Cleveland John Scalish Deathbed wishes

[JeremyTheJew]

So... has it ever been questioned about who John Scalish really wanted as boss?? From my understanding Licavoli didn't even want the spot and this came from left field and the lawyer apparently possible had ulterior motives...

This could also be part of the demise of Cleveland...

[IrishDave]

I think Lonardo was the logical choice. Rockman said that Licavoli was chosen to be new boss but Rockman was closer to Licavoli then he was to Lonardo. The question was weather Rockman could control Licavoli easier then Lonardo.

[Frank]

Do you mean John Scalish

[Angelo Santino]

There was also something from some source that claimed as early as the 1960's Scalish wanted Licavoli to succeed him. I'm not sure which is the more accurate version.

Wrong. There was no confirmed 1960's source. - CC.

[FriendofHenry]

What, no love for Tony Delsanter

[IrishDave]

Chris, do you recall where you read or heard that? I've only heard of the Rockman account.


Delsanter seems like an interesting character. He was Fratianno partner when they were both starting out. What's his story? Ran Warren and was the number 3. But what else?

[FriendofFamily]

Do you mean John Scalish

Thanks Frank - I corrected the Subject Line Matter of the misidentified person. No since of ruining a perfectly good topic by people confusing John Scalish and James Licavoli aka Jack White.

[Villain]

Who was more powerful (organizational influence) Rockman or Licavoli?

[JeremyTheJew]

Who was more powerful (organizational influence) Rockman or Licavoli?

Anyones wanna comment?

[Stroccos]

Who was more powerful (organizational influence) Rockman or Licavoli?

licavoli , jack was argubelly the number 2 or 3 man In the Cleveland syndicate before becoming boss .

i would assume rockman help bring in more money and infuelce to the family via his role in the unions ,

[Villain]

Who was more powerful (organizational influence) Rockman or Licavoli?

licavoli , jack was argubelly the number 2 or 3 man In the Cleveland syndicate before becoming boss .

i would assume rockman help bring in more money and infuelce to the family via his role in the unions ,

Thanks

[Angelo Santino]

Chris, do you recall where you read or heard that? I've only heard of the Rockman account.


Delsanter seems like an interesting character. He was Fratianno partner when they were both starting out. What's his story? Ran Warren and was the number 3. But what else?

I was mistaken. I took some time to look it up and, no. There's no source that states this. Sorry and thank you at the same time, I had this in my mind that there was.

Always question.

[IrishDave]

Chris, do you recall where you read or heard that? I've only heard of the Rockman account.


Delsanter seems like an interesting character. He was Fratianno partner when they were both starting out. What's his story? Ran Warren and was the number 3. But what else?

I was mistaken. I took some time to look it up and, no. There's no source that states this. Sorry and thank you at the same time, I had this in my mind that there was.

Always question.

Thanks for looking into it. That would have been an interesting angle.

[Adam]

I've always had questions about the story that Scalish wanted Lonardo to be boss. And a lot of it comes from Lonardo seeming to be out of the loop on things. But these are some odd things:

1. There's the claim that even Licavoli thought Lonardo should be boss, but Licavoli specifically didn't make him part of his administration when he took over.

2. Lonardo's record of testimony after flipping is incredibly light. Which is really surprising for an underboss and acting boss. Not much in other cities. Places like Detroit where he never testifies.

3. I find it odd that Lonardo was sometimes a courier for the Vegas skim. Seems odd for a high ranking member. I know Rockman did too sometimes, but he was actually in charge of it and holding onto the money.

4. Lonardo's knowledge of what was even going on in Cleveland in the 60s 70s and early 80s seems limited. I've read his testimony about murders and bombings during that time and its full of him just not having any knowledge about them, and a few where someone told him something.

5. Fratianno doesn't really seem to have known him at all. Which isn't a big deal, but Fratianno talks about Kicavoli, Moceri and Delsanter a lot, but Lonardo gets one reference from Fratianno about being the new underboss.

There's more, but the main thing is he wasn't really used by the government for very much. Which is odd.

[Angelo Santino]

I've always had questions about the story that Scalish wanted Lonardo to be boss. And a lot of it comes from Lonardo seeming to be out of the loop on things. But these are some odd things:

1. There's the claim that even Licavoli thought Lonardo should be boss, but Licavoli specifically didn't make him part of his administration when he took over.

2. Lonardo's record of testimony after flipping is incredibly light. Which is really surprising for an underboss and acting boss. Not much in other cities. Places like Detroit where he never testifies.

3. I find it odd that Lonardo was sometimes a courier for the Vegas skim. Seems odd for a high ranking member. I know Rockman did too sometimes, but he was actually in charge of it and holding onto the money.

4. Lonardo's knowledge of what was even going on in Cleveland in the 60s 70s and early 80s seems limited. I've read his testimony about murders and bombings during that time and its full of him just not having any knowledge about them, and a few where someone told him something.

5. Fratianno doesn't really seem to have known him at all. Which isn't a big deal, but Fratianno talks about Kicavoli, Moceri and Delsanter a lot, but Lonardo gets one reference from Fratianno about being the new underboss.

There's more, but the main thing is he wasn't really used by the government for very much. Which is odd.

Maybe all those five reasons are why Licavoli became boss and not Lonardo. Licavoli appeared to be known at the national level. His links to Detroit and St. Louis seemed to have been a factor. Those ties may have been simply a relative amico nos in St Louis and being on a hello/goodbye basis with Detroit in 1970 (his affiliation with Detroit-whether as a member or assoc, ended decades prior), but for a Family looking to rejuvenate itself, having national contacts would probably be a factor.

Always appreciate and enjoy your thoughts, Adam. Salut.