DiFronzo was lucky. Or...? (+ other Outfit sh*t)

[Frank]

The Outfit is very similar from the Five Families in that every crew is independent, but generally whatever crew the main boss comes from becomes the dominant one, where the members of that crew have the pick of the rackets and business opportunities being in the Outfit provides. What is unique is that the Outfit isn't some secret organization where its 'blood in blood out' - its a business and guys would walk away from the rackets and retire peacefully, while still staying semi-connected (investing in a juice loan or business deal through the Outfit - getting their kids cushy union jobs, etc.)

The Outfit's power shifted back and forth between Elmwood Park/Grand Avenue and Cicero/Taylor Street/Melrose Park frequently. The bosses generally want their crews running the show but there is substantial friction and I know for a fact that Aiuppa and Cerone hated each other - thus I'm sure their heirs Carlisi and DiFronzo hated each other. I'm of the belief that Ferriola was a street boss in name only - DiFronzo (who was Accardo's guy and Cerone's heir) was really the power in the Outfit in the 1980s after Aiuppa was gone. DiFronzo gave that up to Carlisi in part to help his brother then went to prison a few years later, came back and lived in retirement. I think his boyhood pal Joe Lombardo did the same thing in the 1990s - he was retired.

Johnny Monteleone stepped in to take over when Carlisi went away (Monteleone was a Cicero native, but also worked closely with the Melrose Carlisi/Aiuppa crew and would have been a logical replacement). Today, I think all the power is in Cicero, which absorbed Grand Avenue and what was left of Elmwood Park. I think Rudy Fratto and Al Mitria and anyone else whose left in Elmwood now work for Cicero.

I had read that DiFronzo had stepped back at one time to raise his grandson. It's possible that it was multiple reasons if true. Ok than we have Frank Calabrese saying DiFronzo didn't want it, and Flapjacks is the boss. Was that tape after Monteleone died? Or was Monteleone Flapjacks?

Andriacchi was "Flapjacks" because he owned a pancake restaurant. Monteleone was still alive when Jr. made the recordings.

This is another time period that gets confusing. The only thing I can think is that Andriacchi was the top boss and Monteleone was the day to day boss. I also wonder when Frank Calabrese said DiFronzo didn't want it, does that mean he gave it up or did he never have the position in the 90s It looks like he became top boss perhaps when Andriacchi got cancer.

[SolarSolano]

Sam was also in prison for the early 80s, correct?

[SolarSolano]

I tend to wonder if Accardo and DiFronzo retiring, then becoming active again - is more in-line with protecting their retirement income (which would likely be shut off when major indictments come down unless they actively got things moving again).

[Snakes]

Sam was also in prison for the early 80s, correct?

He got busted by the IRS sometime around then. I'm not sure if he did time for that or not but it would have been a year at the very most.

[Snakes]

The Outfit is very similar from the Five Families in that every crew is independent, but generally whatever crew the main boss comes from becomes the dominant one, where the members of that crew have the pick of the rackets and business opportunities being in the Outfit provides. What is unique is that the Outfit isn't some secret organization where its 'blood in blood out' - its a business and guys would walk away from the rackets and retire peacefully, while still staying semi-connected (investing in a juice loan or business deal through the Outfit - getting their kids cushy union jobs, etc.)

The Outfit's power shifted back and forth between Elmwood Park/Grand Avenue and Cicero/Taylor Street/Melrose Park frequently. The bosses generally want their crews running the show but there is substantial friction and I know for a fact that Aiuppa and Cerone hated each other - thus I'm sure their heirs Carlisi and DiFronzo hated each other. I'm of the belief that Ferriola was a street boss in name only - DiFronzo (who was Accardo's guy and Cerone's heir) was really the power in the Outfit in the 1980s after Aiuppa was gone. DiFronzo gave that up to Carlisi in part to help his brother then went to prison a few years later, came back and lived in retirement. I think his boyhood pal Joe Lombardo did the same thing in the 1990s - he was retired.

Johnny Monteleone stepped in to take over when Carlisi went away (Monteleone was a Cicero native, but also worked closely with the Melrose Carlisi/Aiuppa crew and would have been a logical replacement). Today, I think all the power is in Cicero, which absorbed Grand Avenue and what was left of Elmwood Park. I think Rudy Fratto and Al Mitria and anyone else whose left in Elmwood now work for Cicero.

I had read that DiFronzo had stepped back at one time to raise his grandson. It's possible that it was multiple reasons if true. Ok than we have Frank Calabrese saying DiFronzo didn't want it, and Flapjacks is the boss. Was that tape after Monteleone died? Or was Monteleone Flapjacks?

Andriacchi was "Flapjacks" because he owned a pancake restaurant. Monteleone was still alive when Jr. made the recordings.

This is another time period that gets confusing. The only thing I can think is that Andriacchi was the top boss and Monteleone was the day to day boss. I also wonder when Frank Calabrese said DiFronzo didn't want it, does that mean he gave it up or did he never have the position in the 90s It looks like he became top boss perhaps when Andriacchi got cancer.

I just take it as him not taking an active hand in Outfit affairs. I also believe that if he wanted something done, it got done. Or he helped out or advised on certain situations.

[Villain]

I know for a fact that Aiuppa and Cerone hated each other - thus I'm sure their heirs Carlisi and DiFronzo hated each other. DiFronzo gave that up to Carlisi in part to help his brother then went to prison a few years later.

I don't disagree with everything you stated. However, if you're so sure that Carlisi and DiFronzo hated each other because Auippa and Cerone hated each other, then WHY would Joe DiFronzo borrow money from Carlisi knowing that his brother supposedly hated him? That doesn't make any sense? It seems that Joe would have borrowed the money from his Brother John who was rich and also his immediate Boss.

Again, what evidence do you have that Joe DiFronzo borrowed money from Carlisi, a man you said his brother John "hated"? Also, what evidence do you have that Auippa & Cerone "hated" each other? Strong words.

In the Outfit, the juice crews always loaned the 'nut' (Outfit profits) and those profits always came from the top. These guys were fairly limited when they needed to borrow a few million to loan out - they didn't go to a bank and most of these gangsters didn't have millions sitting around waiting to be used for juice. Accardo was always wealthy - in the 1960s and 1970s - he became EXTREMELY wealthy because of the juice rackets, where he was probably making some serious multiples on his investment.

Here is what I know of Black Sam - he was raised in Buffalo's little italy and came to Chicago as a kid with his brother Al and their mother after the father died to live in Melrose Park. His brother Roy "The Clam Man" was one of Maggadino's guys in Buffalo - while Al quickly became a powerhouse in Cicero with his partner Leo Filipelli. Al and Sam stayed tight with Roy and knew a lot of East Coast guys. Al was one of Aiuppa's top guys and really ran the town of Cicero for him. They clashed often with Buccieri's crew. Sam stepped in when Al passed away in his 60s. Some guys called Sam "wings" for flying to the east coast, where he was the Outfit's liaison - but most called him Black Sam because he was tan.

Al didn't ran SOUTHERN Cicero (they didnt control the whole area because it was divided on north and south) for Aiuppa since it was overseen by Ansani and Rassano at the time. Al was just another big time bookmaker same as Ciapetta, Cornghold, Granito, Filipelli, Ortenzi and Sam Aiuppa, and most of them had Mafia contacts around the country since that was the point of bookmaking.

In addition, Aiuppa and his crew came up from the original Capone group, and Im not talking about the whole Capone Mob at the time, but instead Im talking about the Capone brothers Ralph, John and Albert, followed by John Moore aka Claude Maddox (Aiuppa's mentor), William Heeney, Joe Fusco, the Fischettis and Joe Corngold, who in turn all belonged to the old Cicero crew and also controlled the southwest side, and also possessed interests in Melrose Park and other West Side areas. In 1942 or 43, the Cicero area became divided between Ralph Capone/Maddox/Heeney/Aiuppa (southern part) and Campagna/Volpe/Maritote/Giancana (northern part)

[Frank]

I was looking up some stuff about Carlisi and DiFronzo and and when Accardo died. It's from 5- 28-92. UPI archives. First one side note that Accardo had a private funeral. The only known Outfit member that came to pay last respects where Rocco DeGrazio and Black Joe Amato. It's consistent with the UPI articles from earlier that year concerning the indictments of Carlisi and DiFronzo. This one states that the consensus is that with Accardo now gone that DiFronzo would be the new leader of the Outfit and has been running the Outfit for the last year, because Accardo was ailing. In the 1-92 UPI articles it had stated that Carlisi had semi retired in early 91 moved to Florida and was Outfit treasurer.

[Villain]

I was looking up some stuff about Carlisi and DiFronzo and and when Accardo died. It's from 5- 28-92. UPI archives. First one side note that Accardo had a private funeral. The only known Outfit member that came to pay last respects where Rocco DeGrazio and Black Joe Amato.

There's one nice but quite short shot of old man Amato while entering the chapel, on Goudie's report regarding Spilotro and others. Btw Rocco DeGrazio was an ex-cop or was related to some cop I really don't remember, and used to travel with Accardo to Italy, but don't get confused with Rocco DeGrazia, since that was a completely different individual, old time boss of MP and some western suburbs and died years before Accardo

Amato at 11:16

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_uFo6Yq-8dA

[SolarSolano]

Black Joe was essentially 'shelved' by Ferriola who put his own guys in charge of Lake and McHenry Counties. Wasn't Solly D one of Black Joe's guys early on? Wonder what made him flip to join Ferriola's crew.

[Confederate]

Ferriola didn't have the power to shelve Amato in 1977. I believe Amato was semi-retiring anyway. That story is connected to the "Last Supper Picture".

[Snakes]

Solly D started out under Amato

[Frank]

The Amato - Solly D ordeal happened when Aiuppa was boss.

[Frank]

Ferriola didn't have the power to shelve Amato in 1977. I believe Amato was semi-retiring anyway. That story is connected to the "Last Supper Picture".

I think the last supper was about DiBella. The Amato thing was in the 80s

[Confederate]

Ferriola didn't have the power to shelve Amato in 1977. I believe Amato was semi-retiring anyway. That story is connected to the "Last Supper Picture".

I think the last supper was about DiBella. The Amato thing was in the 80s

It wasn't only about DiBella. If you read about it, it was also about Amato semi-retiring.

[Frank]

Ferriola didn't have the power to shelve Amato in 1977. I believe Amato was semi-retiring anyway. That story is connected to the "Last Supper Picture".

I think the last supper was about DiBella. The Amato thing was in the 80s

It wasn't only about DiBella. If you read about it, it was also about Amato semi-retiring.

I believe that is probably why Aiuppa ruled against Amato if it had been going on that long. In other words Aiuppa told him to shit or get off the pot.