Los Angeles odds & ends

[B.]

No defense of anyone, just fun to analyze these informants and why they said what they said.

Good discussion as always. Roselli was a fascinating guy. Even his peers in the mafia thought so.

[B.]

The "uncle" could have referred to a non-relative who Roselli regarded as a mentor or senior figure when he was coming up. Plenty of Italians and especially mafia members use "uncle" and "zio/zu" loosely, so he could have misinterpreted Roselli's meaning and taken it literally. The report doesn't say Roselli met/associated with Capone as a teen, only that he was active as a teenager and worked with Capone at an "early age". Isn't that fairly accurate?

The FBI did follow-up investigation based on the Lucchese CI's info and they confirmed that the "uncle" was in fact a "mafia uncle", not a biological relative.



I see Villain listed Anthony D'Acunto as an early Chicago figure in one of his write-ups. On Rat Trap's breakdown of Sal Piscopo's cooperation it says Piscopo identified D'Acunto as an "uncle" of Roselli who introduced Piscopo to Roselli circa 1923. So both Piscopo and the Lucchese CI provided similar info about this influential "uncle". The FBI's Dead List has Anthony D'Acunto dying January 30, 1930.

There was a Genovese member named Vincent D'Acunto who died in 2001, funny enough. Vincent D'Acunto's son was busted with Gigante's son Vincent Esposito in recent years. Maybe a coincidence but given the FBI said Anthony D'Acunto was "from New York" there could be a tie, especially given the strong Genovese/Chicago connections.

Selwyn Raab also lists an Angelo D'Acunto as a Genovese soldier in the Five Families book. He mentions an FBI 302 where Angelo D'Acunto was seen on surveillance with Chin Gigante and the wording suggests his designation as a "soldier" might be from that 302. Likely a relative of Vincent D'Acunto given their mutual ties to the Gigantes.

[PolackTony]

The "uncle" could have referred to a non-relative who Roselli regarded as a mentor or senior figure when he was coming up. Plenty of Italians and especially mafia members use "uncle" and "zio/zu" loosely, so he could have misinterpreted Roselli's meaning and taken it literally. The report doesn't say Roselli met/associated with Capone as a teen, only that he was active as a teenager and worked with Capone at an "early age". Isn't that fairly accurate?

The FBI did follow-up investigation based on the Lucchese CI's info and they confirmed that the "uncle" was in fact a "mafia uncle", not a biological relative.



I see Villain listed Anthony D'Acunto as an early Chicago figure in one of his write-ups. On Rat Trap's breakdown of Sal Piscopo's cooperation it says Piscopo identified D'Acunto as an "uncle" of Roselli who introduced Piscopo to Roselli circa 1923. So both Piscopo and the Lucchese CI provided similar info about this influential "uncle". The FBI's Dead List has Anthony D'Acunto dying January 30, 1930.

There was a Genovese member named Vincent D'Acunto who died in 2001, funny enough. Vincent D'Acunto's son was busted with Gigante's son Vincent Esposito in recent years. Maybe a coincidence but given the FBI said Anthony D'Acunto was "from New York" there could be a tie, especially given the strong Genovese/Chicago connections.

Selwyn Raab also lists an Angelo D'Acunto as a Genovese soldier in the Five Families book. He mentions an FBI 302 where Angelo D'Acunto was seen on surveillance with Chin Gigante and the wording suggests his designation as a "soldier" might be from that 302. Likely a relative of Vincent D'Acunto given their mutual ties to the Gigantes.

Very interesting. There was an Antonio D’Acunto naturalized in Chicago in 1903, birthplace just given as Italy. D’Acunto was almost certainly a mainlander and most likely from Campania. If he was actually a mafia member in Chicago that would be big news as it could indicate that Chicago was inducting mainlanders quite early on. Obviously, a lot that remains to be verified there.

There was an Anthony D’Acunto resident in LA in 1917 per WW1 draft records, so by then at the latest he was out West it seems.

[Villain]

The "uncle" could have referred to a non-relative who Roselli regarded as a mentor or senior figure when he was coming up. Plenty of Italians and especially mafia members use "uncle" and "zio/zu" loosely, so he could have misinterpreted Roselli's meaning and taken it literally. The report doesn't say Roselli met/associated with Capone as a teen, only that he was active as a teenager and worked with Capone at an "early age". Isn't that fairly accurate?

The FBI did follow-up investigation based on the Lucchese CI's info and they confirmed that the "uncle" was in fact a "mafia uncle", not a biological relative.



I see Villain listed Anthony D'Acunto as an early Chicago figure in one of his write-ups. On Rat Trap's breakdown of Sal Piscopo's cooperation it says Piscopo identified D'Acunto as an "uncle" of Roselli who introduced Piscopo to Roselli circa 1923. So both Piscopo and the Lucchese CI provided similar info about this influential "uncle". The FBI's Dead List has Anthony D'Acunto dying January 30, 1930.

There was a Genovese member named Vincent D'Acunto who died in 2001, funny enough. Vincent D'Acunto's son was busted with Gigante's son Vincent Esposito in recent years. Maybe a coincidence but given the FBI said Anthony D'Acunto was "from New York" there could be a tie, especially given the strong Genovese/Chicago connections.

Selwyn Raab also lists an Angelo D'Acunto as a Genovese soldier in the Five Families book. He mentions an FBI 302 where Angelo D'Acunto was seen on surveillance with Chin Gigante and the wording suggests his designation as a "soldier" might be from that 302. Likely a relative of Vincent D'Acunto given their mutual ties to the Gigantes.

I agree with Polack, quite interesting stuff B. and thanks.

[PolackTony]

We do know for a fact that Roselli was actually made in LA and not Chicago, right? Who was the source on that?

[Southshore88]

Here's a candidate for the Lucchese informant:

- John Ormento was sentenced to eight years in 1941 for narcotics trafficking. That would place him in prison during the same period as the informant and Roselli between 1943 and 1946/1947. Ormento started out at FCI Milan in Michigan circa 1942, but can't determine if he transferred. The informant said he did time with Roselli in Atlanta.

- The CI specifically says Roselli's association with Frank Costello, Tommy Lucchese, and Vito Genovese was before Genovese became boss, so it is pre-1957. The CI's street info from this report is centered on the 1950s, after Ormento was released from prison and before he was sent back on another conviction. He had ongoing legal trouble, including his Apalachin arrest and other narcotics charges. At the time of this 1966 report Ormento was in prison but nothing I've seen from the source indicates he was on the street, as it recalls info from the 1940s-1950s. There could well be more reports out there, though, this is just a snippet. This report does match the timeline of Ormento's legal/prison situation.

- In a paragraph directly after the CI says he met with Roselli in NYC, he says that although John Ormento attended a meeting with Roselli in NYC, the two were not "close associates". In contrast with Ormento, the CI cites Costello, Lucchese, and Genovese as Roselli's "close associates" in NYC. Very interesting that he felt the need to clarify that Roselli and Ormento met in NYC but did not "closely associate" right after the informant claims to have also met with Roselli in NYC -- it also implies the informant was at the meeting between Roselli and Ormento. If the informant was Ormento, he may have been trying to downplay their relationship, claiming it was purely social (former prison buddies) opposed to the political/criminal mafia association of Roselli's relationship with the three NYC bosses listed.

- The informant comes across as if he was established already in mafia circles by 1943. John Ormento was in his 30s and at least associated with the mafia in NYC by this time.

-

If we can place Ormento in Atlanta during the 1940s or otherwise match up Ormento/Roselli during their respective 1940s prison sentences that would heavily point to Ormento. I can't ID any other Lucchese members who were in federal prison during the same 1943-1947 stretch but if someone can find one they'd be a candidate too.

This is a super interesting topic B! I wonder how likely it would be for Ormento to be the actual informant. Wasn’t he convicted of heroin trafficking 3 times, with the last one being in the bust with the DiPalermo’s, Genovese and Gigante? Not that those convictions would disqualify him as a potential informant but just find it interesting that one of the early informers would have been also one of the largest targets for the government. I find Ormento to be a very interesting character as his crew was heavy into drugs and there’s not a ton out on him.

The other thought I had about finding the informants true identity is this - during this time, weren’t there a lot of examples of members being incorrectly labeled as a member of another family? While they say the informant is a Lucchese member, is there a possibility that they’ve been mislabeled as a Lucchese? From Valachi’s chart, he mislabeled a lot of members (granted he didn’t give the wrong family for his membership). Just some food for thought.

[B.]

SS88 -- the informant was a self-admitted Lucchese member. Another possibility is Pete DiPalermo because the informant said DiPalermo was also in Atlanta with Roselli. However, the informant implies that he (informant) stayed in Atlanta with Roselli when DiPalermo was released and that Roselli contacted DiPalermo for help without the informant's knowledge. Could be misdirection but Ormento seems like a stronger suspect than DiPalermo to me.

We do know for a fact that Roselli was actually made in LA and not Chicago, right? Who was the source on that?

Antiliar might be able to help with this more, as I'm not sure when Roselli is believed to have been made but it sounds like he was made young.

Roselli was definitely a Los Angeles member and I've never seen anything confirming he was made with Chicago before LA, only that he transferred from LA to Chicago when Desimone took over.

[PolackTony]

Roselli was definitely a Los Angeles member and I've never seen anything confirming he was made with Chicago before LA, only that he transferred from LA to Chicago when Desimone took over.

That’s my understanding, but was wondering what the source was: e.g. Piscopo, Bomp, Fratianno. I’d imagine that Roselli was possibly an associate with Chicago before being made into the LA family.

[B.]

Roselli was definitely a Los Angeles member and I've never seen anything confirming he was made with Chicago before LA, only that he transferred from LA to Chicago when Desimone took over.

That’s my understanding, but was wondering what the source was: e.g. Piscopo, Bomp, Fratianno. I’d imagine that Roselli was possibly an associate with Chicago before being made into the LA family.

Piscopo said he was a "secretary" and "lieutenant" to Roselli in the 1920s. He doesn't outright say Johnny Roselli was made then but we could infer that Piscopo was an associate on record with Roselli, a made member. Piscopo wasn't made until the 1940s. His description of Roselli's impressive stature in the 1930s adds to the likelihood that Roselli was made by then.

We can confirm Roselli was made before 1947 given that's when he sponsored Fratianno for membership.

[Patrickgold]

Roselli was definitely a Los Angeles member and I've never seen anything confirming he was made with Chicago before LA, only that he transferred from LA to Chicago when Desimone took over.

That’s my understanding, but was wondering what the source was: e.g. Piscopo, Bomp, Fratianno. I’d imagine that Roselli was possibly an associate with Chicago before being made into the LA family.

I was always under the impression he was made in Chicago. He lived there in 1920s for a short while before he went out to California, in which some say he was sent by Capone. It was always a bit confusing about his actual status considering his interaction with other families. But keep this in mind. He was indicted for the movie industry extortions with all the other high ranking Chicago guys. No other Los Angeles members or associates were indicted. That indicates to me that he always belonged to Chicago at least up until the 50s

[B.]

Roselli was definitely a Los Angeles member and I've never seen anything confirming he was made with Chicago before LA, only that he transferred from LA to Chicago when Desimone took over.

That’s my understanding, but was wondering what the source was: e.g. Piscopo, Bomp, Fratianno. I’d imagine that Roselli was possibly an associate with Chicago before being made into the LA family.

I was always under the impression he was made in Chicago. He lived there in 1920s for a short while before he went out to California, in which some say he was sent by Capone. It was always a bit confusing about his actual status considering his interaction with other families. But keep this in mind. He was indicted for the movie industry extortions with all the other high ranking Chicago guys. No other Los Angeles members or associates were indicted. That indicates to me that he always belonged to Chicago at least up until the 50s

It's the opposite. He was a Los Angeles member before he transferred to Chicago in the 1950s. That much is 100% confirmed. The question is if he was made by Chicago or Los Angeles first before the many years he spent as a LA member.

I highly recommend the Rat Trap article on Salvatore Piscopo given he was the closest friend to Roselli and along with Fratianno and Bompensiero he is a definitive source on Roselli: https://mafiahistory.us/rattrap/salvatorepiscopo.html

[Patrickgold]

Where is it 100% confirmed? Have you read the indictment for the movie extortion trial? Curious what they say about him there

[B.]

He was 100% a Los Angeles member by 1947 based on the info from LA member informants/witnesses close to him. I was responding primarily to you thinking he was with Chicago until the 1950s when we know for sure he was with Los Angeles until the 1950s and transferred to Chicago when Desimone became boss.

If you're talking about the extortion trial, I don't know if anyone has specified his affiliation at that time but within a short time of his release from prison in the 1940s he was a confirmed Los Angeles member, suggesting he was with them prior to and/or during his prison term.

His young age when moving to LA makes it likely he was inducted in LA and not Chicago. That doesn't necessarily mean he was an LA member at that time but none of the sources close to him say anything about his affiliation going from Chicago->Los Angeles->Chicago, only Los Angeles->Chicago. They also make it clear he was important in both families regardless of his affiliation, so his close association with Chicago leaders during the Hollywood extortion doesn't tell us much.

Not trying to shoot you down, just making the known facts clear. You could be right that he was originally made as an LA-based Chicago member, as other families had remote members during that time (Nick Gentile makes that clear), but I haven't seen anything that suggests that was the case beyond his ongoing friendships with Chicago and we can say for certain he was an LA member in the 1940s with no evidence this was a new arrangement.

[PolackTony]

He was 100% a Los Angeles member by 1947 based on the info from LA member informants/witnesses close to him. I was responding primarily to you thinking he was with Chicago until the 1950s when we know for sure he was with Los Angeles until the 1950s and transferred to Chicago when Desimone became boss.

If you're talking about the extortion trial, I don't know if anyone has specified his affiliation at that time but within a short time of his release from prison in the 1940s he was a confirmed Los Angeles member, suggesting he was with them prior to and/or during his prison term.

His young age when moving to LA makes it likely he was inducted in LA and not Chicago. That doesn't necessarily mean he was an LA member at that time but none of the sources close to him say anything about his affiliation going from Chicago->Los Angeles->Chicago, only Los Angeles->Chicago. They also make it clear he was important in both families regardless of his affiliation, so his close association with Chicago leaders during the Hollywood extortion doesn't tell us much.

Not trying to shoot you down, just making the known facts clear. You could be right that he was originally made as an LA-based Chicago member, as other families had remote members during that time (Nick Gentile makes that clear), but I haven't seen anything that suggests that was the case beyond his ongoing friendships with Chicago and we can say for certain he was an LA member in the 1940s with no evidence this was a new arrangement.

I’d also imagine that if he had been made in Chicago and then transferred to LA at some point in the 1940s, Piscopo and/or Bomp would’ve relayed this to the G, especially in the context of his later transfer to Chicago. When Piscopo was Roselli’s “secretary” back in the 20s, he thus himself may have technically been a Chicago associate if Roselli were a Chicago member at the time. I doubt Roselli was made by Chicago, just wanted to see if any of the LA CIs made a specific statement about it.

If Roselli’s mentor was indeed D’Acunto — and with the unconfirmed assumption that the latter was himself a Chicago member at some point — than Roselli was probably a Chicago associate when he arrived in LA. Chicago probably either was fine with or even encouraged Roselli being made by LA, as they then would have a man on the inside of that family.

[B.]

Great point, man. Didn't even think how Roselli's affiliation would have impacted Piscopo's affiliation as an associate.

D'Acunto is the missing link here. The FBI report said he was connected to the same cities as Roselli -- New York, Chicago, Los Angeles. The later D'Acuntos showing up as Genovese members close to Gigante could point to Anthony D'Acunto associating with elements of the future Genovese family, especially because it's a Neapolitan name and he was tied to Chicago. The Lucchese CI says Roselli's closest NYC contacts were non-Sicilian Genovese leaders (Moretti, Costello, Genovese). The Capone connection is important too. Need to dig and see if there are any records connecting Anthony D'Acunto to the later ones in NYC.

Along with all other sources praising Roselli, interesting the Lucchese CI said Willie Moretti was bragging about his relationship with Roselli. Moretti was a captain and acting admin member, one of the most powerful national figures in his day, yet he was apparently boasting too much about his friendship with an LA soldier. It's believable, too.

The FBI interviewed D'Acunto's wife about Roselli and though she noted no blood relationship, she said D'Acunto considered Roselli "more than just a friend". She said when D'Acunto died he told her to cut off all contact with his associates except Roselli. She met her husband in 1918 and said she met Roselli through him several years later. Keep in mind she was elderly at the time of these interviews.

Have to laugh at the name "D'Acunto"... can just imagine the problems it created for the D'Acunto women. Up there with Cuntrera.