Etna wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 8:37 am
I'm really wondering if Montreal was very structured like a traditional family and most aren't made - and simply followed their own ranks? Or was it kind of a loose confederation of criminals?
No it is not structured like a typical LCN family is. It is rather, like you say, a loose confederation of criminals where the Italian trait has been mostly dominant and influent over the other groups for several decades.
So I guess I see a few things that raise questions.
- French Canadian and Italian criminals and others (i.e. Joe DiMaulo, Reynauld Desjardens & Joe Bravo) all had a similar ranking.
- I recall Joey Bravo claimed he and Reynauld were "made" by Vito. If that's true, I almost wonder if Vito tossed the Italian only membership and felt like he'd start his own "hybrid" organization that wasn't officially cosa nostra even though he was a member himself?
Raynald Desjardins, while he was key player into Montreal underworld and brother-in-law of Jos Di Maulo, was not a "made" man in the sense we understand it in the US.
You must not read the Montreal Mafia in the same way you read a US borgata.
I don't read it that way, which is why I'm asking. If Joey Bravo said he and Reynauld were made, I think Vito tried to formulate his own organization with his own style.
First Joe Bravo could say anything he wanted to people in Bagheria because the latter were in position to check if his allegations were true or not. Joe Bravo used to be closed to the Rizzutos, but he soon became an embarrassement to them.
One thing is for sure is that the Rizzuto organization, a perfect exemple of a Sicilian cosca in North America whose rules of admission into in are stricly to members who have blood relationships or inter-marriage with its members, would never made an outsider, and moreover an individual like Raynald Desjardins, whose racine a purely French-Canadian. To believe otherwise is full of improbabilities.
So what about guys like Valentino Morielli? Also, that's the key question.
Vito was a Captain in the Bonanno Family - who would be making people? If so, would they be making people into the Cattolica Eraclea cosca? or is that a totally different group? Not sure if I am making sense. They transplanted from Sicily to Canada. So if they make someone in Canada, are they recognized only in Sicily?
There was no Rizzuto cosca in Sicily, but a Manno cosca which the Rizzutos were defential to. And the whole Cattolica Eraclea Manno cosca answered to Siculiana's, which were made of the Cuntreras and Caruanas.
In other words, in Canada, an specially in Montreal the Cuntrera-Caruana faction was viewed as "senior" to the Rizzutos in terms of hierarchy within the mafia organisation in the province of Agrigento.
I dont get the idea about the name Valentino Morielli into the subject of this discussion. What is it ?
The Caruana-Cuntrera family is probably the most fascinating mafia organization of all time. 99% of mafia groups have a specific geographical territory which they are inextricably linked to whether it be Corleone, New York or Philadelphia but the Caruana-Cuntreras operate across the globe. From Sicily to Canada to South America to the US. Spawned from the Siculiana family it's members infiltrate other groups to expand the network and with great success. They were/are a sort of new age mafia organization, their evolution was spurred by drug money. There isn't a single other cosa nostra group that compares to them, you'd actually have to look to the Ndrangheta to find a decent comparison.
johnny_scootch wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 6:15 pm
The Caruana-Cuntrera family is probably the most fascinating mafia organization of all time. 99% of mafia groups have a specific geographical territory which they are inextricably linked to whether it be Corleone, New York or Philadelphia but the Caruana-Cuntreras operate across the globe. From Sicily to Canada to South America to the US. Spawned from the Siculiana family it's members infiltrate other groups to expand the network and with great success. They were/are a sort of new age mafia organization, their evolution was spurred by drug money. There isn't a single other cosa nostra group that compares to them, you'd actually have to look to the Ndrangheta to find a decent comparison.
Laurentian wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 5:36 pm
There was no Rizzuto cosca in Sicily, but a Manno cosca which the Rizzutos were defential to. And the whole Cattolica Eraclea Manno cosca answered to Siculiana's, which were made of the Cuntreras and Caruanas.
In other words, in Canada, an specially in Montreal the Cuntrera-Caruana faction was viewed as "senior" to the Rizzutos in terms of hierarchy within the mafia organisation in the province of Agrigento.
I dont get the idea about the name Valentino Morielli into the subject of this discussion. What is it ?
johnny_scootch wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 6:15 pm
The Caruana-Cuntrera family is probably the most fascinating mafia organization of all time. 99% of mafia groups have a specific geographical territory which they are inextricably linked to whether it be Corleone, New York or Philadelphia but the Caruana-Cuntreras operate across the globe. From Sicily to Canada to South America to the US. Spawned from the Siculiana family it's members infiltrate other groups to expand the network and with great success. They were/are a sort of new age mafia organization, their evolution was spurred by drug money. There isn't a single other cosa nostra group that compares to them, you'd actually have to look to the Ndrangheta to find a decent comparison.
Yes, my man! I agree wholeheartedly. They even controlled crime in Ostia, Rome. It took me awhile, but I think the Father- Son team of Sicilians gangsters on Suburra might be based off them.
Etna wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 7:12 pm
Sorry all for my confusion with this group. Didn't intensd to frustrate anyone.
No, no...you are fine my man..your post are good
I was just happy someone other than me sees the Sicilian- Agrigento mafia hierarchy here.
If we could communicate in PM, I'd be very interested in hearing about that structure.
I know there are capo mandamentos and such there, but if its further detail, I'm not as familiar.
Until his murder in 1981, the capomandamento of Siculiana-Cattolica was Giuseppe Settecasi, boss of Alessandria della Rocca, province of Agrigento. During the conflict between Violi & Nick Rizzuto, Settecasi had sent a mobster from Agrigento, Carmelo Salemi, to try to mediate the conflict (I think Salemi was Boss or at least the equivalent of a Capo). Him too was killed early 80's (I don't have the date sorry).
If I'm not mistaken, it's Carmelo Coletti who replaces Settecasi at the head of the mandamento but he was killed not long after in 1983. I don't really know after that if the guys from Cattolica-Siculiana have depended on Agrigento's Capomandamento
Etna wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 7:12 pm
Sorry all for my confusion with this group. Didn't intensd to frustrate anyone.
No, no...you are fine my man..your post are good
I was just happy someone other than me sees the Sicilian- Agrigento mafia hierarchy here.
If we could communicate in PM, I'd be very interested in hearing about that structure.
I know there are capo mandamentos and such there, but if its further detail, I'm not as familiar.
Until his murder in 1981, the capomandamento of Siculiana-Cattolica was Giuseppe Settecasi, boss of Alessandria della Rocca, province of Agrigento. During the conflict between Violi & Nick Rizzuto, Settecasi had sent a mobster from Agrigento, Carmelo Salemi, to try to mediate the conflict (I think Salemi was Boss or at least the equivalent of a Capo). Him too was killed early 80's (I don't have the date sorry).
If I'm not mistaken, it's Carmelo Coletti who replaces Settecasi at the head of the mandamento but he was killed not long after in 1983. I don't really know after that if the guys from Cattolica-Siculiana have depended on Agrigento's Capomandamento
giuseppe settecasi was the provincial boss of agrigento, a rank higher than capomandamento, the capomandamento of siculiana was leonardo caruana killed in 1981 by the 'corleonesi'
Etna wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 7:12 pm
Sorry all for my confusion with this group. Didn't intensd to frustrate anyone.
No, no...you are fine my man..your post are good
I was just happy someone other than me sees the Sicilian- Agrigento mafia hierarchy here.
If we could communicate in PM, I'd be very interested in hearing about that structure.
I know there are capo mandamentos and such there, but if its further detail, I'm not as familiar.
Until his murder in 1981, the capomandamento of Siculiana-Cattolica was Giuseppe Settecasi, boss of Alessandria della Rocca, province of Agrigento. During the conflict between Violi & Nick Rizzuto, Settecasi had sent a mobster from Agrigento, Carmelo Salemi, to try to mediate the conflict (I think Salemi was Boss or at least the equivalent of a Capo). Him too was killed early 80's (I don't have the date sorry).
If I'm not mistaken, it's Carmelo Coletti who replaces Settecasi at the head of the mandamento but he was killed not long after in 1983. I don't really know after that if the guys from Cattolica-Siculiana have depended on Agrigento's Capomandamento
giuseppe settecasi was the provincial boss of agrigento, a rank higher than capomandamento, the capomandamento of siculiana was leonardo caruana killed in 1981 by the 'corleonesi'
My bad I confused the two ranks, thank you for the correction.
Etna wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 7:12 pm
Sorry all for my confusion with this group. Didn't intensd to frustrate anyone.
No, no...you are fine my man..your post are good
I was just happy someone other than me sees the Sicilian- Agrigento mafia hierarchy here.
If we could communicate in PM, I'd be very interested in hearing about that structure.
I know there are capo mandamentos and such there, but if its further detail, I'm not as familiar.
Until his murder in 1981, the capomandamento of Siculiana-Cattolica was Giuseppe Settecasi, boss of Alessandria della Rocca, province of Agrigento. During the conflict between Violi & Nick Rizzuto, Settecasi had sent a mobster from Agrigento, Carmelo Salemi, to try to mediate the conflict (I think Salemi was Boss or at least the equivalent of a Capo). Him too was killed early 80's (I don't have the date sorry).
If I'm not mistaken, it's Carmelo Coletti who replaces Settecasi at the head of the mandamento but he was killed not long after in 1983. I don't really know after that if the guys from Cattolica-Siculiana have depended on Agrigento's Capomandamento
Wasn't there a Carmelo Coletti from Porto Empedocle?
Etna wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 7:12 pm
Sorry all for my confusion with this group. Didn't intensd to frustrate anyone.
No, no...you are fine my man..your post are good
I was just happy someone other than me sees the Sicilian- Agrigento mafia hierarchy here.
If we could communicate in PM, I'd be very interested in hearing about that structure.
I know there are capo mandamentos and such there, but if its further detail, I'm not as familiar.
Until his murder in 1981, the capomandamento of Siculiana-Cattolica was Giuseppe Settecasi, boss of Alessandria della Rocca, province of Agrigento. During the conflict between Violi & Nick Rizzuto, Settecasi had sent a mobster from Agrigento, Carmelo Salemi, to try to mediate the conflict (I think Salemi was Boss or at least the equivalent of a Capo). Him too was killed early 80's (I don't have the date sorry).
If I'm not mistaken, it's Carmelo Coletti who replaces Settecasi at the head of the mandamento but he was killed not long after in 1983. I don't really know after that if the guys from Cattolica-Siculiana have depended on Agrigento's Capomandamento
Wasn't there a Carmelo Coletti from Porto Empedocle?
johnny_scootch wrote: ↑Sat Nov 07, 2020 6:15 pm
The Caruana-Cuntrera family is probably the most fascinating mafia organization of all time. 99% of mafia groups have a specific geographical territory which they are inextricably linked to whether it be Corleone, New York or Philadelphia but the Caruana-Cuntreras operate across the globe. From Sicily to Canada to South America to the US. Spawned from the Siculiana family it's members infiltrate other groups to expand the network and with great success. They were/are a sort of new age mafia organization, their evolution was spurred by drug money. There isn't a single other cosa nostra group that compares to them, you'd actually have to look to the Ndrangheta to find a decent comparison.
Fascinating , I don’t know much about them
Do you have a sense of their drug business today and what countries they distribute too
Venezuela has become a Narco state where ironically the US dollar currency market is also exploding. This clans connections likely runs to the top of the Govt and their international connections / trade and access to US dollars likely make them even more untouchable in that country.
