Rochester Family origin date

[BeatiPaoli]

To Everyone: I am sure this will be a very short thread, because I am confident one of the many learned academics/researchers on this Forum will have an almost precise approximate time period (month/year) the Rochester Family came into existence as an independent Family under Cosa Nostra. The reason I am asking the question is I have read (or remembered to have read) 2 differing time periods:

The first is late 1968, after Stefano Magaddino was raided (I don't recall the place) and $ 400,000 was discovered. This flew in the face of statements he had made to his underlings that Christmas was going to be a little thin. Subsequently, Todaro and Pieri met with Frank Valente in Rochester, all agreed to depose/have deposed Magaddino as boss of the Buffalo Family, Todaro and Pieri stayed with Buffalo and formed 2 competing factions, but Valente announced Rochester's independence, which which the other 2 agreed.

The second is at a meeting (I do not recall the reason for this meeting) in 1970 at a location owned by Valente in Rochester where he declared Rochester's independence from Buffalo as a separate Family under Cosa Nostra.

BTW, I could be wrong about both of the aforementioned events.

Any clarification to the approximate time of Rochester's formation would be much appreciated.

Regards,
BeatiPaoli

[Wiseguy]

As Capeci has pointed out, there is the technicality of whether they were ever a family (as opposed to a breakaway group) since they didn't receive Commission approval. Anyway, Capeci said the split started in the late 1960s and by 1970 Rochester was being referred to as it's own family.

[BeatiPaoli]

To Wiseguy: Thank you for your timely reply! Much appreciated! I do believe it was an additional Family within Cosa Nostra. There was an "Ask Andy" segment in Gangland on 8/24/98 in which Andy listed the 28 Families of Cosa Nostra operating in the U.S. at one time, and Rochester was among them. As he pointed out, the FBI agreed with that number. The 4th paragraph began, " In 1960, there were 28 Families, including the five in New York.........."

Regards,
BeatiPaoli

[BeatiPaoli]

To Everyone: First and only bump. Just want to see if there are any other comments on this subject matter.

Regards,
BeatiPaoli

[tmarotta]

I would just add that the family was pretty much done by 1988 after the last federal indictments. You had guys get arrested here and there like Marotta, associate Tom Torpey, and alleged members Frassetto and Celestino but it was done as a family by 1988. An interesting thing we learned from Mikey Scars is that exiled boss Frank Valenti may have been active in Arizona under the LA Family.

Here is a list of the made guys who are still alive:
1. Loren Piccarretto
2. Thomas Marotta
3. Donald Paone
4. Dominic Celestino

Possibly Made:
1. Frank Frassetto
2. Reigo Marterano

[Pogo The Clown]

Marterano is a confirmed member though he is probably dead.


Pogo

[tmarotta]

Thanks for the info Pogo. Can't find an obituary for Marterano so I will list him as alive until I hear otherwise. Guess they still have more living members than Cleveland and Pittsburgh combined.

1.Dominic Celestino
2. Thomas Marotta
3. Reigo Marterano
4. Donald Paone
5. Loren Piccarretto

Possibly Made:
1. Frank Frassetto

[furiofromnaples]

To Everyone: I am sure this will be a very short thread, because I am confident one of the many learned academics/researchers on this Forum will have an almost precise approximate time period (month/year) the Rochester Family came into existence as an independent Family under Cosa Nostra. The reason I am asking the question is I have read (or remembered to have read) 2 differing time periods:

The first is late 1968, after Stefano Magaddino was raided (I don't recall the place) and $ 400,000 was discovered. This flew in the face of statements he had made to his underlings that Christmas was going to be a little thin. Subsequently, Todaro and Pieri met with Frank Valente in Rochester, all agreed to depose/have deposed Magaddino as boss of the Buffalo Family, Todaro and Pieri stayed with Buffalo and formed 2 competing factions, but Valente announced Rochester's independence, which which the other 2 agreed.

The second is at a meeting (I do not recall the reason for this meeting) in 1970 at a location owned by Valente in Rochester where he declared Rochester's independence from Buffalo as a separate Family under Cosa Nostra.

BTW, I could be wrong about both of the aforementioned events.

Any clarification to the approximate time of Rochester's formation would be much appreciated.

Regards,
BeatiPaoli

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stefano_Magaddino

Magaddino's empire began to crumble in 1968, when police found $500,000 stashed away in Magaddino's funeral home and his son's attic. "At that time, Magaddino had been telling his underlings that money was tight, and he could not afford to pay them Christmas bonuses," Hartnett said. "People began to stop trusting him when we found all that money."

https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflat ... unt=500000

$500,000 in 1968 is worth $3,683,750.00 today

Its the same with Profaci,this siggies more are rich and more are greedy and miser.

[BeatiPaoli]

To Pogo, Tmarotta, and Furio: Thank you all for the information!!!

Can anyone verify the following statement I made originally:

"The first is late 1968, after Stefano Magaddino was raided (I don't recall the place) and $ 400,000 was discovered. This flew in the face of statements he had made to his underlings that Christmas was going to be a little thin. Subsequently, Todaro and Pieri met with Frank Valente in Rochester, all agreed to depose/have deposed Magaddino as boss of the Buffalo Family, Todaro and Pieri stayed with Buffalo and formed 2 competing factions, but Valente announced Rochester's independence, which which the other 2 agreed."

This meeting between Todaro, Pieri, and Valente was allegedly to have taken place before Christmas 1968.

Regards,
BeatiPaoli

[UpstateDapper]

An interesting thing we learned from Mikey Scars is that exiled boss Frank Valenti may have been active in Arizona under the LA Family.

This is interesting. I haven’t heard much of Valenti’s activities post-exile. I know after he was ousted by the Russotti/Gingello/Piccarreto leadership, he was arrested with Russell Bufalino in an extortion case out of Batavia, NY. After that I have him as going to prison until 1980. While he had some influence on the B-Team insurgents during the war in Rochester, all of the sources I’ve read said he was never directly involved and retired to Arizona (eventually Texas) by the 80s. What was Valenti up to under LA?

On the topic of Rochester origins, does anyone know what was going on in the city pre-Apalachin? There is very little information online. Buffalo was obviously in charge at the time, however It’s said Stanley Valenti ran things (as a capo?), though he was only in his 20s, which makes it seem unlikely he could’ve had a leadership position in LCN. Prior to 1957, the only information is of Pasquale Amico who was connected to Palmieri and died in 1947.

Thanks.

[JeremyTheJew]

Who led the A and B teams??? And C was Irish wasn't it??

Anyone have the threads discussing the ABC war

[tmarotta]

The A team was led by the recognized boss of Rochester Samuel "Reds" Russotti. The B team leader initially before he was murdered was Thomas Didio who was left in control of the Rochester rackets while Russotti, Piccarretto, and Salvatore Gingello were incarcerated for the Massaro murder. The C team emerged later after Didio was killed after having Gingello killed. The Cteam was essentially Gingello's crew making a grab for power. A new book by Thomas Taylor called Enter the C Team actually gives a lot of details. Taylor along with Thomas Torpey and Joey Tiraborelli were the main guys in the C Team. I spoke with Torpey before he died and he said Tiraborelli was pretty much a complete degenerate cokehead and gambler so it was mainly Torpey and Taylor calling the shots. Tiraborelli was the nephew of Russotti so the idea was if they could make a move and take over the rackets, they could run everything with Tiraborelli being the front since he was allegedly a made member. Essentially they felt they got shafted in terms of gambling and labor rackets after Gingello died and with the ongoing conflict they could step in and take over. After the John Fiorino murder it all went down the drain for the C team.

[TallGuy19]

It's interesting that Magaddino was giving Christmas bonuses to his underlings, it's usually the other way around.

[UpstateDapper]

The A team was led by the recognized boss of Rochester Samuel "Reds" Russotti. The B team leader initially before he was murdered was Thomas Didio who was left in control of the Rochester rackets while Russotti, Piccarretto, and Salvatore Gingello were incarcerated for the Massaro murder. The C team emerged later after Didio was killed after having Gingello killed. The Cteam was essentially Gingello's crew making a grab for power. A new book by Thomas Taylor called Enter the C Team actually gives a lot of details. Taylor along with Thomas Torpey and Joey Tiraborelli were the main guys in the C Team. I spoke with Torpey before he died and he said Tiraborelli was pretty much a complete degenerate cokehead and gambler so it was mainly Torpey and Taylor calling the shots. Tiraborelli was the nephew of Russotti so the idea was if they could make a move and take over the rackets, they could run everything with Tiraborelli being the front since he was allegedly a made member. Essentially they felt they got shafted in terms of gambling and labor rackets after Gingello died and with the ongoing conflict they could step in and take over. After the John Fiorino murder it all went down the drain for the C team.

Great info. This is all my understanding as well. To Jeremy’s point, the C-Team wasn’t exactly Irish mob, however the two T’s (Torpey and Taylor) I believe were Irish. They also hired the infamous Irish hitman Joe “Mad Dog” Sullivan to whack Fiorino. That guy killed dozens for the Genovese in NY. Most of the C guys were Italian non-made associates of the Rochester family though.

I actually have that same C-Team book. Haven’t read it yet, but I did finish that same author’s “Rochester Mob Wars” book, which albeit shallow, does give a good overview of the street war. I’m wondering if the Hammer Conspiracies dives any deeper. It was once $300, now it’s dropped to $50.

For my research, searching D&C newspaper archives actually seemed to give the best account of the events of the Rochester family. Only thing is you have to really dig.

This is a nice short video that explains things too:

Rochester Crime Family Documentary A/B Wars

[Pogo The Clown]

Here is a bunch of Rochester stuff I posted a while back.


viewtopic.php?f=29&t=4968&hilit=Tidbits