DiFronzo was lucky. Or...? (+ other Outfit sh*t)

[Pete]

As I’ve said before Louie Marino was also said to be at the spilotro hit and the one who actually helped kill michael and he was never charged and let out of prison so I think the non indictment over the spilotro thing for difronzo Says nothing about him being a informant

[Confederate]

It ain't rocket prupulsion scifi. Was he or wasn't he a dry snitch?

Guy was involved in the spilotro work and shit load of other stuff the big BOSS (Joey clown) got sent up the river for. How the hell does he avoid getting charged by the J.E. Hoovers? Schweitz or whatever gets caught up but not NO-NOSE?

What's the opinion round these parts?

Also do the J. E. Hoovers have difronze on camera meeting with bosses from another city before he passed?

Finally is the chicago mafia really deep sixed when the family secret bosses are still breathing? Can't mikey m. joey clown and the rest run it from the clink the way amuso, manna and the mancusos do?

JIGGS

I believe he was a "Dry Snitch" and I also think his brother is right now. Those two backed away from the Outfit like someone backing away from a pile of shit on the sidewalk. When Marcello got out of Jail in the early 2000's, they couldn't wait to have him take over with his power base from Cicero. After that, whenever the DiFronzo's had a meeting, it was always with the two of them and a few of the other Elmwood Park people in a public place.
There was no evidence that they ever met with the Cicero people again. There was no effort to make any recruitment by the DiFronzo brothers to further the Outfit. It seemed like they simply left the Outfit to die a slow death. Lombardo had also backed away. He was "unlucky" because his conviction was for a murder from 1974.
I could be wrong but since you asked for an "opinion", that is how it seemed at least to me. The reason it seemed that way is not simply because he was never charged in the Family Secrets Trial, it's actually more because he never interacted with anyone else after Marcello took over except for a very few Elmwood Park people and there was no effort to recruit anybody on their part. Accardo used to still interact with different guys from all territories in the Outfit on occasion and recruitment still would occasionally happen.
If there was any recruitment by Cicero, and I say "if", the DiFronzo brothers would not have had any part of it IMO.

[eboli]

I believe he was a "Dry Snitch" and I also think his brother is right now. Those two backed away from the Outfit like someone backing away from a pile of shit on the sidewalk. When Marcello got out of Jail in the early 2000's, they couldn't wait to have him take over with his power base from Cicero. After that, whenever the DiFronzo's had a meeting, it was always with the two of them and a few of the other Elmwood Park people in a public place.
There was no evidence that they ever met with the Cicero people again. There was no effort to make any recruitment by the DiFronzo brothers to further the Outfit. It seemed like they simply left the Outfit to die a slow death. Lombardo had also backed away. He was "unlucky" because his conviction was for a murder from 1974.
I could be wrong but since you asked for an "opinion", that is how it seemed at least to me. The reason it seemed that way is not simply because he was never charged in the Family Secrets Trial, it's actually more because he never interacted with anyone else after Marcello took over except for a very few Elmwood Park people and there was no effort to recruit anybody on their part. Accardo used to still interact with different guys from all territories in the Outfit on occasion and recruitment still would occasionally happen.
If there was any recruitment by Cicero, and I say "if", the DiFronzo brothers would not have had any part of it IMO.

Confederate, if DiFronzo was intentionally tanking The Outfit what about some of the other high ranking members? I assume somebody would've made an issue out of it, if No Nose alone was steering the ship to the bottom. I've read Sarno made an attempt to revitalize the organization. Were there others?

[Villain]

In one of the indictments from the past ten years, it may have been one of the cases related to Mickey Davis, Chuckie Russell, or Paul Carparelli, one of them was recorded as saying that Pete DiFronzo was the street boss for the whole Outfit. In the indictment for one of those cases it listed three confidential informants, and one was apparently a made guy going back to the 1980s. If John DiFronzo was a dry snitch, it probably wasn't until after the Rincon Indian casino case in the early 1990s that sent DiFronzo to prison. Hopefully one of the other posters remembers which case it was.

Hey buddy, is this in a book not written by bill reemer? Or is this straight outta the files of the J.E. Hoovers? What I'm saying is where can I see more about this indian casino case and 1970s-1980s capone gang related shit?

JIGGS

The Rincon or Indian case is for real. I don't believe the CI was Fred Roti and Gus Alex wasn't a made member, so that eliminates him.

Alex was betrayed by Patrick and speaking about him, Patrick also gave the feds some info that both DiFronzo (underboss) and Carlisi (boss) allegedly pushed him out of the loan shark business. During the trial, the defence said that it was DiFronzo and Carlisi who requested percentage from Patrick, not Alex, but still Patrick confirmed that Alex also took his cut. So Patrick's statement was used in both Carlisis and DiFronzos trials, but in the end Patrick was caught lying regarding some of the murders which he committed, and so his statement in DiFronzos trial was dismissed while on the other hand, the prosecutors in Carlisis trial used it as evidence....so the situation is really complicated lol

[Confederate]

I believe he was a "Dry Snitch" and I also think his brother is right now. Those two backed away from the Outfit like someone backing away from a pile of shit on the sidewalk. When Marcello got out of Jail in the early 2000's, they couldn't wait to have him take over with his power base from Cicero. After that, whenever the DiFronzo's had a meeting, it was always with the two of them and a few of the other Elmwood Park people in a public place.
There was no evidence that they ever met with the Cicero people again. There was no effort to make any recruitment by the DiFronzo brothers to further the Outfit. It seemed like they simply left the Outfit to die a slow death. Lombardo had also backed away. He was "unlucky" because his conviction was for a murder from 1974.
I could be wrong but since you asked for an "opinion", that is how it seemed at least to me. The reason it seemed that way is not simply because he was never charged in the Family Secrets Trial, it's actually more because he never interacted with anyone else after Marcello took over except for a very few Elmwood Park people and there was no effort to recruit anybody on their part. Accardo used to still interact with different guys from all territories in the Outfit on occasion and recruitment still would occasionally happen.
If there was any recruitment by Cicero, and I say "if", the DiFronzo brothers would not have had any part of it IMO.

Confederate, if DiFronzo was intentionally tanking The Outfit what about some of the other high ranking members? I assume somebody would've made an issue out of it, if No Nose alone was steering the ship to the bottom. I've read Sarno made an attempt to revitalize the organization. Were there others?

It seems like what ever was left of Cicero, 26th St. & Grand Avenue was what tried to continue. It looked like DiFronzo and some of the Elmwood Park Guys along with Lombardo just backed away. It was like they left it to Marcello and said it's all yours, but then he went to Jail. Sarno then tried and he went to Jail. Whatever is left of active made guys from Cicero, 26th St. & Grand Avenue are the ones still hanging on for as long as they can survive.
We don't even know if Sarno made any new guys before he went away. The Feds have never confirmed anything.

[Frank]

The making date of guys like Vena, Sarno, Cautadela, and others isn't documented

[Pogo The Clown]

I don't know about Vena but Sarno and Cautadela had to be pre-2005.


Pogo

[Frank]

As I’ve said before Louie Marino was also said to be at the spilotro hit and the one who actually helped kill michael and he was never charged and let out of prison so I think the non indictment over the spilotro thing for difronzo Says nothing about him being a informant

I definitely agree.

[FriendofFamily]

Joey the Clown was never the Boss of the Outfit.

[Confederate]

Joey the Clown was never the Boss of the Outfit.

Agreed. He was one of the upper echelon guys but was never the "Top Boss" or even the "Day To Day" Boss over everyone. He was the Boss of the Grand Avenue Division of the Outfit. Later, I would say he was some type of high level "Advisor" because he was closely tied to DiFronzo & Elmwood Park.
Accardo, Cerone, Gagliano, DiFronzo brothers, Lombardo, Spilotro were all from that Grand Avenue area in Chicago. That CCC report from 1997 listed him as a one of two "Advisors" along side DiFronzo. The other "Advisor" was Angelo LaPietra. It seemed as though semi-retired "Division" Bosses who got out of Jail and had to lay low would become Advisors to someone else who took over their spot as a big territory Boss.

[Villain]

From the 1940s and onward, the Outfit always had one or two top spots reserved for the so-called semi-retired high echelon fellas, who took a step back out of various reasons and continued to have some type of advisory role and their word was highly respected. This statement is also backed with several files from confidential informants

[Frank]

I believe he was a "Dry Snitch" and I also think his brother is right now. Those two backed away from the Outfit like someone backing away from a pile of shit on the sidewalk. When Marcello got out of Jail in the early 2000's, they couldn't wait to have him take over with his power base from Cicero. After that, whenever the DiFronzo's had a meeting, it was always with the two of them and a few of the other Elmwood Park people in a public place.
There was no evidence that they ever met with the Cicero people again. There was no effort to make any recruitment by the DiFronzo brothers to further the Outfit. It seemed like they simply left the Outfit to die a slow death. Lombardo had also backed away. He was "unlucky" because his conviction was for a murder from 1974.
I could be wrong but since you asked for an "opinion", that is how it seemed at least to me. The reason it seemed that way is not simply because he was never charged in the Family Secrets Trial, it's actually more because he never interacted with anyone else after Marcello took over except for a very few Elmwood Park people and there was no effort to recruit anybody on their part. Accardo used to still interact with different guys from all territories in the Outfit on occasion and recruitment still would occasionally happen.
If there was any recruitment by Cicero, and I say "if", the DiFronzo brothers would not have had any part of it IMO.

Confederate, if DiFronzo was intentionally tanking The Outfit what about some of the other high ranking members? I assume somebody would've made an issue out of it, if No Nose alone was steering the ship to the bottom. I've read Sarno made an attempt to revitalize the organization. Were there others?

It seems like what ever was left of Cicero, 26th St. & Grand Avenue was what tried to continue. It looked like DiFronzo and some of the Elmwood Park Guys along with Lombardo just backed away. It was like they left it to Marcello and said it's all yours, but then he went to Jail. Sarno then tried and he went to Jail. Whatever is left of active made guys from Cicero, 26th St. & Grand Avenue are the ones still hanging on for as long as they can survive.
We don't even know if Sarno made any new guys before he went away. The Feds have never confirmed anything.

With the made member CI time period running concurrent with all those indictments duringthe 80s and 90s it looks like someone could have been pointing LE in the right direction. This had to be noticed by some Outfit leaders. With DiFronzo being as you describe standoffish towards some other crews, might be an indicator that he suspected a CI had to be in one of those crews

[Villain]

DiFronzo survived the 60s (the feds literally destroyed them), the 70s (over 100 Outfit related murders), and the 80s (the last real top admin went away) and on top of that, later his brother was involved in narcotics. So the 2000s were just a joke for him and Pete said it the best

[JIGGS]

With the made member CI time period running concurrent with all those indictments duringthe 80s and 90s it looks like someone could have been pointing LE in the right direction. This had to be noticed by some Outfit leaders. With DiFronzo being as you describe standoffish towards some other crews, might be an indicator that he suspected a CI had to be in one of those crews

Who were the guys mobwatchers suspect the most that could have been providing info? Had to be a captain, right?

JIGGS

[Frank]

With the made member CI time period running concurrent with all those indictments duringthe 80s and 90s it looks like someone could have been pointing LE in the right direction. This had to be noticed by some Outfit leaders. With DiFronzo being as you describe standoffish towards some other crews, might be an indicator that he suspected a CI had to be in one of those crews

Who were the guys mobwatchers suspect the most that could have been providing info? Had to be a captain, right?

JIGGS

The news of the informants came out in around the last 10 years. The first one has been informing since the middle 80s and is made. So it looks like it would have been someone made before 1985 or so. Do not know if person is dead.But was alive around 10 years ago. The only name I've heard as a guess is John DiFronzo. That is almost entirely from the non indictment in Family Secrets and no Family Secrets 2.