General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

[funkster]

Were Hagedorn's sources ones he spoke to in the 90s, or as recently as when he published the book in 2015?

Side note, that 4901 Roosevelt spot still looks like a shady social club lol

I can't believe these places used to be strip joints lol

Certainly up in your face LOL

[funkster]

Were Hagedorn's sources ones he spoke to in the 90s, or as recently as when he published the book in 2015?

Side note, that 4901 Roosevelt spot still looks like a shady social club lol

In the 2000s. He says that "Sal Martino" approached him in 2010 to discuss writing a book and by this point "Sal" was in his 60s and considered semi-retired. He stated that his other source, "The Don" was also an older semi-retired member from a Sicilian mafia lineage who approached a short time before "Sal", so sometime in the 2000s.

That spot on Roosevelt definitely has "the look". Just needs an old sign that states "S.A.C.".

Thanks for the pics, book looks interesting. I might pick it up. If that Sal Martino was in his 60s in 2010 good chance he's still alive. Also curious who that Sammy is that was the Outfit's guy in Jeff Park.

[PolackTony]

Were Hagedorn's sources ones he spoke to in the 90s, or as recently as when he published the book in 2015?

Side note, that 4901 Roosevelt spot still looks like a shady social club lol

I can't believe these places used to be strip joints lol

Cicero, man. These places made the Bada Bing look like the fuckin Taj Mahal.

[Patrickgold]

Has anybody been following this guy named Chuck Miceli, he created a Facebook page called family secrets secrets. He has also been on Joey Seifert’s podcast. He says he knows for a fact Difronzo was a rat and that Jimmy Deleo was a rat too. I thought his name sounded familiar so I looked him up and an article from early 2000s came up. Any one know this guy?

CONVICTED CON MAN SET TO TALK ABOUT CHICAGO CRIMES

By Ray Gibson and Tribune Staff Writer
Chicago Tribune
•
Mar 29, 2001 at 12:00 am
To his investors in a Florida nightclub, Charles Miceli was a swindler and a remarkable con man. It took only days for Miceli to convince one sophisticated investor that his $125,000 would reap huge returns, but within weeks all the money was gone.

In Chicago, he littered the metropolitan area with bad check after bad check and went to jail after being convicted seven times.

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But despite his criminal history and his ties to organized crime, the 44-year-old Charles Miceli has become a valuable witness to federal authorities. From his Florida prison cell, he is telling them about more than 40 crimes, including murders, bombings, corruption, and extortion in cases involving top hoodlums and politicians in Illinois, Florida and New York, according to court records in Florida.

Miceli, who preferred red Corvettes and flashed wads of cash, rang up more than $640,000 in debts from scams in Chicago and Florida, court records show.

In letters to judges, Miceli has been telling Florida jurists that he can help authorities solve a variety of crimes.

Until last month, virtually no one believed him. Then an agent with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) wrote a letter on Miceli's behalf to the Florida judge that sentenced him to a 10-year prison term.

"Mr. Miceli has provided information to me that has been independently corroborated by both documents and witnesses," the agent wrote. "This information details over 40 violent crimes involving arsons, bombings, extortion, intimidation, and murder ... ATF has positively corroborated Mr. Miceli as having intimate contacts and associations with high-ranking individuals of organized crime both in Chicago, Illinois, New York and Florida."

Law enforcement sources in Chicago, however, cautioned that a probe of Miceli's allegations has only just begun.

The fact that the government has turned to a known con man for help in solving crimes in Chicago is nothing new. More than a decade ago, federal prosecutors turned to Michael Raymond, a notorious con man who was a murder suspect, to help send 15 politicians to jail.

Though the investigation may be in the early stages, the ATF believes it will result in indictments, the agent wrote the judge.

In a court filings in Tampa, Miceli said he was a member of an organized crime family based in Chicago. He said he began as a lieutenant in the crime ring in 1995, five years after he was fired from his job as a Cook County correctional officer.

He said he has been involved in the prostitution rackets and participated in two attempted murders and tried to find an individual to murder a former business partner.

In February 1996, Miceli began serving time for one of his seven convictions on passing bad checks in Illinois.

Within days of being paroled on the charges from the Illinois prison in 1997, Miceli went to Tampa. There he told would-be investors that he had $1.8 million to invest in a Florida nightclub he was planning to open.

Among those whom Miceli convinced to invest was Herbert Crabb, a certified public accountant in the Tampa area. "He's just a super con artist," said Crabb, the investor who lost $125,000.

Crabb said Miceli first said he was an attorney from Chicago. Then he said he was a former policeman. By the time Crabb discovered he was a convicted felon, all the money was gone. Authorities in Florida said in a period of six weeks, Miceli had managed to defraud investors and others of $207,000.

Miceli returned to Chicago and began trying to open another nightclub, this one in west suburban Stone Park. One potential employee of the nightclub in Stone Park lost $46,000, according to authorities.

In the summer of 1998, Miceli told authorities a business associate was trying to kill him. He placed a newspaper ad looking for armed bodyguards and eventually hired four Cook County sheriff's deputies. Miceli convinced two of them to pay for airline tickets and limousines. Two of the deputies lost $16,000 in money they advanced to Miceli, court records show.

In pleading for leniency from the Florida judge who sentenced him last November, Miceli said he wasn't a con man. He pointed out that not only was he working with the ATF, but he also had helped convict a notorious street gang member in a Rock Island murder case. Law enforcement officials in Rock Island had written the judge saying the entire case had hinged on Miceli's credibility. The killer had confessed to Miceli when they were both serving time in Illinois.

Judge Mark Shames was unfazed by the attempts to make Miceli credible.

"My impression is that you wouldn't know the truth if it hit you in the face with a two-by-four. My impression is that if I sentence you to prison, you will be undertaking an effort to convince authorities, that in return for an early release, you will be able to help them with the mysteries of the Bermuda Triangle, the disappearance of Judge (Joseph Force) Crater, and the whereabouts of the Lindbergh baby."

[PolackTony]

Has anybody been following this guy named Chuck Miceli, he created a Facebook page called family secrets secrets. He has also been on Joey Seifert’s podcast. He says he knows for a fact Difronzo was a rat and that Jimmy Deleo was a rat too. I thought his name sounded familiar so I looked him up and an article from early 2000s came up. Any one know this guy?

CONVICTED CON MAN SET TO TALK ABOUT CHICAGO CRIMES

Not familiar with him. Plenty of Micelis connected to the Outfit back in the day, wonder if he's related to the Micelis from IN/Cal City. So from what I can gather, his shtick is that Nick C lied, Lombardo and Marcello were railroaded, DiFronzo and DeLeo were rats. Given that he's a rat and a liar, I suppose it takes one to know one, lol.

[Antiliar]

Has anybody been following this guy named Chuck Miceli, he created a Facebook page called family secrets secrets. He has also been on Joey Seifert’s podcast. He says he knows for a fact Difronzo was a rat and that Jimmy Deleo was a rat too. I thought his name sounded familiar so I looked him up and an article from early 2000s came up. Any one know this guy?

CONVICTED CON MAN SET TO TALK ABOUT CHICAGO CRIMES

Not familiar with him. Plenty of Micelis connected to the Outfit back in the day, wonder if he's related to the Micelis from IN/Cal City. So from what I can gather, his shtick is that Nick C lied, Lombardo and Marcello were railroaded, DiFronzo and DeLeo were rats. Given that he's a rat and a liar, I suppose it takes one to know one, lol.

Considering that the Outfit is made up of liars, thieves, burglars, extortionists, thugs, drug traffickers, not to mention its share of rapists and murderers, being a con man is pretty light material. I listened to him and some other people vouch for him having the access that associates can get, so I think he's worth hearing out.

[PolackTony]

Has anybody been following this guy named Chuck Miceli, he created a Facebook page called family secrets secrets. He has also been on Joey Seifert’s podcast. He says he knows for a fact Difronzo was a rat and that Jimmy Deleo was a rat too. I thought his name sounded familiar so I looked him up and an article from early 2000s came up. Any one know this guy?

CONVICTED CON MAN SET TO TALK ABOUT CHICAGO CRIMES

Not familiar with him. Plenty of Micelis connected to the Outfit back in the day, wonder if he's related to the Micelis from IN/Cal City. So from what I can gather, his shtick is that Nick C lied, Lombardo and Marcello were railroaded, DiFronzo and DeLeo were rats. Given that he's a rat and a liar, I suppose it takes one to know one, lol.

Considering that the Outfit is made up of liars, thieves, burglars, extortionists, thugs, drug traffickers, not to mention its share of rapists and murderers, being a con man is pretty light material. I listened to him and some other people vouch for him having the access that associates can get, so I think he's worth hearing out.

No argument from me there. If he was actually a connected guy and not just a hustler with a vowel at the end of his name, then maybe he does know something. I'll check him out, thanks.

[PolackTony]

Has anybody been following this guy named Chuck Miceli, he created a Facebook page called family secrets secrets. He has also been on Joey Seifert’s podcast. He says he knows for a fact Difronzo was a rat and that Jimmy Deleo was a rat too. I thought his name sounded familiar so I looked him up and an article from early 2000s came up. Any one know this guy?

CONVICTED CON MAN SET TO TALK ABOUT CHICAGO CRIMES

Not familiar with him. Plenty of Micelis connected to the Outfit back in the day, wonder if he's related to the Micelis from IN/Cal City. So from what I can gather, his shtick is that Nick C lied, Lombardo and Marcello were railroaded, DiFronzo and DeLeo were rats. Given that he's a rat and a liar, I suppose it takes one to know one, lol.

Considering that the Outfit is made up of liars, thieves, burglars, extortionists, thugs, drug traffickers, not to mention its share of rapists and murderers, being a con man is pretty light material. I listened to him and some other people vouch for him having the access that associates can get, so I think he's worth hearing out.

No argument from me there. If he was actually a connected guy and not just a hustler with a vowel at the end of his name, then maybe he does know something. I'll check him out, thanks.

Listening to his podcast episode with Joey Seifert. Miceli says that his father was involved in "politics" and his father's family was politically connected. So I wonder if he's related to former 39th Ward Committeeman Bill Miceli.

EDIT: Listening to this podcast, I don't think this guy is full of BS. He claims that his father and uncle Tom (the latter a deputy Cook County sheriff and married to a daughter of crooked CPD officer Rich Madeja) were both associates but not made guys. And that Lombardo was his godfather, which Joey Seifert who was also Lombardo's godson excepts as fact, so I doubt it's BS. Also says that his stepfather was a connected guy and related to the Pape family. Says his stepfather was the son of Jack Pape.

Another point is that Miceli is arguing that Lombardo was not guilty of Danny Seifert's murder, and Joey Seifert seems to share his opinion.

[PolackTony]

Were Hagedorn's sources ones he spoke to in the 90s, or as recently as when he published the book in 2015?

Side note, that 4901 Roosevelt spot still looks like a shady social club lol

I can't believe these places used to be strip joints lol

I note that 12th St Player Stevie Bullets claims that his uncle Butch Messina was a bouncer at the Spot club, which he states was run by Marcello.

[PolackTony]

Has anybody been following this guy named Chuck Miceli, he created a Facebook page called family secrets secrets. He has also been on Joey Seifert’s podcast. He says he knows for a fact Difronzo was a rat and that Jimmy Deleo was a rat too. I thought his name sounded familiar so I looked him up and an article from early 2000s came up. Any one know this guy?

CONVICTED CON MAN SET TO TALK ABOUT CHICAGO CRIMES

Not familiar with him. Plenty of Micelis connected to the Outfit back in the day, wonder if he's related to the Micelis from IN/Cal City. So from what I can gather, his shtick is that Nick C lied, Lombardo and Marcello were railroaded, DiFronzo and DeLeo were rats. Given that he's a rat and a liar, I suppose it takes one to know one, lol.

Considering that the Outfit is made up of liars, thieves, burglars, extortionists, thugs, drug traffickers, not to mention its share of rapists and murderers, being a con man is pretty light material. I listened to him and some other people vouch for him having the access that associates can get, so I think he's worth hearing out.

No argument from me there. If he was actually a connected guy and not just a hustler with a vowel at the end of his name, then maybe he does know something. I'll check him out, thanks.

Listening to his podcast episode with Joey Seifert. Miceli says that his father was involved in "politics" and his father's family was politically connected. So I wonder if he's related to former 39th Ward Committeeman Bill Miceli.

EDIT: Listening to this podcast, I don't think this guy is full of BS. He claims that his father and uncle Tom (the latter a deputy Cook County sheriff and married to a daughter of crooked CPD officer Rich Madeja) were both associates but not made guys. And that Lombardo was his godfather, which Joey Seifert who was also Lombardo's godson excepts as fact, so I doubt it's BS. Also says that his stepfather was a connected guy and related to the Pape family. Says his stepfather was the son of Jack Pape.

Another point is that Miceli is arguing that Lombardo was not guilty of Danny Seifert's murder, and Joey Seifert seems to share his opinion.

He also states, in passing, that Lombardo was "consigliere" and "underboss". Additionally states that publicly available lists of Outfit members do not reflect who was actually involved, as many of them were not known to the public. He states that Frank Graziano was a major player for Elmwood Park/Northside.

The ATF at least apparently thought that Miceli had some good info on numerous crimes:

[Patrickgold]

Has anybody been following this guy named Chuck Miceli, he created a Facebook page called family secrets secrets. He has also been on Joey Seifert’s podcast. He says he knows for a fact Difronzo was a rat and that Jimmy Deleo was a rat too. I thought his name sounded familiar so I looked him up and an article from early 2000s came up. Any one know this guy?

CONVICTED CON MAN SET TO TALK ABOUT CHICAGO CRIMES

Not familiar with him. Plenty of Micelis connected to the Outfit back in the day, wonder if he's related to the Micelis from IN/Cal City. So from what I can gather, his shtick is that Nick C lied, Lombardo and Marcello were railroaded, DiFronzo and DeLeo were rats. Given that he's a rat and a liar, I suppose it takes one to know one, lol.

Considering that the Outfit is made up of liars, thieves, burglars, extortionists, thugs, drug traffickers, not to mention its share of rapists and murderers, being a con man is pretty light material. I listened to him and some other people vouch for him having the access that associates can get, so I think he's worth hearing out.

No argument from me there. If he was actually a connected guy and not just a hustler with a vowel at the end of his name, then maybe he does know something. I'll check him out, thanks.

Listening to his podcast episode with Joey Seifert. Miceli says that his father was involved in "politics" and his father's family was politically connected. So I wonder if he's related to former 39th Ward Committeeman Bill Miceli.

EDIT: Listening to this podcast, I don't think this guy is full of BS. He claims that his father and uncle Tom (the latter a deputy Cook County sheriff and married to a daughter of crooked CPD officer Rich Madeja) were both associates but not made guys. And that Lombardo was his godfather, which Joey Seifert who was also Lombardo's godson excepts as fact, so I doubt it's BS. Also says that his stepfather was a connected guy and related to the Pape family. Says his stepfather was the son of Jack Pape.

Another point is that Miceli is arguing that Lombardo was not guilty of Danny Seifert's murder, and Joey Seifert seems to share his opinion.

He also states, in passing, that Lombardo was "consigliere" and "underboss". Additionally states that publicly available lists of Outfit members do not reflect who was actually involved, as many of them were not known to the public. He states that Frank Graziano was a major player for Elmwood Park/Northside.

The ATF at least apparently thought that Miceli had some good info on numerous crimes:

The feds supposedly turned their back on him for some reason despite him helping them. He made a lot of claims which includes being a lieutenant in an organized crime family and working with associates of Gotti Jr.

It is interesting that Joey Seifert agrees with him about Lombardo despite writing a book and doing a documentary about his dads murder and putting Lombard in bad light.

I sent him a message on Facebook about how he knows Difronzo is a rat and he said its in all the pleading findings in the family secret docket. He also said he is currently writing a book that will have everything in it.

I also asked him since he was in Tampa for a while did he work with the Trafficantes. He said he had no dealings personally with Santo Trafficante but did have dealings with his son-in-law Angelo Bedami. I wonder if Scott D. has talked with him at all??

[Patrickgold]

Were Hagedorn's sources ones he spoke to in the 90s, or as recently as when he published the book in 2015?

Side note, that 4901 Roosevelt spot still looks like a shady social club lol

I can't believe these places used to be strip joints lol

I note that 12th St Player Stevie Bullets claims that his uncle Butch Messina was a bouncer at the Spot club, which he states was run by Marcello.

Yep very true. Butch just died a couple of days ago

[Snakes]

So why doesn't he share these pleading findings? If they are part of the docket, I wouldn't think they'd be sealed

[Patrickgold]

So why doesn't he share these pleading findings? If they are part of the docket, I wouldn't think they'd be sealed

He says they are already posted via pacer whatever that is. Case number is 02 CR 1050. He said some are on the family secret secrets page on FB

[Snakes]

So why doesn't he share these pleading findings? If they are part of the docket, I wouldn't think they'd be sealed

He says they are already posted via pacer whatever that is. Case number is 02 CR 1050. He said some are on the family secret secrets page on FB

I signed back in just to read some of these motions and a couple seemed far-fetched. He's claiming that Joey Lombardo wasn't even active in the Chicago mob during the Albergo and Seifert homicides? Give me a break. He also mentions James Marcello "wouldn't even make a pimple on a bosses rear end." A far cry from Joe Vento being caught on tape speaking about Marcello: "You fuckin' better believe he's somebody."

This guy also claimed that Joe Lombardo came to his defense when John DiFronzo sent some guys to collect on a 25 dollar(!) debt so I cannot believe that he would be an unbiased source. My guess is that Lombardo helped him out with something or got him out of a jam and he wanted to testify on his behalf.

He also claims to have witnessed Daniel Seifert's hit (at 7 years old!) and that he buried Michael Albergo's remains in 1986.

All this does not lend him credence in my eyes, regardless of how Joey Seifert feels. I don't see anything in there proving DiFronzo was a cooperator, either.