General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

[Newyorkempire]

So Vena is the most feared man in Chicago but the Outfit doesn't mean anything anymore. Makes sense

[Wiseguy]

Members more or less being legitimate, while supplamenting their income with gambling and loansharking, is a common trait we see with families on their way out. When you look into these cases, the last ones of significance on an organizational level are the Family Secrets case in 2005, and to a lesser extent, the Sarno case in 2009. You're looking at perhaps 15 living members, half of which will probably be dead within the next decade.

[PolackTony]

Wait, WTF. Bobby P has been paroled??

He still has to serve his federal sentence out until 2030, though. He got transferred from Illinois state prison to a federal one in Kentucky. I wonder if his state and federal sentences were concurrent and they just paroled him in state to get one more guy off their hands.

Ah ok, thanks. I see now that Panozzo is in Manchester FCI. But Koroluk doesn't show in the Federal BOP locator (if either of these guys are out, lock your doors and shut your windows)?

Lol especially since Koroluk lives a five minute walk from me.

Parole or not, no way that guy just goes straight. He's been an inveterate thug and walking crime wave his whole life.

[Wiseguy]

Of the reputed crop of current made guys, two of them are very rough guys, former gangbangers who did serious time for murder and shootings, and rumored to be involved in some pretty crazy stuff today (e.g., executing a kid for stealing a truck from a made guy). Three others run highly lucrative restaurants and Italian food distribution/import companies. Matteo LoBue, for example, is the President of Greco & Sons, which was sold to Cisco recently for almost $1 billion while permitted to retain local autonomous management. So, the guys in the inner circle today based on the little info that we have run the gamut from the most blue-collar (as in prison blues) to the most white-collar.

I'm amazed at how fast LoBue went from being a rumored member on the forum to the inner circle of the Outfit today. Talk about a fast rise.

[PolackTony]

Of the reputed crop of current made guys, two of them are very rough guys, former gangbangers who did serious time for murder and shootings, and rumored to be involved in some pretty crazy stuff today (e.g., executing a kid for stealing a truck from a made guy). Three others run highly lucrative restaurants and Italian food distribution/import companies. Matteo LoBue, for example, is the President of Greco & Sons, which was sold to Cisco recently for almost $1 billion while permitted to retain local autonomous management. So, the guys in the inner circle today based on the little info that we have run the gamut from the most blue-collar (as in prison blues) to the most white-collar.

I'm amazed at how fast LoBue went from being a rumored member on the forum to the inner circle of the Outfit today. Talk about a fast rise.

He's a go-getter.

I should have prefaced the final sentence in the above quote with "if the info that Antiliar's source reported is factual". If it is the case that LoBue is a made guy, then yes, I think it's fair to say that he'd be considered in the "inner circle".

[UTC]

Way out of hand. Thought he'd be effective too.

The fundamental question is, will Sarno be as effective as a boss like no Nose was? He will be, even more so? But until he is, it's going to be hard to verify that we think he'll be more effective.

I thought it, but I was wrong. Too crude for this time.

[SonnyBlackstein]

For what it's worth, I have never though that Sarno was truly the boss of the outfit. The FBI never charged him as "boss" or confirmed that status, so there is no official record to back it up.

Thr government has never identified any Outfit member as anything other than a member. They've never used "boss," "underboss," or "capo" when referring to indicted persons.

That makes little sense. Everywhere else the Feds jump at the chance to throw a label on someone.

It carries far more weight/severity if you're classified a leader of a criminal organization vs a simple member.

Big difference between giving the orders vs following them.

[Snakes]

For what it's worth, I have never though that Sarno was truly the boss of the outfit. The FBI never charged him as "boss" or confirmed that status, so there is no official record to back it up.

Thr government has never identified any Outfit member as anything other than a member. They've never used "boss," "underboss," or "capo" when referring to indicted persons.

That makes little sense. Everywhere else the Feds jump at the chance to throw a label on someone.

It carries far more weight/severity if you're classified a leader of a criminal organization vs a simple member.

Big difference between giving the orders vs following them.

It was just a different strategy used by the Chicago FBI. I don't think it's a coincidence that one of the only times they specified positions in an indictment was when Nicholas Calabrese testified.

Also, they still identified "leaders" of racketeering enterprises, they just refrained from using terms like "boss" or "capo," i.e., "Sarno was head of a racketeering enterprise." They had less concern with proving them to be LCN leaders than they did proving that they headed an group (crew) of individuals committing criminal acts.

[SonnyBlackstein]

Also, they still identified "leaders" of racketeering enterprises, they just refrained from using terms like "boss" or "capo," i.e., "Sarno was head of a racketeering enterprise." They had less concern with proving them to be LCN leaders than they did proving that they headed an group (crew) of individuals committing criminal acts.

Fair call. Cheers. Interesting a particular FBI Branch would pursue a differing strategy vs multiple others.

[Patrickgold]

Of the reputed crop of current made guys, two of them are very rough guys, former gangbangers who did serious time for murder and shootings, and rumored to be involved in some pretty crazy stuff today (e.g., executing a kid for stealing a truck from a made guy). Three others run highly lucrative restaurants and Italian food distribution/import companies. Matteo LoBue, for example, is the President of Greco & Sons, which was sold to Cisco recently for almost $1 billion while permitted to retain local autonomous management. So, the guys in the inner circle today based on the little info that we have run the gamut from the most blue-collar (as in prison blues) to the most white-collar.

I'm amazed at how fast LoBue went from being a rumored member on the forum to the inner circle of the Outfit today. Talk about a fast rise.

He's a go-getter.

I should have prefaced the final sentence in the above quote with "if the info that Antiliar's source reported is factual". If it is the case that LoBue is a made guy, then yes, I think it's fair to say that he'd be considered in the "inner circle".

If you are a close personal friend of Solly D does that make you inner circle?

[Patrickgold]

Wait, WTF. Bobby P has been paroled??

He still has to serve his federal sentence out until 2030, though. He got transferred from Illinois state prison to a federal one in Kentucky. I wonder if his state and federal sentences were concurrent and they just paroled him in state to get one more guy off their hands.

Ah ok, thanks. I see now that Panozzo is in Manchester FCI. But Koroluk doesn't show in the Federal BOP locator (if either of these guys are out, lock your doors and shut your windows)?

Yep he’s out. Got out this year. Remember he pled guilty first to the state charge. He never got hit with the federal charge that Panozzo got. Panozzo got caught up with more stuff than Paulie K did like going across state lines to commit a crime

[Antiliar]

I barely know anything about the current day Chicago Outfit but I have to point out that DiFronzo was boss since the late 90s up until 2014 and he never was arrested during that time
Clearly shows that the Outfit is smalltime now or am I wrong?

You're not wrong.

The lack of indictments show that this group is on its way out

Correct.

Is the outfit even considered to be a powerhouse in Chicago?

Not by those who are aware we're in the 21st century.

This is called an argument from silence. It's not only a logical fallacy, but a historian's fallacy. There's an old saying, "absence of evidence is not evidence of absence." If there's a lack of information the best answer is "I don't know."

On the other hand, I have sources that tell me that something is still going on with the Outfit and they've made new members. However, because this is unverified raw data I won't say that I know what they tell me is accurate, but I know them well enough that I find them credible. I shared some of what they told me here (with permission), but you're under no obligation to believe it. Just stop giving people misinformation as if you know certain things about what's current as fact, because you don't.

[Little_Al1991]

Great posts on this thread
The lack of indictments is important to note because elsewhere we see a lot of indictments.The comment about fumes from the FBI also shows that things are downhill

[chin_gigante]

I was looking back at the ABC7 article about the leadership of the outfit following DiFronzo's death (https://abc7chicago.com/john-no-nose-di ... s/3550181/) and found the language very interesting considering some of the things we now know about the power dynamics between the boss and the consiglio or a "consigliere"-type figure.

DiFronzo's declining health the past few years may have allowed the mob to restructure its upper crust in anticipation of his death. The top two spots in the Outfit are now thought to be occupied by one infamous gangland name and one less recognized.

Salvatore "Solly D" DeLaurentis is the best known, un-incarcerated Chicago mob figure today-and considered "consigliere" to the Outfit.

[...]

The second in command of the Chicago Outfit, according to some mobwatchers, is convicted enforcer Albert "Albie the Falcon" Vena, 69. The squat Vena did beat a murder charge in 1992 after the killing of a syndicate-connected drug dealer. He is thought to oversee day-to-day operations of the Outfit.

This has probably been discussed to death before but it strikes me now as Vena being the boss and DeLaurentis as the retired elder statesman, like when Aiuppa was number one and Accardo was in a similar role.

[PolackTony]

I was looking back at the ABC7 article about the leadership of the outfit following DiFronzo's death (https://abc7chicago.com/john-no-nose-di ... s/3550181/) and found the language very interesting considering some of the things we now know about the power dynamics between the boss and the consiglio or a "consigliere"-type figure.

DiFronzo's declining health the past few years may have allowed the mob to restructure its upper crust in anticipation of his death. The top two spots in the Outfit are now thought to be occupied by one infamous gangland name and one less recognized.

Salvatore "Solly D" DeLaurentis is the best known, un-incarcerated Chicago mob figure today-and considered "consigliere" to the Outfit.

[...]

The second in command of the Chicago Outfit, according to some mobwatchers, is convicted enforcer Albert "Albie the Falcon" Vena, 69. The squat Vena did beat a murder charge in 1992 after the killing of a syndicate-connected drug dealer. He is thought to oversee day-to-day operations of the Outfit.

This has probably been discussed to death before but it strikes me now as Vena being the boss and DeLaurentis as the retired elder statesman, like when Aiuppa was number one and Accardo was in a similar role.

It’s hard to say. As with almost every Chicago question, the honest answer is we really don’t know enough. It’s unclear who the I-Team was citing as “mob watchers” who claimed Vena was number 2. Could be just speculation. Scott B in the past had Albie as “street boss”, but it’s unclear to me what that would mean if true. If it’s what people often mean by street boss, maybe Vena was a liaison with the admin.

Antiliar’s Cicero source had Solly D as boss, Sal Cataudella as underboss, and Jimmy I as Cicero capo. Now that Solly is rumored to be sick with cancer there was some talk that Jimmy will take the top spot, apparently. But Jimmy might be sick now too. The Cicero source didn’t really have any knowledge of Grand Ave but he didn’t put Vena in the overall Family admin. Best guess is that Vena is Grand Ave capo, IMO. If there has been a consigliere/elder chairman role in recent years, it was probably Johnny Bananas until the dementia got hold of him, and then maybe Joey Andriacchi (again, IMO).

Assuming that there’s still a functioning organizational structure, some of the guys in the mix may very well be guys completely off our radar. The made guys named by Antiliar’s source weren’t guys that we would have ever otherwise guessed. We all thought Pudgy Matassa was somebody still, but Antiliar’s guy said that Pudgy is a nobody today. Go figure.