Buffalo/Ontario Mob Acitivity

[SILENT PARTNERZ]

Wiseguy, you would've been a great lawyer man. You can argue the shit out of a point. Lol

+1. You organize your thoughts very coherently


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[Doug]

Wiseguy, you would've been a great lawyer man. You can argue the shit out of a point. Lol

Except his logic and arguments are flawed. Using the examples of New Orleans and Detroit, then applying it to Buffalo isn't valid. Those cases didn't involve each family inducting new members or promoting members to the administration. The only similarity all three had/have is that there were arrests made, in families the FBI believed to be fading. And at least one of those families is all but done (New Orleans). You can't just assume that if it happened to New Orleans, it would therefore happen to Buffalo. If you have a defunct business, would you add staff and managers to one of your branches? What would be the point, unless your business is viable?

[scagghiuni]

A good example of looking at one piece of info in isolation while ignoring other things. In this case, the fact that the family was at 23 members in 2006. Several members have died since then. Whoever has been recently made on the Canadian side of the border, they are still a minority in the family. And its rather unlikely that enough guys have been made to not only make up for the deceased, but bring it all the way back to over 30.

if a mafia member recorded by police said he was made underboss and the buffalo family has 30 members i believe it, period
it's a viable small family with boss, underboss and captains, rocco lupino was identified as a captain...
it seems they were recruiting several people in the latest years so it is not so unbeveliable they have 30 members, also because violi said it

[Pogo The Clown]

Except his logic and arguments are flawed. Using the examples of New Orleans and Detroit, then applying it to Buffalo isn't valid. Those cases didn't involve each family inducting new members or promoting members to the administration. The only similarity all three had/have is that there were arrests made, in families the FBI believed to be fading. And at least one of those families is all but done (New Orleans). You can't just assume that if it happened to New Orleans, it would therefore happen to Buffalo. If you have a defunct business, would you add staff and managers to one of your branches? What would be the point, unless your business is viable?

Actually New Orleans promoted a Boss and UnderBoss and inducted a member shortly before that bust. It is also not unheard to see an induction in an area with a defunct family. Case in point Rochester and Cleveland in 2000. It is also not so unusual to see a promotion either. From my previous post.


-John Tronolone was named Boss of Cleveland in the 80s despite their being only about a dozen members remaining with half of them in prison and only like 2 (including Tronolone) engaged in criminal activity.

-Tommy Marotta was named Boss of Rochester despite there being only about 20 members remaining with about half of them in prison and less than a handful of the remaining engaged in crime.

-Paul Villano was named Boss of Denver/Pueblo in the 90s when there were only about a handful of members left with no real criminal activity to speak of.

-Billy D'Elia was named Boss of Scranton in the early 90s despite there being about a dozen members remaining with almost all of them being old, inactive or in prison.

-Anthony Carolla and Frank Gagliano were namded Boss and UnderBoss of New Orleans in 1990ish despite there being only about a dozen-dozen and half members remaining with only like 5 of them (including Carolla and Gagliano) being active.


You have to look beyond the rank and see what it really means. Buffalo has not been considered viable by the Feds for almost 20 years. In 2017 they all but said Todaro Jr is retired and the fact that only 1 made member has been indicted in 17 years shows just how little criminal activity there actually is.


Pogo

[Doug]

Except his logic and arguments are flawed. Using the examples of New Orleans and Detroit, then applying it to Buffalo isn't valid. Those cases didn't involve each family inducting new members or promoting members to the administration. The only similarity all three had/have is that there were arrests made, in families the FBI believed to be fading. And at least one of those families is all but done (New Orleans). You can't just assume that if it happened to New Orleans, it would therefore happen to Buffalo. If you have a defunct business, would you add staff and managers to one of your branches? What would be the point, unless your business is viable?

Actually New Orleans promoted a Boss and UnderBoss and inducted a member shortly before that bust. It is also not unheard to see an induction in an area with a defunct family. Case in point Rochester and Cleveland in 2000. It is also not so unusual to see a promotion either. From my previous post.


-John Tronolone was named Boss of Cleveland in the 80s despite their being only about a dozen members remaining with half of them in prison and only like 2 (including Tronolone) engaged in criminal activity.

-Tommy Marotta was named Boss of Rochester despite there being only about 20 members remaining with about half of them in prison and less than a handful of the remaining engaged in crime.

-Paul Villano was named Boss of Denver/Pueblo in the 90s when there were only about a handful of members left with no real criminal activity to speak of.

-Billy D'Elia was named Boss of Scranton in the early 90s despite there being about a dozen members remaining with almost all of them being old, inactive or in prison.

-Anthony Carolla and Frank Gagliano were namded Boss and UnderBoss of New Orleans in 1990ish despite there being only about a dozen-dozen and half members remaining with only like 5 of them (including Carolla and Gagliano) being active.


You have to look beyond the rank and see what it really means. Buffalo has not been considered viable by the Feds for almost 20 years. In 2017 they all but said Todaro Jr is retired and the fact that only 1 made member has been indicted in 17 years shows just how little criminal activity there actually is.


Pogo

If the family is defunct (they could easily be, I am just basing this one what we know), why would someone even consider choosing to be inducted by Buffalo, vs. the Bonanno's?

And the examples you used were inductions/promotions into families that eventually stopped being "viable". Were all of them not considered viable at the time?

[scagghiuni]

about new orleans... in the 1990s gagliano was once overheard on fbi surveillance saying to a member of the philadelphia crime family who was seeking permission to operate in new orleans 'the marcello's are finished here', referring to carlo marcello, boss of new orleans family
the bust involved new orleans and new york families in 1994 is different, the family was gone, carolla and gagliano were boss and underboos in name only

[Wiseguy]

Wiseguy, you would've been a great lawyer man. You can argue the shit out of a point. Lol

See my past posts on what I think of lawyers. At least on the defense side.

Wiseguy, you would've been a great lawyer man. You can argue the shit out of a point. Lol

Except his logic and arguments are flawed. Using the examples of New Orleans and Detroit, then applying it to Buffalo isn't valid. Those cases didn't involve each family inducting new members or promoting members to the administration. The only similarity all three had/have is that there were arrests made, in families the FBI believed to be fading. And at least one of those families is all but done (New Orleans). You can't just assume that if it happened to New Orleans, it would therefore happen to Buffalo. If you have a defunct business, would you add staff and managers to one of your branches? What would be the point, unless your business is viable?

Obviously Pogo has given examples where guys were still being promoted in families that were basically finished.

The nominal boss of the family splits his time between making pizza and staying in Florida. The majority of the family, which is in Buffalo, is basically defunct. Some are involved in legit businesses but their OC activities are largely non-existent according to the FBI. This sounds a lot like Detroit.

Meanwhile, we have whatever is left of the Hamilton faction who's had some recent blips on the EKG after years of flatline. The Luppinos and Violis can make all the underbosses and captains they want. It doesn't change the overall state of things.

if a mafia member recorded by police said he was made underboss and the buffalo family has 30 members i believe it, period
it's a viable small family with boss, underboss and captains, rocco lupino was identified as a captain...
it seems they were recruiting several people in the latest years so it is not so unbeveliable they have 30 members, also because violi said it

Yes, I know. You look at Violi's comment alone and ignore everything else. I get it.

And the examples you used were inductions/promotions into families that eventually stopped being "viable". Were all of them not considered viable at the time?

In 1992 the FBI said it was "close to crossing off" each one of those families but, for all practical purposes, those families were already finished.

[cavita]

Fucking A...can we just take a poll on whether we think the Buffalo family is active or not? Everyone will then agree the losing side won't post anymore on the topic. I'm sure everyone is tired like I am of quote after quote and words like "fully functioning" and "viable" and everyone trying to get the last word in. I'm mentally fucking tired of reading what should be a great topic by wading through the bullshit.
My two cents worth.

[Fughedaboutit]

Fucking A...can we just take a poll on whether we think the Buffalo family is active or not? Everyone will then agree the losing side won't post anymore on the topic. I'm sure everyone is tired like I am of quote after quote and words like "fully functioning" and "viable" and everyone trying to get the last word in. I'm mentally fucking tired of reading what should be a great topic by wading through the bullshit.
My two cents worth.

lol never gonna happen. The "usual suspects" have been at this for damn near 20 years when it comes to squashing anyone outside the main 5.

[FriendofHenry]

Fucking A...can we just take a poll on whether we think the Buffalo family is active or not? Everyone will then agree the losing side won't post anymore on the topic. I'm sure everyone is tired like I am of quote after quote and words like "fully functioning" and "viable" and everyone trying to get the last word in. I'm mentally fucking tired of reading what should be a great topic by wading through the bullshit.
My two cents worth.

+1

[SILENT PARTNERZ]

Fucking A...can we just take a poll on whether we think the Buffalo family is active or not? Everyone will then agree the losing side won't post anymore on the topic. I'm sure everyone is tired like I am of quote after quote and words like "fully functioning" and "viable" and everyone trying to get the last word in. I'm mentally fucking tired of reading what should be a great topic by wading through the bullshit.
My two cents worth.

+1

+1000


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[Moscone65]

+1

[Confederate]

Debating this "Buffalo" subject after 84 pages has basically turned into the same thing as debating "Religion". lol

[B.]

Debating this "Buffalo" subject after 84 pages has basically turned into the same thing as debating "Religion". lol

Don't forget the thread where a discussion on the necessity of defense lawyers in a free society turned into an argument about getting into heaven. Might as well tie it into this thread, too, with this simple question:

If the Buffalo mafia is dead, does that mean there is a Buffalo mafia family in heaven?

[NickleCity]

Debating this "Buffalo" subject after 84 pages has basically turned into the same thing as debating "Religion". lol

Don't forget the thread where a discussion on the necessity of defense lawyers in a free society turned into an argument about getting into heaven. Might as well tie it into this thread, too, with this simple question:

If the Buffalo mafia is dead, does that mean there is a Buffalo mafia family in heaven?

This gave me a big belly laugh!!