Why were the other families afraid of the Genovese?

[Philly d]

I read Five Families by Selwyn Raab during quarantine last year. When they talk about the big windows case that brought down the chin they briefly talk about a Genovese soldier named Gerard pappa who was burying bodies under a window factory. In the book they more or less describe him as cocaine trafficker and psychopath. I guess he himself was murdered for killing a columbo. This was the first and only time I read about him. Does anyone know about this guy? Was he actually made? Doesn’t seem like a typical Genovese inductee…a young, drug dealing maniac. But I guess they didn’t tolerate him too long…

Gerard Pappa became a made member in 1978. Crazy runs in his family. His son, John Pappa, was arrested at the ripe old age of 22 for four murders. Two years later, he was put away for life.

He was the leader of the rampers with Sammy the bull. I agree didn't seem like Genovese material. Plus his area wasn't a hotbed of genovese.

[Extortion]

For once I agree with FURIOFROMNAPLES. The Genovese are very smart and wise. They may not have muscles or brawn. They are old men. But they are wise and smart. No one can ever seem to lay a direct punch on them. They always dodge it.

Not sure the idea of being "afraid" is correct. I think the other families are "wary" of the West Side.

They’re admin are legends, every generation too.

[Extortion]

I read Five Families by Selwyn Raab during quarantine last year. When they talk about the big windows case that brought down the chin they briefly talk about a Genovese soldier named Gerard pappa who was burying bodies under a window factory. In the book they more or less describe him as cocaine trafficker and psychopath. I guess he himself was murdered for killing a columbo. This was the first and only time I read about him. Does anyone know about this guy? Was he actually made? Doesn’t seem like a typical Genovese inductee…a young, drug dealing maniac. But I guess they didn’t tolerate him too long…

Gerard Pappa was a legend for all the wrong reasons. Let’s leave it at that. Look how his son turned out.

[HairyKnuckles]

Based on everything I’ve read all of the other families had much more dangerous killers. In NY and even places like Philly and Chicago all the other families seemed to have a stock of young and sometimes sadistic hitmen. But the Genovese just always seem like a bunch of old men. And some of the documented hits committed by the Genovese seem to contracted out to other families. If you go back to the mobs heyday, say 1980, if there was a shootout between the Genovese and any other ny family, or Chicago even, I’d think they would lose. But they still run shit, none of the more violent families ever come close to crossing them. Just something I’ve been thinking about….am I wrong?

Why would the other 4 NY crime Families be afraid of them??? They are not bullying them. They run their "shit" just like the other Families run their shit. The Genovese members are not super humans and they are not superior the other Families. There are strong, capable characters in all the Families and always has been. So your question is weird.

[Pmac2]

I dont think any family was scared of another family. Genovese family was just the largest and most spread out. And they wanted to win every dispute

[newera_212]

Wiseguy brought up a good point... the Bruno murder. I forgot about that one only because I forget that they have or had a Springfield crew up there... but look how many people were involved with that, and how it took down a pretty high level (NY) member.

Seeing the logistics behind tons of other mob murders in the other families through informants, it seems to be wherever a made guy is getting hit... there always seems to be a crazy amount of people involved. Rarely if ever do we see one of those planned hits just involving 2-3 guys. It's like 8-10 in a lot of cases.

We'll probably never know but I wonder if the Genovese follow that same trend and the guys just don't rat, or if they keep their 'hit teams' smaller, less of a chain, etc.
The Bruno hit says otherwise but I'm thinking that's an outlier because it was Springfield

[HairyKnuckles]

The Genovese Family has had a fair share of informants or rats (if you so will) just like the other Families. In that Bruno case for example, John Bologna was feeding info to the feds.

https://www.masslive.com/news/2017/05/f ... ments.html

Cookie Durso is another informant who brought damage to the Genovese Family.

https://www.cosanostranews.com/2016/09/ ... -them.html

There are other examples as well.

One could argue that these informants were low level guys. But if you read the articles in the link provided, they did serious damage to made guys, captains and even bosses who apparently talked pretty freely around these guys and what does that say about the members? Again, the Genovese members are no super humans, they also make mistakes. Plenty of Genovese members have been charged with criminal offenses and found guilty in the last 10 years or so, so they are not immune from prosecution. I agree though, they seem to have a knack of selecting good, solid leaders even if many of them ended up in the can.

[SonnyBlackstein]

It s a lot harder to get made into the Westside as well.

Vinny Gorgeous was with the Genovese but left to get his button sooner. Many more examples, the conversation about guys not getting made with Rooster/Rubeo etc etc

Youre therefor going to have a higher quality of button with the Genovese than other families.

[Shellackhead]

Definitely, I met someone that has family members in the life & he told me the genovese normally wait 15-20 years to put you in as a candidate to be straightened out

[newera_212]

It s a lot harder to get made into the Westside as well.

Vinny Gorgeous was with the Genovese but left to get his button sooner. Many more examples, the conversation about guys not getting made with Rooster/Rubeo etc etc

Youre therefor going to have a higher quality of button with the Genovese than other families.

He was? I didn't know that, I always thought he was a Bonanno guy and came up under Trinchera and later, Patty DeFilippo. The Genovese thing would make a lot of sense because of the whole Bronx & Northern suburbs connection...who was he around or under from the Genovese? Could only imagine the different career trajectory he would have had if he ended up with the Genovese

[B.]

Basciano was with Trinchera by the time he was 20 and was made in his 30s. He didn't leave to get his button and wouldn't be allowed to do that. Trinchera was close to the DeFilippos going back to the 1960s so these are all longstanding relationships.

By the way, I don't think other Families were afraid of the Genovese, they were simply taken seriously by the other Families and have a formidable reputation. They follow the same rules as everyone else.

[Jezza9009]

Why would any made member of one of the other families be afraid of the Genovese in the first place? Surely as a made member the only one you should fear is your boss, as he is the one who can order your death?

Respect is probably the better term here, tbh. John Pennisi mentioned that others looked up to the Genovese and their way of doing things, the secrecy, and their wealth and influence.

[Pmac2]

they had a strong boss who didnt take any shit. he also got into a few other smaller families bussiness sometimes picking there admininstrations. ie philly and new england.

[Extortion]

I’d say the only reason any family in NY would fear another would have to be a family’s connections into politics and law enforcement aka “the web”. Guns can kill people and just because a family might be short 20-30 guys…Up against 10-15 real killers or people with massive reach is where the fear would come from. Yes, numbers matter but what are they gonna do go all out war in the streets. It would be little bouts of violence here and there. They wouldn’t be able to gather an entire family in one spot and go to war.

[sharpieone]

When was Vinny Basciano ever with the Genovese? news to me. And I think they are respected and revered more than feared. this idea that they don't make guys until they are old timers is also blown way out of proportion. Bellomo, Ragusa, Sal Larca, Ralph Balsamo, Steve Alfisi -- all made young. And that's just the current generation.