Buffalo/Ontario Mob Acitivity

[Pogo The Clown]

Never personal with me either.


Pogo

[NickleCity]

On May 21, 2019, the Robert H. Jackson Center presented a Continuing Legal Education program entitled "The Fall of the Buffalo Mafia." The panel included Hon. Salvatore Martoche, Lee Coppola and Tony Bruce. It also included discussion of the real life story portrayed in the movie "Hide in Plain Sight", the Witness Protection programs and prosecuting under RICO statutes. For further information, see www.roberthjackson.org.

There is some very good intel in this 2 hour 25 minute video/panel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvOtVM3Zais

Thanks for posting. I had wanted to go to this but couldn’t get away at that time. I did have to chuckle about Coppola’s comment about he only received calls from law enforcement questioning how could say the mob in Buffalo was dead and then the call/comment from 210/Todaro lawyer’s Harold Boreanaz saying “if you get paid to count trees (i.e law enforcement/FBI looking for mobsters) do you think you would say there weren’t any trees?”

It does make sense what Manning was saying about FBI resources. If they were cut after 9/11/01 it would look legit to say LCN in Buffalo was dying and no longer a threat, so use resources elsewhere. They would have media backing it up with the ‘98 article—even though they questioned Coppola and the article at the time.

[SonnyBlackstein]

... and Porky was trout fishing

. Enjoyed.

The frustration your feeling is inconsistency. We have evidence, Law Enforcement, a trial, key, taped verbatim and the ‘opposing side’ does not even cede an inch in ground in recognition of the possibility that any of the above holds weight.

The frustration emanates that these exact criteria are what the aforementioned usually trumpet as the gold standards in credibility.

We now understand that it’s not ‘Law Enforcement’ which has credibility, only one very specific agency in that umbrella.

I don't have any frustration, I'm not going to lose any sleep over this. I like and respect Pogo/Wiseguy's opposing view and can appreciate its presence here. I know they're coming from a good place with honest intentions and hopefully they can say the same about me. It's never personal.

1. One can get frustrated in a dialogue, without losing sleep.
2. I like and respect Pogo and Wiseguy.
3. We’ve all conducted this discussion in a professional fashion.

So, agreement aside, back to my point. The frustration or point of contention I was inferring was a disparity in approach. One side seems open to data, the other, does not.

For myself, that makes discussion, frustrating.

[Lupara]

No, Buffalo isn't Philadephia. And, while a lot of things are "possible," it's about what's probable. How likely is it?

A steady, uninterrupted decline in membership for years and then, in 2014 or whenever, the family decides to ramp things up again and starts making guys in droves? Where did all these new recruits come from? More to the point, when has something like this ever happened before? There is no precedent.

i doubt the mafia has recruitment problems in canada, they seem to have tons of associates, several young, over there both in montreal and ontario, it's not so impossibile the made several people, 10, 15 or even 20, from 2015 to present

You keep repeating that but it is not accurate. The majority of the membership is on the US side of the border. Even that sensationalist article about the resurgence you guys keep going by plainly said the majority of the Buffalo membership is in the US. So the majority of these 20 new members that have flown under everyone's noses that you guys talk about would be operating in the US.

Do you have the link for that? Thank you.

Correction. It was from a different article. Translated from this French article.


https://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle/11 ... ppe-drogue

As number two in the organization, some 30 Mafiosi are now under his command, mainly in the United States, but also in Hamilton, says Domenico Violi.

First you refute that particular statement and now you're using it to support your case that the majority of the members are in the US (Violi's words). So either you take his statements into consideration or you don't. You can't just nitpick certain parts that suit your case and refute the rest. You can't have it both ways.

[Pogo The Clown]

Statement or no statement the majority of the family's membership has always been on the US side with Canada always being a small outpost. You don't need his statement to know that but it just further confirms it.


Pogo

[Fughedaboutit]

It is possible and there are the tapes of a member saying so, but these guys just keep saying shit like "it isn't possible that this happened, are you out of your mind" over and over based solely off their feelings on the subject.

Rich coming from the same guy who just a few weeks ago was so convinced that Ron Previte was not a made member based solely on your feelings on the subject.


Pogo

I am glad you track my thoughts from weeks ago. I will take that rent payment now. Thanks so much.

[Pogo The Clown]

Please go away. It is clear you have nothing to add to this discussion beyond stirring up trouble. Take it the graveyard if you have a problem.


Pogo

[Fughedaboutit]

No, I can speak if I want. I did not even address you directly, yet you commented and called me out my post directly. YOU take it to the graveyard.

[Lupara]

Statement or no statement the majority of the family's membership has always been on the US side with Canada always being a small outpost. You don't need his statement to know that but it just further confirms it.

Pogo

So you do take his statements into consideration and use it for further confirmation. That is good to know.

[Fughedaboutit]

Statement or no statement the majority of the family's membership has always been on the US side with Canada always being a small outpost. You don't need his statement to know that but it just further confirms it.

Pogo

So you do take his statements into consideration and use it for further confirmation. That is good to know.

Good catch

[B.]

The first references I've seen to the Bonanno Ontario presence is the early-mid 1960s. Paolo Violi was in Ontario before Montreal but not sure if he was inducted into the Bonannos before or after he moved.

I'm wondering if about the Scibettas of early Hamilton and how early they were connected to Buffalo as well.

ALSO: created a 97 Buffalo chart, courtesy of mobinfiltrator, stroccos and eboli.
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=5001

Another interesting aspect to Buffalo's Canadian faction is that the Agueci brothers of Toronto were from Castellammare Del Golfo (EDIT: NFR was incorrect, should be Salemi) according to the Niagara Falls Reporter. Agueci looks to be a name primarily associated with Trapani province. The investigation into the Agueci brothers' drug operations revealed that they had allegedly received heroin via contacts in Castellammare. Would be curious who in particular they were close to over there.

One of the Aguecis used Ignazio Bordonaro, Buffalo member in Ontario and practicing lawyer, for legal consultation. With Buffalo inducting a lawyer in Canada, then Rochester apparently having a college professor who was a member (and whose membership could date back to the Buffalo family), some of the many holes in the FBI's historic membership lists could be filled with ostensibly legitimate members. John Montana is another example, though his position eventually put him in the spotlight.

In 1967 close to 40 men were arrested in the basement of Panaro's bar. These men were believed to be celebrating the elder Joe Todaro's recent induction into the Buffalo family. Of the men arrested, many are confirmed members from that period or they show up as confirmed members later, but some of the names to my knowledge haven't been identified as members, though a few of them are relatives of future members. If the celebration was for Todaro's induction, it would seem to have been for the Buffalo / NF members.

That's a great chart.

[Angelo Santino]

The first references I've seen to the Bonanno Ontario presence is the early-mid 1960s. Paolo Violi was in Ontario before Montreal but not sure if he was inducted into the Bonannos before or after he moved.

I'm wondering if about the Scibettas of early Hamilton and how early they were connected to Buffalo as well.

ALSO: created a 97 Buffalo chart, courtesy of mobinfiltrator, stroccos and eboli.
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=5001

Another interesting aspect to Buffalo's Canadian faction is that the Agueci brothers of Toronto were from Castellammare Del Golfo according to the Niagara Falls Reporter. Agueci looks to be a name primarily associated with Trapani province. The investigation into the Agueci brothers' drug operations revealed that they had allegedly received heroin via contacts in Castellammare. Would be curious who in particular they were close to over there.

One of the Aguecis used Ignazio Bordonaro, Buffalo member in Ontario and practicing lawyer, for legal consultation. With Buffalo inducting a lawyer in Canada, then Rochester apparently having a college professor who was a member (and whose membership could date back to the Buffalo family), some of the many holes in the FBI's historic membership lists could be filled with ostensibly legitimate members. John Montana is another example, though his position eventually put him in the spotlight.

In 1967 close to 40 men were arrested in the basement of Panaro's bar. These men were believed to be celebrating the elder Joe Todaro's recent induction into the Buffalo family. Of the men arrested, many are confirmed members from that period or they show up as confirmed members later, but some of the names to my knowledge haven't been identified as members, though a few of them are relatives of future members. If the celebration was for Todaro's induction, it would seem to have been for the Buffalo / NF members.

That's a great chart.

Was there ever a list of all those arrested?

[B.]

The first references I've seen to the Bonanno Ontario presence is the early-mid 1960s. Paolo Violi was in Ontario before Montreal but not sure if he was inducted into the Bonannos before or after he moved.

I'm wondering if about the Scibettas of early Hamilton and how early they were connected to Buffalo as well.

ALSO: created a 97 Buffalo chart, courtesy of mobinfiltrator, stroccos and eboli.
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=5001

Another interesting aspect to Buffalo's Canadian faction is that the Agueci brothers of Toronto were from Castellammare Del Golfo according to the Niagara Falls Reporter. Agueci looks to be a name primarily associated with Trapani province. The investigation into the Agueci brothers' drug operations revealed that they had allegedly received heroin via contacts in Castellammare. Would be curious who in particular they were close to over there.

One of the Aguecis used Ignazio Bordonaro, Buffalo member in Ontario and practicing lawyer, for legal consultation. With Buffalo inducting a lawyer in Canada, then Rochester apparently having a college professor who was a member (and whose membership could date back to the Buffalo family), some of the many holes in the FBI's historic membership lists could be filled with ostensibly legitimate members. John Montana is another example, though his position eventually put him in the spotlight.

In 1967 close to 40 men were arrested in the basement of Panaro's bar. These men were believed to be celebrating the elder Joe Todaro's recent induction into the Buffalo family. Of the men arrested, many are confirmed members from that period or they show up as confirmed members later, but some of the names to my knowledge haven't been identified as members, though a few of them are relatives of future members. If the celebration was for Todaro's induction, it would seem to have been for the Buffalo / NF members.

That's a great chart.

Was there ever a list of all those arrested?

It begins on this page: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.htm ... 1&tab=page

[Angelo Santino]

The first references I've seen to the Bonanno Ontario presence is the early-mid 1960s. Paolo Violi was in Ontario before Montreal but not sure if he was inducted into the Bonannos before or after he moved.

I'm wondering if about the Scibettas of early Hamilton and how early they were connected to Buffalo as well.

ALSO: created a 97 Buffalo chart, courtesy of mobinfiltrator, stroccos and eboli.
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=5001

Another interesting aspect to Buffalo's Canadian faction is that the Agueci brothers of Toronto were from Castellammare Del Golfo according to the Niagara Falls Reporter. Agueci looks to be a name primarily associated with Trapani province. The investigation into the Agueci brothers' drug operations revealed that they had allegedly received heroin via contacts in Castellammare. Would be curious who in particular they were close to over there.

One of the Aguecis used Ignazio Bordonaro, Buffalo member in Ontario and practicing lawyer, for legal consultation. With Buffalo inducting a lawyer in Canada, then Rochester apparently having a college professor who was a member (and whose membership could date back to the Buffalo family), some of the many holes in the FBI's historic membership lists could be filled with ostensibly legitimate members. John Montana is another example, though his position eventually put him in the spotlight.

In 1967 close to 40 men were arrested in the basement of Panaro's bar. These men were believed to be celebrating the elder Joe Todaro's recent induction into the Buffalo family. Of the men arrested, many are confirmed members from that period or they show up as confirmed members later, but some of the names to my knowledge haven't been identified as members, though a few of them are relatives of future members. If the celebration was for Todaro's induction, it would seem to have been for the Buffalo / NF members.

That's a great chart.

Was there ever a list of all those arrested?

It begins on this page: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.htm ... 1&tab=page

Has anyone ever mapped these guys out or dug into their origins? This might warrant its own thread.

[Pogo The Clown]

On May 21, 2019, the Robert H. Jackson Center presented a Continuing Legal Education program entitled "The Fall of the Buffalo Mafia." The panel included Hon. Salvatore Martoche, Lee Coppola and Tony Bruce. It also included discussion of the real life story portrayed in the movie "Hide in Plain Sight", the Witness Protection programs and prosecuting under RICO statutes. For further information, see www.roberthjackson.org.

There is some very good intel in this 2 hour 25 minute video/panel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvOtVM3Zais

So as late as 2019 we have long time Buffalo investigators and prosecutors saying it is gone and has been for a long time.

Statement or no statement the majority of the family's membership has always been on the US side with Canada always being a small outpost. You don't need his statement to know that but it just further confirms it.

So you do take his statements into consideration and use it for further confirmation. That is good to know.

I didn't even know he had made the statement when I first posted it. Either way take it or don't either way it is a fact that the majority of the family's membership was on the US side.


Pogo