Chicago Chop Shop Murders

[Snakes]

Were Chris and Clement Messino were involved in the Chop Shop War/Southside guys? Or am I off in that?

I always thought they post-dated the peak of the chop shop wars and were more involved in narcotics.

[SolarSolano]

Were Chris and Clement Messino were involved in the Chop Shop War/Southside guys? Or am I off in that?

I always thought they post-dated the peak of the chop shop wars and were more involved in narcotics.

My mistake - you are probably right. I have to wonder what happened to some of these younger south side guys in this era and whether anyone involved today was once aligned with Chicago Heights and involved in these chop shop rackets at a young age. They definitely were using younger guys to do a lot of this work.

I think the only remaining member of the old northside crew is Matassa. I can't think of anyone alive from the Heights beyond Nick Guzzino still around?

[Snakes]

Were Chris and Clement Messino were involved in the Chop Shop War/Southside guys? Or am I off in that?

I always thought they post-dated the peak of the chop shop wars and were more involved in narcotics.

My mistake - you are probably right. I have to wonder what happened to some of these younger south side guys in this era and whether anyone involved today was once aligned with Chicago Heights and involved in these chop shop rackets at a young age. They definitely were using younger guys to do a lot of this work.

I think the only remaining member of the old northside crew is Matassa. I can't think of anyone alive from the Heights beyond Nick Guzzino still around?

Yeah, Guzzino may be it as far as major players are concerned. Tocco, Palermo, Morgano, Roviaro, Rossetti... all dead, and have been for some time.

[SolarSolano]

Dominic Barbaro also passed last year. I believe he was from Taylor Street but worked for Tocco at one point.

[Villain]

Nice pics. You can see from their eyes that Catuara, Annerino, and Billy Dauber were all stone cold killers.

Given that Red Wemette has stated that Catuara (at least in the 70s) was a capo, how many of these guys were his soldiers? Annerino I believe was one of Catuara’s main lieutenants. Then you have Fidanzi and Ferraro. Any others that belonged to Catuara’s crew? I understand that Guzzino did, but then I assume after Catuara was hit he transferred to the Heights?

The Guzzinos (Richie, Sam and Nick), the Franzes, the D'Andreas, Rubino, Fidanzi, Pilotto, Palermo, Roviaro ....were always with the Heights.....thats like saying old man Joe Guzzino or John Roberto transferred to the Heights lol

[PolackTony]

Nice pics. You can see from their eyes that Catuara, Annerino, and Billy Dauber were all stone cold killers.

Given that Red Wemette has stated that Catuara (at least in the 70s) was a capo, how many of these guys were his soldiers? Annerino I believe was one of Catuara’s main lieutenants. Then you have Fidanzi and Ferraro. Any others that belonged to Catuara’s crew? I understand that Guzzino did, but then I assume after Catuara was hit he transferred to the Heights?

The Guzzinos (Richie, Sam and Nick) Rubino, Fidanzi, Pilotto....were always with the Heights.....thats like saying old man Joe Guzzino transferred to the Heights lol

True, especially in light of the longtime Guzzino family allegiance to the Ruberto/Emery/LaPorte crew. I don’t know where I read that Sam Guzzino was working for Catuara, but it made me wonder given his relationship to the Heights crew.

Same as with the wider Buccieri crew succession, I feel like there are still some things that we don’t fully understand about the South Suburbs/NWI mob. I often go back to think over the 1962 convo between Giancana and Joe Costello, where Costello asked if he had the right to go through his “Gobrachino” to speak with LaPorte about his liquor license beef with Fusco. My assumption, prior to reading that document, would’ve always been that LaPorte was Costello’s capodecina, but clearly he wasn’t. We still don’t know really know for sure how many actual formal capodecini were down there. At the very least we seem to have had LaPorte and his successors and Catuara (not sure when Catuara got his stripes and who he succeeded, or if his crew was created de novo). We can probably add the NWI crew for three at least. The Castellis were also of course old school Chi Heights mafiosi, like the Guzzinos, so if Joe Costello was not under LaPorte, it wouldn’t surprise me if guys like Guzzino and Fidanzi were answering to Catuara, at least for a time (always possible guys were transferred to different crews over time). Perhaps after Catuara was taken out, there was no longer any other crews in the Far South region apart from the main LaPorte/Pilotto/Tocco crew and any Catuara guys who survived after the smoke cleared were transferred.

[Villain]

Nice pics. You can see from their eyes that Catuara, Annerino, and Billy Dauber were all stone cold killers.

Given that Red Wemette has stated that Catuara (at least in the 70s) was a capo, how many of these guys were his soldiers? Annerino I believe was one of Catuara’s main lieutenants. Then you have Fidanzi and Ferraro. Any others that belonged to Catuara’s crew? I understand that Guzzino did, but then I assume after Catuara was hit he transferred to the Heights?

The Guzzinos (Richie, Sam and Nick) Rubino, Fidanzi, Pilotto....were always with the Heights.....thats like saying old man Joe Guzzino transferred to the Heights lol

True, especially in light of the longtime Guzzino family allegiance to the Ruberto/Emery/LaPorte crew. I don’t know where I read that Sam Guzzino was working for Catuara, but it made me wonder given his relationship to the Heights crew.

Same as with the wider Buccieri crew succession, I feel like there are still some things that we don’t fully understand about the South Suburbs/NWI mob. I often go back to think over the 1962 convo between Giancana and Joe Costello, where Costello asked if he had the right to go through his “Gobrachino” to speak with LaPorte about his liquor license beef with Fusco. My assumption, prior to reading that document, would’ve always been that LaPorte was Costello’s capodecina, but clearly he wasn’t. We still don’t know really know for sure how many actual formal capodecini were down there. At the very least we seem to have had LaPorte and his successors and Catuara (not sure when Catuara got his stripes and who he succeeded, or if his crew was created de novo). We can probably add the NWI crew for three at least. The Castellis were also of course old school Chi Heights mafiosi, like the Guzzinos, so if Joe Costello was not under LaPorte, it wouldn’t surprise me if guys like Guzzino and Fidanzi were answering to Catuara, at least for a time (always possible guys were transferred to different crews over time). Perhaps after Catuara was taken out, there was no longer any other crews in the Far South region apart from the main LaPorte/Pilotto/Tocco crew and any Catuara guys who survived after the smoke cleared were transferred.

LaPorte was a territorial boss who had jurisdiction over Chicago Heights, C City, Will County, Joliet, Northwest Indiana, and by the late 60s also had jurisdiction over John Roselli and also controlled a crew in AZ. This means that LaPorte probably had a capo below him who was in charge of the Chicago Heights and C City areas, obviously because he also had a non-Italian crew boss like Francis Curry in charge of Joliet and capos like Morgano or Zizzo in charge of NW Indiana.

[Villain]

Costello wanted for his caporegime to convince LaPorte to take some action against Fusco....

[PolackTony]

Nice pics. You can see from their eyes that Catuara, Annerino, and Billy Dauber were all stone cold killers.

Given that Red Wemette has stated that Catuara (at least in the 70s) was a capo, how many of these guys were his soldiers? Annerino I believe was one of Catuara’s main lieutenants. Then you have Fidanzi and Ferraro. Any others that belonged to Catuara’s crew? I understand that Guzzino did, but then I assume after Catuara was hit he transferred to the Heights?

The Guzzinos (Richie, Sam and Nick) Rubino, Fidanzi, Pilotto....were always with the Heights.....thats like saying old man Joe Guzzino transferred to the Heights lol

True, especially in light of the longtime Guzzino family allegiance to the Ruberto/Emery/LaPorte crew. I don’t know where I read that Sam Guzzino was working for Catuara, but it made me wonder given his relationship to the Heights crew.

Same as with the wider Buccieri crew succession, I feel like there are still some things that we don’t fully understand about the South Suburbs/NWI mob. I often go back to think over the 1962 convo between Giancana and Joe Costello, where Costello asked if he had the right to go through his “Gobrachino” to speak with LaPorte about his liquor license beef with Fusco. My assumption, prior to reading that document, would’ve always been that LaPorte was Costello’s capodecina, but clearly he wasn’t. We still don’t know really know for sure how many actual formal capodecini were down there. At the very least we seem to have had LaPorte and his successors and Catuara (not sure when Catuara got his stripes and who he succeeded, or if his crew was created de novo). We can probably add the NWI crew for three at least. The Castellis were also of course old school Chi Heights mafiosi, like the Guzzinos, so if Joe Costello was not under LaPorte, it wouldn’t surprise me if guys like Guzzino and Fidanzi were answering to Catuara, at least for a time (always possible guys were transferred to different crews over time). Perhaps after Catuara was taken out, there was no longer any other crews in the Far South region apart from the main LaPorte/Pilotto/Tocco crew and any Catuara guys who survived after the smoke cleared were transferred.

LaPorte was a territorial boss who had jurisdiction over Chicago Heights, C City, Will County, Joliet, Northwest Indiana, and by the late 60s also had jurisdiction over John Roselli and also controlled a crew in AZ. This means that LaPorte probably had a capo below him who was in charge of the Chicago Heights and C City areas, obviously because he also had a non-Italian crew boss like Francis Curry in charge of Joliet and capos like Morgano or Zizzo in charge of NW Indiana.

Yeah, I’m overall pretty sympathetic to your “territorial boss” theory. I think that you’ve made a strong case for it in a number of threads and it would help to explain some of the particular structure that Chicago had in the past. We also have that 1960s-era CI that discussed the “Board of Directors”, and not all of the guys that we might assume were capodecini seemed to have had a seat on it. But I’m still undecided on this, as I don’t know if there really were those with a formal rank of capodecina who formally answered to another capodecina who actually outranked them, or if there were just some capos (as in any other family) who were bigger earners, had more influence and buttons, and were thus “first among equals”.

I recall B (I think) in the last couple of months noting that the Genovese or another family had something like a “capodecina dei capodecini” position (and I don’t recall if this was a formal rank or just a functional role). If so, this would be very interesting as it might be a parallel to your territorial boss theory.

[Villain]

Nice pics. You can see from their eyes that Catuara, Annerino, and Billy Dauber were all stone cold killers.

Given that Red Wemette has stated that Catuara (at least in the 70s) was a capo, how many of these guys were his soldiers? Annerino I believe was one of Catuara’s main lieutenants. Then you have Fidanzi and Ferraro. Any others that belonged to Catuara’s crew? I understand that Guzzino did, but then I assume after Catuara was hit he transferred to the Heights?

The Guzzinos (Richie, Sam and Nick) Rubino, Fidanzi, Pilotto....were always with the Heights.....thats like saying old man Joe Guzzino transferred to the Heights lol

True, especially in light of the longtime Guzzino family allegiance to the Ruberto/Emery/LaPorte crew. I don’t know where I read that Sam Guzzino was working for Catuara, but it made me wonder given his relationship to the Heights crew.

Same as with the wider Buccieri crew succession, I feel like there are still some things that we don’t fully understand about the South Suburbs/NWI mob. I often go back to think over the 1962 convo between Giancana and Joe Costello, where Costello asked if he had the right to go through his “Gobrachino” to speak with LaPorte about his liquor license beef with Fusco. My assumption, prior to reading that document, would’ve always been that LaPorte was Costello’s capodecina, but clearly he wasn’t. We still don’t know really know for sure how many actual formal capodecini were down there. At the very least we seem to have had LaPorte and his successors and Catuara (not sure when Catuara got his stripes and who he succeeded, or if his crew was created de novo). We can probably add the NWI crew for three at least. The Castellis were also of course old school Chi Heights mafiosi, like the Guzzinos, so if Joe Costello was not under LaPorte, it wouldn’t surprise me if guys like Guzzino and Fidanzi were answering to Catuara, at least for a time (always possible guys were transferred to different crews over time). Perhaps after Catuara was taken out, there was no longer any other crews in the Far South region apart from the main LaPorte/Pilotto/Tocco crew and any Catuara guys who survived after the smoke cleared were transferred.

LaPorte was a territorial boss who had jurisdiction over Chicago Heights, C City, Will County, Joliet, Northwest Indiana, and by the late 60s also had jurisdiction over John Roselli and also controlled a crew in AZ. This means that LaPorte probably had a capo below him who was in charge of the Chicago Heights and C City areas, obviously because he also had a non-Italian crew boss like Francis Curry in charge of Joliet and capos like Morgano or Zizzo in charge of NW Indiana.

Yeah, I’m overall pretty sympathetic to your “territorial boss” theory. I think that you’ve made a strong case for it in a number of threads and it would help to explain some of the particular structure that Chicago had in the past. We also have that 1960s-era CI that discussed the “Board of Directors”, and not all of the guys that we might assume were capodecini seemed to have had a seat on it. But I’m still undecided on this, as I don’t know if there really were those with a formal rank of capodecina who formally answered to another capodecina who actually outranked them, or if there were just some capos (as in any other family) who were bigger earners, had more influence and buttons, and were thus “first among equals”.

I recall B (I think) in the last couple of months noting that the Genovese or another family had something like a “capodecina dei capodecini” position (and I don’t recall if this was a formal rank or just a functional role). If so, this would be very interesting as it might be a parallel to your territorial boss theory.

Yeah and Eboli is another great researcher who also stated something similar regarding the Genoveses. I also believe that the Pittsburgh fam had similar hierarchy with that "capo squadrone" spot...

[PolackTony]

Costello wanted for his caporegime to convince LaPorte to take some action against Fusco....

Yes. The question still remains for me whether this was because LaPorte was formally above Costello’s capodecina in the chain of command, or because LaPorte was simply a powerful capo who controlled the liquor licenses in the Chi Heights area.

Also, any guesses as to who Costello’s capodecina might’ve been?

Additionally, what was Fusco’s exact placement at this time? Was he a capo himself, or a lieutenant under Ferraro?

[PolackTony]

Costello wanted for his caporegime to convince LaPorte to take some action against Fusco....

Yes. The question still remains for me whether this was because LaPorte was formally above Costello’s capodecina in the chain of command, or because LaPorte was simply a powerful capo who controlled the liquor licenses in the Chi Heights area.

Also, any guesses as to who Costello’s capodecina might’ve been?

Additionally, what was Fusco’s exact placement at this time? Was he a capo himself, or a lieutenant under Ferraro?

FYI I cross-posted this over to the Chicago dumping ground thread to not further move this thread away from its original topic.

viewtopic.php?f=29&t=6463&p=189406#p189406

[SolarSolano]

Anyone familiar with this guy from the Chop Shop Wars? Is this legitimtate?

https://www.vice.com/en/article/3kynqy/ ... -out-alive

[Snakes]

Anyone familiar with this guy from the Chop Shop Wars? Is this legitimtate?

https://www.vice.com/en/article/3kynqy/ ... -out-alive

I remember when this book came out. I think the guy is a bullshitter and most everyone at the time thought the same

[PolackTony]

Anyone familiar with this guy from the Chop Shop Wars? Is this legitimtate?

https://www.vice.com/en/article/3kynqy/ ... -out-alive

I remember when this book came out. I think the guy is a bullshitter and most everyone at the time thought the same

I have the book. He claims that he was a hillbilly kid in WV and his uncle already was a connected guy in the Heights who ran a bar and brought him up to work for him.

That all may have actually happened. I wouldn't doubt that the guy may have been connected, but I don't know that he was ever formally an associate in the sense of being "on record" with a made guy. And the claim that this Zazzetti guy whacked Giancana... Always with the scenarios.