articles are from almost 20 years ago, that material no longer seems to be available. Does anyone happen to have a preserved link to them or a download of the documents themselves from when they were available? I would be very interested in seeing the actual documents for myself.

Not sure if internet archive or way back machine would work - but I know the Rochester Democrat and Chronicle was purchased by Gannet (USA Today) a while ago and completely changed their website from something that was tolerable to one of those sites that look like they were designed to torture you and give your computer AIDS. There probably aren't too many staffers left there that are holdovers from before the merger - but I'm wondering if it's worth a shot trying to contact someone there (especially if someone is on staff that has written about Rochester LCN in the past...) expressing interest in it. I mean it has to be somewhere - I love how USA Today probably did not want to bother to continue hosting stuff like that, things that are little additions to the article, because there's no way to generate ad money when people click on it

[Wiseguy]

If a college professor can be made into Rochester a high school teacher can be made into Buffalo. More contrary evidence to certain poster's assumptions.

Keep dreaming.

"-Again, confirmation that a local college professor was a member"

These arent dreams. These are facts. Youve been refuted yet again. Similar to when you thought that elder age of a member means they arent active As much as it hurts you have to keep moving forward. You are not the beacon of enlightenment you wish you were.

Please. You're so desperate to find a single member beyond the 11 remaining members, so you can justify the 30+ member myth, you'd accept some 1/2 Italian tranny who "identifies" as a member of the Buffalo mob.