Random historic info
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Re: Random historic info
Also, with Allegra's comment about Marseille, Tunis, and the European continent in mind plus Zu Vincenzo saying the mafia is everywhere in the world except Japan, Comito learned Zu Vincenzo traveled through Tunis, Liverpool, and Japan on his way to the US. We could infer Zu Vincenzo encountered Families or members in Tunis (confirmed to exist) and Liverpool (where there was a colony connected to the Pagliarelli Family).
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Re: Random historic info
Thanks for your message Antillar and was Capone an ally of the Commission then? I think that his successors such as Paul Ricca and Tony Accardo did develop a good relationship with the Commission in New York.Antiliar wrote: ↑Thu Feb 10, 2022 8:50 pmLuciano and Capone were good friends. Luciano probably thought Capone did what he had to do and that it was just business. He was also friends with Frank Costello.davidf1989 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 10, 2022 8:02 pm Al Capone was a Neapolitan and how was he perceived by Luciano and the other New York mobsters? I guess they would've been annoyed by the St Valentine's massacre being in the papers.
Re: Random historic info
David -- all three served on the Commission.
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Re: Random historic info
1920's...
Salvatore Romano is "a leader" after getting out of prison. He was a Gambino connected with Crocivera and Giamlombardo in the early 1900's. D'Aquila's name finally surfaces as being unmentioned for 10 years. The SS knew who he was but it appears he and those around him kept out of things.. Useless but still interesting passage - Villabate, Birmingham, Mangano Charles LaGaipa- Chicago Fratellanza, recommendation laters, John DeLeo "Joe Messari (Masseria) is now a member of the Fratellanza - D'Aquila is President of the Fratellanza, Yale Morello Lagaipa mentioned. Sounds like LaGaipa is NOT a member by this time (1923) D'Aquila's family mentioned.
Salvatore Romano is "a leader" after getting out of prison. He was a Gambino connected with Crocivera and Giamlombardo in the early 1900's. D'Aquila's name finally surfaces as being unmentioned for 10 years. The SS knew who he was but it appears he and those around him kept out of things.. Useless but still interesting passage - Villabate, Birmingham, Mangano Charles LaGaipa- Chicago Fratellanza, recommendation laters, John DeLeo "Joe Messari (Masseria) is now a member of the Fratellanza - D'Aquila is President of the Fratellanza, Yale Morello Lagaipa mentioned. Sounds like LaGaipa is NOT a member by this time (1923) D'Aquila's family mentioned.
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Re: Random historic info
A+, thanks for adding solid gold to this thread.
- Wonder if any of the later Romanos in the Gambino Family connect to this guy. Definitely sounds important, wonder if he could be a candidate for underboss given that's a mystery. Like you've mentioned, D'Aquila would have been too busy to run the Family on the day to day.
- Though he wasn't a member it says LaGaipa was "with" the D'Aquila Family which makes sense given the other Porto Empedoclesi were with them.
- Definitely a lot of emphasis on that letter of introduction. Shows how important proper protocol was. Along the same lines, interesting Lupo and Morello didn't want to do business with a non-member unless another member was involved on his behalf. Plays into the idea that Comito wasn't a random victim of their schemes but someone already tapped into the network via Cecala. I kind of got the impression Cecala may have been a captain based on his supervisory role and comments like this quoted by Comito:
"During the last three years I am getting along well in my line: that is, I am the head of a
band of incendiaries and earn a little money now and then."
^ Could just as well have been referring to his associates but seems significant he was bragging about "getting along well" and being "head" of other men for around 3 years. Some of the other counterfeiters like Zu Vincenzo were definitely members and they appear to have been subordinate to Cecala. We know he was important enough to head Empire Yeast later on with admin members of different Families.
- Says explicitly Frankie Yale was with the Morello Family. What year was that?
- Wonder if any of the later Romanos in the Gambino Family connect to this guy. Definitely sounds important, wonder if he could be a candidate for underboss given that's a mystery. Like you've mentioned, D'Aquila would have been too busy to run the Family on the day to day.
- Though he wasn't a member it says LaGaipa was "with" the D'Aquila Family which makes sense given the other Porto Empedoclesi were with them.
- Definitely a lot of emphasis on that letter of introduction. Shows how important proper protocol was. Along the same lines, interesting Lupo and Morello didn't want to do business with a non-member unless another member was involved on his behalf. Plays into the idea that Comito wasn't a random victim of their schemes but someone already tapped into the network via Cecala. I kind of got the impression Cecala may have been a captain based on his supervisory role and comments like this quoted by Comito:
"During the last three years I am getting along well in my line: that is, I am the head of a
band of incendiaries and earn a little money now and then."
^ Could just as well have been referring to his associates but seems significant he was bragging about "getting along well" and being "head" of other men for around 3 years. Some of the other counterfeiters like Zu Vincenzo were definitely members and they appear to have been subordinate to Cecala. We know he was important enough to head Empire Yeast later on with admin members of different Families.
- Says explicitly Frankie Yale was with the Morello Family. What year was that?
Last edited by B. on Fri Feb 11, 2022 11:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Random historic info
Very cool stuff. I'm assuming that the "Lombardi" from the Chicago Fratellanza mentioned here was Tony Lombardo?
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Re: Random historic info
I'm not sure, I have looked into this Romano, hes Palermitan and married one but that famiily- Quartuccios were linked to Gambinos and DiMaggios from either Torreta or Carini. Theres something there but without information from an insider I dont think we'll know. As far as him being a possible underboss, not saying he wasnt but theres no evidence that Daquila and Romano were ever in the same room together. They likely knew each other but we can't prove that. Hes not the only guy to get labeled a leader as it was used somewhat liberally by the SS.B. wrote: ↑Fri Feb 11, 2022 11:20 pm A+, thanks for adding solid gold to this thread.
- Wonder if any of the later Romanos in the Gambino Family connect to this guy. Definitely sounds important, wonder if he could be a candidate for underboss given that's a mystery. Like you've mentioned, D'Aquila would have been too busy to run the Family on the day to day.
- Though he wasn't a member it says LaGaipa was "with" the D'Aquila Family which makes sense given the other Porto Empedoclesi were with them.
- Definitely a lot of emphasis on that letter of introduction. Shows how important proper protocol was. Along the same lines, interesting Lupo and Morello didn't want to do business with a non-member unless another member was involved on his behalf. Plays into the idea that Comito wasn't a random victim of their schemes but someone already tapped into the network via Cecala. I kind of got the impression Cecala may have been a captain based on his supervisory role and comments like this quoted by Comito:
"During the last three years I am getting along well in my line: that is, I am the head of a
band of incendiaries and earn a little money now and then."
^ Could just as well have been referring to his associates but seems significant he was bragging about "getting along well" and being "head" of other men for around 3 years. Some of the other counterfeiters like Zu Vincenzo were definitely members and they appear to have been subordinate to Cecala. We know he was important enough to head Empire Yeast later on with admin members of different Families.
- Says explicitly Frankie Yale was with the Morello Family. What year was that?
I'm going to post some excerpts regarding counterfeiting and the wider network of associations. I wouldnt label it a mafia network but like bootlegging, a criminal network in which the mafia was involved. If that makes sense.
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Re: Random historic info
I think so. Hard to confirm 100% but one could argue who else would they be talking about?PolackTony wrote: ↑Fri Feb 11, 2022 11:28 pm Very cool stuff. I'm assuming that the "Lombardi" from the Chicago Fratellanza mentioned here was Tony Lombardo?
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Re: Random historic info
Oh and yes, March 1912 is when Nick Schiro official became boss and when the Gambinos and Genoveses elected D'Aquila and LoMonte 110 years ago next month. We can get the precise days it happened.
Re: Random historic info
Ah wasn't sure if the designation "leader" came from a source like Clemente or if it was an outside observation. We know from Gentile how close Traina was to D'Aquila, but are there any references to Traina in SS reports?Chris Christie wrote: ↑Sat Feb 12, 2022 11:07 am I'm not sure, I have looked into this Romano, hes Palermitan and married one but that famiily- Quartuccios were linked to Gambinos and DiMaggios from either Torreta or Carini. Theres something there but without information from an insider I dont think we'll know. As far as him being a possible underboss, not saying he wasnt but theres no evidence that Daquila and Romano were ever in the same room together. They likely knew each other but we can't prove that. Hes not the only guy to get labeled a leader as it was used somewhat liberally by the SS.
You mentioned Traina's paesan Giallombardo who was a figure early on. Here is what JD said about the Traina crew circa early 1960s:
All of the known Traina crew members from the time period were Sicilian. The majority traced their origins to Palermo, either the city itself (Amato) or neighboring communes Marineo (the LiCastris), Torretta (the Manninos) or, like Traina, Belmonte Mezzagno (Giallombardo).
He didn't clarify if he meant the same Giallombardo or if there was another one in the Family. The early one would be ancient by then if he was even alive.
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Re: Random historic info
I am only aware of one Giamlombardo and all the information that exists is that he was a counterfeiter who was previously a mafia member in Sicily. I haven't seen any info to indicate what rank he might have held nor his decina affiliation. JD either made a mistake and meant Traina or he has information from a later date that I haven't seen which mentions Crocivera.
Traina isn't mentioned in the SS but there are indicators that he was an administration member from 1912 until 1928-1930, at which point he became a captain. The problem is we know so little. He could have been given a crew in 1928-1930 or he could have taken over an already existing one? Hard to tell.
His crew is made up of a pretty diverse crowd from different towns that aren't clustered. It's a Palermitan Provincial crew composed of urban Palermitans, countryside towns and mountain towns. That in and of itself is interesting. It maybe started as one faction that absorbed other towns or maybe it was put together later. Crews didnt start being broken, split and formed in the 60s, it likely was always a thing.
I think to try and guess it would be pulling a vendite or whatever that book was called. Some things are lost to history.
Traina isn't mentioned in the SS but there are indicators that he was an administration member from 1912 until 1928-1930, at which point he became a captain. The problem is we know so little. He could have been given a crew in 1928-1930 or he could have taken over an already existing one? Hard to tell.
His crew is made up of a pretty diverse crowd from different towns that aren't clustered. It's a Palermitan Provincial crew composed of urban Palermitans, countryside towns and mountain towns. That in and of itself is interesting. It maybe started as one faction that absorbed other towns or maybe it was put together later. Crews didnt start being broken, split and formed in the 60s, it likely was always a thing.
I think to try and guess it would be pulling a vendite or whatever that book was called. Some things are lost to history.
Re: Random historic info
JD was referring to members of Traina's crew circa 1960s, so he didn't confuse him with Traina. He may have found another Giallombardo with that crew given he had a lot of info on that era and if anyone doesn't speculate much, it's JD. There was also a "Peter Lombardo" from Trenton arrested with Traina after the 1932 Bazzano murder and he may have been Pietro Giallombardo from Belmonte who lived in Jersey but can't confirm -- if he was Belmontese in Trenton he would have probably been with the Philadelphia Belmonte group as they had relatives in Trenton (and were in turn close to Joe Traina), yet the Gambinos later had a faction there who reported to Brooklyn.
There was a link too between Giuseppe Giallombardo the counterfeiter and a Salvatore Traina but can't confirm a relation to Joe -- the FBN confused Giuseppe Traina's background (or got the wrong info from Italian authorities) with another Giuseppe Traina from San Giuseppe Jato who was Vincenzo Troia's cousin and a local mafia figure there. Makes it confusing to map out his blood relatives.
I think there's a huge gap between looking at different info and openly speculating on the board vs. the book you're referring to where the author states things about the early Detroit mafia as fact using black and white language and publishing it haha, but I understand.
What I was getting at w/ Traina is we have two inside sources who confirm he was D'Aquila's main man and part of the admin but that may not be reflected in any SS reports and would have only been known to members from the inside.
There was a link too between Giuseppe Giallombardo the counterfeiter and a Salvatore Traina but can't confirm a relation to Joe -- the FBN confused Giuseppe Traina's background (or got the wrong info from Italian authorities) with another Giuseppe Traina from San Giuseppe Jato who was Vincenzo Troia's cousin and a local mafia figure there. Makes it confusing to map out his blood relatives.
I think there's a huge gap between looking at different info and openly speculating on the board vs. the book you're referring to where the author states things about the early Detroit mafia as fact using black and white language and publishing it haha, but I understand.
What I was getting at w/ Traina is we have two inside sources who confirm he was D'Aquila's main man and part of the admin but that may not be reflected in any SS reports and would have only been known to members from the inside.
Re: Random historic info
Based on what you said offline about Cina and the other thread about LoCicero, seems the Agrigento element was around Lupo and carried on under D'Aquila rather than a later development. We wouldn't have known that from Gentile who doesn't mention them that early -- great to know.
Another angle you've hit on recently on that's great is how certain Families tend to be in certain professions/industries -- you gave the example of grocery/wholesaling from Lupo up to modern day in that Family. Worth looking into whether there was an industry-related connection (legal or otherwise) that made Agrigento and Palermo early affiliates. Doesn't seem like counterfeiting would be it and people would do business across organizational lines but it's one possible influence for these relationships when the orgs were first being defined.
Another angle you've hit on recently on that's great is how certain Families tend to be in certain professions/industries -- you gave the example of grocery/wholesaling from Lupo up to modern day in that Family. Worth looking into whether there was an industry-related connection (legal or otherwise) that made Agrigento and Palermo early affiliates. Doesn't seem like counterfeiting would be it and people would do business across organizational lines but it's one possible influence for these relationships when the orgs were first being defined.
Re: Random historic info
Re: Cecala possibly not being Corleonese.
- Most Cecalas I found were from Caccamo.
- Naturalization says he was from "Palermo". His mother was a Badami, which is found in Corleone, but another Cecala from Caccamo listed a relative as a Badami also.
- When Antonino and his father arrived to the US, the manifest shows them near other well-known Caccamesi names like Pollina -- Philly leader Domenico Pollina was from Caccamo and his mother was a Cecala. Strong indications are that Antonino Cecala was Caccamese but no definitive record says so.
- Looks like his wife was from Marineo.
- Cecala traveled to Sicily with Vincenzo Mangano and Giuseppe Traina in 1925. They were likely among D'Aquila's envoys sent to Palermo at this time as sources have reported.
- Was president of Empire Yeast until 1928 when he was murdered, at which point Giuseppe Traina assumed the position. Partners included ranking members of many Families in NYC and beyond.
- Cecala came to the US in 1889 and two Giallombardos (not Giuseppe) were on the same manifest. Doesn't say where anyone was from in Sicily.
- Most Cecalas I found were from Caccamo.
- Naturalization says he was from "Palermo". His mother was a Badami, which is found in Corleone, but another Cecala from Caccamo listed a relative as a Badami also.
- When Antonino and his father arrived to the US, the manifest shows them near other well-known Caccamesi names like Pollina -- Philly leader Domenico Pollina was from Caccamo and his mother was a Cecala. Strong indications are that Antonino Cecala was Caccamese but no definitive record says so.
- Looks like his wife was from Marineo.
- Cecala traveled to Sicily with Vincenzo Mangano and Giuseppe Traina in 1925. They were likely among D'Aquila's envoys sent to Palermo at this time as sources have reported.
- Was president of Empire Yeast until 1928 when he was murdered, at which point Giuseppe Traina assumed the position. Partners included ranking members of many Families in NYC and beyond.
- Cecala came to the US in 1889 and two Giallombardos (not Giuseppe) were on the same manifest. Doesn't say where anyone was from in Sicily.
Re: Random historic info
Cecala was born in Baucina, to Salvatore and Louise Badame…
As for LaGaipa, I see… Guess I misunderstood the reference that LaGaipa was controlled by D’Aguila through his brother-in-law SanFilippo (do we have a first name for him???)
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As for LaGaipa, I see… Guess I misunderstood the reference that LaGaipa was controlled by D’Aguila through his brother-in-law SanFilippo (do we have a first name for him???)
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