Buffalo/Ontario Mob Acitivity

[Lupara]

If Canada is answering to Buffalo, I'll go down on Queen Elizabeth and all of her crotch rot

Prepare yourself for that nasty encounter.

Buffalo's real and it's happening. Deal with it.

Yours sincerely,

The voice of reason.

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[JCB1977]

It's not that Violi's comments have no value. But there is reason to be sceptical and not take them at face value. But obviously a lot of you guys have already done that and the theories are flying.

honestly i believe more what a local canadian mobster says in the wiretaps than fbi, also violi was taliking with another made member so i doubt he could lying about this

Do you believe that two mobsters talking are actually honest with each other? Do you think there has ever been a case where two mobsters having a discussion were both lying to one another. Or because they were made members that they were actually honest? Let me ask you this: Did you listen to the full wiretap? Or did you get snippets of a conversation and argue that they mean X when they actually mean Y?

[maxiestern11]

So wait let me get this straight. The violins were caught in wiretaps saying how they answer to buffalo, got made underboss of an American family, and made reference’s to joe todaro. Whether or not todaro is the boss, it’s clear and evident that there is respect from the violi/Luppinos to the buffalo “family” still. Why would violi pull that out of his ass, it makes no sense whatsoever. Some things may have been exaggerated but clearly they are associated with buffalo. If there was nothing going on in buffalo, why would an established organized crime family in the mafia stronghold of southern Ontario be answering to them? Just answer that question.

You make a valid point!

[JCB1977]

If Canada is answering to Buffalo, I'll go down on Queen Elizabeth and all of her crotch rot

Prepare yourself for that nasty encounter.

Buffalo's real and it's happening. Deal with it.

Your's sincerely,

The voice of reason.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn H3113 met Tapatalk

Again, I am not saying it's impossible...rather highly unlikely until proven otherwise. I don't believe Todaro Jr is actively involved in OC as his earnings have never been tied to OC. It needs to be proven, how will you go about doing that?

[scagghiuni]

Do you believe that two mobsters talking are actually honest with each other? Do you think there has ever been a case where two mobsters having a discussion were both lying to one another. Or because they were made members that they were actually honest? Let me ask you this: Did you listen to the full wiretap? Or did you get snippets of a conversation and argue that they mean X when they actually mean Y?

i don't believe he lied about this to a bonanno member, he was strongly linked with the bonanno family, he was present even at a ceremony of induction... anyway i would curious to heard morena declarations, he could know what's happening over there, why fbi never talk about canada?

[Pogo The Clown]

Thank you for making our point. Morena was an FBI member informant for years, since before 2015, and had several dealings with Violi and yet the FBI still missed this supposed Buffalo resurgence when they stated categorically in 2017 that Buffalo was done?


Pogo

[Wiseguy]

So wait let me get this straight. The violins were caught in wiretaps saying how they answer to buffalo, got made underboss of an American family, and made reference’s to joe todaro. Whether or not todaro is the boss, it’s clear and evident that there is respect from the violi/Luppinos to the buffalo “family” still. Why would violi pull that out of his ass, it makes no sense whatsoever. Some things may have been exaggerated but clearly they are associated with buffalo. If there was nothing going on in buffalo, why would an established organized crime family in the mafia stronghold of southern Ontario be answering to them? Just answer that question.

I don't have a problem believing Violi was made underboss. Or that Todaro is the nominal boss and his approval gives Violi more legitimacy in that world. What I have an issue with is taking his "beat out 30 guys for the spot" comment at face value, or taking that, the 2017 drug bust, and a few murders in Hamilton as signs that the Buffalo LCN is experiencing a resurgence on either side of the border. It's a theory that I realize you find exciting but I'd advise not expecting too much from here on out. It's going to be more anti-climatic than the Frank Cali murder.

[scagghiuni]

Thank you for making our point. Morena was an FBI member informant for years, since before 2015, and had several dealings with Violi and yet the FBI still missed this supposed Buffalo resurgence when they stated categorically in 2017 that Buffalo was done.


Pogo

i didn't read his declarations anyway, not about violi/buffalo that i couldn't care less, it would be by far more interesting what's happening in montreal if he knows something, but i never heard fbi talking about it and it's very strange

[Lupara]

If Canada is answering to Buffalo, I'll go down on Queen Elizabeth and all of her crotch rot

Prepare yourself for that nasty encounter.

Buffalo's real and it's happening. Deal with it.

Your's sincerely,

The voice of reason.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn H3113 met Tapatalk

Again, I am not saying it's impossible...rather highly unlikely until proven otherwise. I don't believe Todaro Jr is actively involved in OC as his earnings have never been tied to OC. It needs to be proven, how will you go about doing that?

For what it's worth, I was joking.

Anyway, I don't think there's an obligation for anyone here to prove anything. Everyone has the right to interpret the Violi tapes along with other circumstantial evidence the way they see fit.

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[mobinfiltrator]

So...literally just had a sit down with a guy I know about another matter. This guy is as far from LE as it gets. He tells me Pat is out. He went to meet him just over a week ago, says he's an absolute mess, but most importantly he was by himself. No family members. No bodyguard. All alone which is very telling. I'm surprised he's not flipped.

[Moscone65]

So wait let me get this straight. The violins were caught in wiretaps saying how they answer to buffalo, got made underboss of an American family, and made reference’s to joe todaro. Whether or not todaro is the boss, it’s clear and evident that there is respect from the violi/Luppinos to the buffalo “family” still. Why would violi pull that out of his ass, it makes no sense whatsoever. Some things may have been exaggerated but clearly they are associated with buffalo. If there was nothing going on in buffalo, why would an established organized crime family in the mafia stronghold of southern Ontario be answering to them? Just answer that question.

Could be many reasons. Shifting blame or responsibility to the other side? An axe to grind? As you stated, exaggeration? It's also possible that Canadien Mobsters may have had something going on with remnants of the old Todaro family which is believable. Buffalo may have been traditionally Superior to Southern Ontario but Canada could tell Buffalo to fuck off at this point and what are they going to do?

Let me ask you this: Do you actually believe that Buffalo is growing and in doing so, that they have managed to fly under the radar for so long that not one single informant tipped off LE? In this day in age, it's next to impossible. I am not saying Buffalo is dead...I'm saying that there is no possible way that Todaro Jr has avoided LE detection meeting with Canadian mobsters for the purpose of international rackets.

I never originally thought that buffalo is growing. But the past few years including the 2017 busy just really got me thinking. Sure the violis could have told the buffalo family to fuck off. The violi/Luppinos essentially have their own clan/family which can presumably remain self sufficient. The Canadian groups aren’t large in size anyways, there’s just a lot of groups. So why would violi be interested in becoming the underboss of a dead family of old men, that has little to no interests other than a few local gambling spots in buffalo? Logically, there must be some kind of value and structure left in buffalo. It is very odd that there are no indictments as of recently, but it would be more improbable that after what has been recorded by wiretaps that there is nothing of importance left in buffalo. In order for the don violi to be interested there must have been decent structure and incentive atleast as of the last few years.

[Wiseguy]

I never originally thought that buffalo is growing. But the past few years including the 2017 busy just really got me thinking. Sure the violis could have told the buffalo family to fuck off. The violi/Luppinos essentially have their own clan/family which can presumably remain self sufficient. The Canadian groups aren’t large in size anyways, there’s just a lot of groups. So why would violi be interested in becoming the underboss of a dead family of old men, that has little to no interests other than a few local gambling spots in buffalo? Logically, there must be some kind of value and structure left in buffalo. It is very odd that there are no indictments as of recently, but it would be more improbable that after what has been recorded by wiretaps that there is nothing of importance left in buffalo. In order for the don violi to be interested there must have been decent structure and incentive atleast as of the last few years.

Many posters over the years have gone against the FBI in favor of what they feel is logical or makes more sense to them. We've seen how that ends up. Don't expect this to be any different.

[JCB1977]

So wait let me get this straight. The violins were caught in wiretaps saying how they answer to buffalo, got made underboss of an American family, and made reference’s to joe todaro. Whether or not todaro is the boss, it’s clear and evident that there is respect from the violi/Luppinos to the buffalo “family” still. Why would violi pull that out of his ass, it makes no sense whatsoever. Some things may have been exaggerated but clearly they are associated with buffalo. If there was nothing going on in buffalo, why would an established organized crime family in the mafia stronghold of southern Ontario be answering to them? Just answer that question.

Could be many reasons. Shifting blame or responsibility to the other side? An axe to grind? As you stated, exaggeration? It's also possible that Canadien Mobsters may have had something going on with remnants of the old Todaro family which is believable. Buffalo may have been traditionally Superior to Southern Ontario but Canada could tell Buffalo to fuck off at this point and what are they going to do?

Let me ask you this: Do you actually believe that Buffalo is growing and in doing so, that they have managed to fly under the radar for so long that not one single informant tipped off LE? In this day in age, it's next to impossible. I am not saying Buffalo is dead...I'm saying that there is no possible way that Todaro Jr has avoided LE detection meeting with Canadian mobsters for the purpose of international rackets.

I never originally thought that buffalo is growing. But the past few years including the 2017 busy just really got me thinking. Sure the violis could have told the buffalo family to fuck off. The violi/Luppinos essentially have their own clan/family which can presumably remain self sufficient. The Canadian groups aren’t large in size anyways, there’s just a lot of groups. So why would violi be interested in becoming the underboss of a dead family of old men, that has little to no interests other than a few local gambling spots in buffalo? Logically, there must be some kind of value and structure left in buffalo. It is very odd that there are no indictments as of recently, but it would be more improbable that after what has been recorded by wiretaps that there is nothing of importance left in buffalo. In order for the don violi to be interested there must have been decent structure and incentive atleast as of the last few years.

I can't say that I disagree with your line of thinking. Could of he wanted to get out of Canada? Or maybe run a small crew in the greater Buffalo area? There are many possibilities and I hope the real truth will eventually be unraveled.

[Moscone65]

So wait let me get this straight. The violins were caught in wiretaps saying how they answer to buffalo, got made underboss of an American family, and made reference’s to joe todaro. Whether or not todaro is the boss, it’s clear and evident that there is respect from the violi/Luppinos to the buffalo “family” still. Why would violi pull that out of his ass, it makes no sense whatsoever. Some things may have been exaggerated but clearly they are associated with buffalo. If there was nothing going on in buffalo, why would an established organized crime family in the mafia stronghold of southern Ontario be answering to them? Just answer that question.

I don't have a problem believing Violi was made underboss. Or that Todaro is the nominal boss and his approval gives Violi more legitimacy in that world. What I have an issue with is taking his "beat out 30 guys for the spot" comment at face value, or taking that, the 2017 drug bust, and a few murders in Hamilton as signs that the Buffalo LCN is experiencing a resurgence on either side of the border. It's a theory that I realize you find exciting but I'd advise not expecting too much from here on out. It's going to be more anti-climatic than the Frank Cali murder.

Even if you don’t take the violi comments at value, which can be understandable to an extent, there’s still an issue. From what I understand, you guys are saying that buffalo is little more than a glorified crew, and nothing is happening. Even if there’s 15-20 made members, and presumably double the amount of associates, and there is structure (boss and underboss means there is probably capos) then that’s a viable family. The fact that todaro was reaching out trying to establish a better foundation with the Canadian side, doing promotions ect, shows he’s trying to keep the family afloat, perhaps build, rather than let it die a slow death like other bosses have. You expect all sorts of evidence like in New York where there’s thousands of wiseguys and associates. In philly the only reason why they have a lot of info is because, let’s face it, ever since Bruno was killed philly has mostly been a bunch of cafone’s. More of a street gang than proper mafia. Merlino has an Instagram page with pictures of him with black rappers for frig sakes, their no where near as serious as Chicago or Canadian guys. That combined with corrupt or incompetent agents at the buffalo field office and lack of funding for a huge investigation) could explain why things are quiet.

[JCB1977]

If Canada is answering to Buffalo, I'll go down on Queen Elizabeth and all of her crotch rot

Prepare yourself for that nasty encounter.

Buffalo's real and it's happening. Deal with it.

Your's sincerely,

The voice of reason.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn H3113 met Tapatalk

Again, I am not saying it's impossible...rather highly unlikely until proven otherwise. I don't believe Todaro Jr is actively involved in OC as his earnings have never been tied to OC. It needs to be proven, how will you go about doing that?

For what it's worth, I was joking.

Anyway, I don't think there's an obligation for anyone here to prove anything. Everyone has the right to interpret the Violi tapes along with other circumstantial evidence the way they see fit.

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I agree. But I know that I would love to get to the bottom of this riddle.