by CabriniGreen » Sun Jun 20, 2021 2:58 am
B. wrote: ↑Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:07 pm
Given Corallo's stance on drug trafficking (discussed on Jaguar tapes), can't imagine he would recruit Sicilian members through those relationships alone.
Ok,......Now, heres where its gonna get juicy....
You had Corralo, Castellano and Gigante ALL AGAINST drugs. Yet you have a quorum, the Gambino, Luchesse, and Bonnano families, all with active Sicilian factions, ALL engaged in narcotics.
My theory is they understood that they couldnt stop the sicilians, in fact, were kinda obligated to accommodate them. So they took the next best step they could, and banned THEIR guys from engaging in it. That's the only way the whole thing makes any sense to me.
I dont think Corralo recruited them...... AT ALL. I think this is something they got correct in the Sixth Family book. The sicilians were COMING OVER, they wernt exactly invited or recruited. (Well, the Gambinos are different )They were running from Sicily because it was too hot. They were coming over as early as 64, possibly earlier....
Now, felice posted something in the " Some info on the Gambinos"..... that the sicilians made some sort of compromise with Castellano, and were allowed to increase THEIR drug business. Not that the Americans had some great urge to engage in narcotics, more like, the Sicilians needed access to New York to make the big money. So Castellano accommodated them, most likely because saying no would probably have been politically.........unpredictable. Not saying it would have been a confrontation, but it might have damaged his standing with the Sicilian families.
It's why I previously referenced your post on Castellanos meeting with the Sicilian boss Geraci, on how Castellano told him that guys were coming over and doing whatever, and that they had to be with a family, like represented properly. And I think you posted the Luchesses made 10 right away....... it does all tie in I think....
Not a whole lot of evidence that drug trafficking by itself played a role in Sicilians' formal affiliation with US families, though so little is known about how/why the Luccheses recruited them I wouldn't rule anything out.
Ok.... heres part of the disconnect I think. I dont think the Sicilians got made with ANY family because of THAT families interest in narcotics.
I hope you guys follow me here. The Americans DIDNT CARE about narcotics. They already had everything that was any good. Whereas, the Sicilians were only over here TO MOVE narcotics. And this was only because of the liquidity crises they had in Sicily. If you disagree, the SAME situation occured decades later, when Nicchi meets with Cali to get into drugs, because of a liquidity crises in Sicily. And I dont think Cali gave a fuck about drug trafficking at that point in his career. But he seemed to be in the same situation as Castellano, he couldnt refuse a " friend", for his own political standing.
I think they got made as a political concession by the Americans. I think the Sicilians were granted basically "work visas" to operate in NY, that they paid for with a piece of the action. I dont think, excluding the Inzerillo- Gambino clan, I dont think they really would have cared WHAT family they got made into, as long as they were respected as friends, and could operate with the same respect and freedom afforded to American mafia members.... basically, narcotics made the world smaller, and they wanted have the same freedom of movement between Palermo and NY, as the Americans move borough to borough. And the thing is...if I've read guys like Chris Christie right, that how it originally was, before the sundering took hold between the organizations.
Also, I gotta add.. the Sicilians were doing a LOT of rule adaptations at this time, to accommodate evolution in the criminal landscape. They had a rule about initiating too many relatives in the same family. Then they go and recognize the Caruana- Cuntreras, a family of literal blood relations. And I suspect they ONLY did it because of their importance in narcotics, the same reason they recognized the 3 Naples families during the same time period. Take away Zazas smuggling, the mafia didnt need him.... same with the Caruanas....
Onofrio Milazzo might be the biggest mystery of them all. He was a fairly recent emigrant from Sicily and by the late 1960s represented NJ Lucchese associates in a sitdown with Funzi Tieri and Patty Macchiarole. He was treated like a made member by Tieri, Macchiarole, and John DiGiglio. His cousin was Jimmy Sinatra, but would be strange if Milazzo was allowed to transfer to the Luccheses just because his cousin was an unpopular associate. The roots of the NJ Lucchese crew are heavily from Trapani, like Milazzo, so could have been a factor.
What's important is there seems to be no continuity between a zip like Milazzo and the Palermitani zips who joined the Luccheses in the years after Milazzo returned to Sicily. You do see continuity of some kind or another with the zips in other families.
Question here B.
Do you think, with Milazzo being treated like a made man, that this was an outlier, an exception? Or would this have been the attitude of the average mafia soldier?
Was Milazzo especially respected? Or was this a general courtesy that any Sicilian mafia member could expect if he came to NY? Was he an exception? Or the norm?
This goes to the points I've made above, about what expectations the Sicilians might have had from the Americans as far as respect and membership and equivalence. No one gave Milazzo a 5 year rule before he could be considered a friend, I'm assuming...
[quote=B. post_id=198059 time=1624136839 user_id=127]
Given Corallo's stance on drug trafficking (discussed on Jaguar tapes), can't imagine he would recruit Sicilian members through those relationships alone.
[/quote]
Ok,......Now, heres where its gonna get juicy....
You had Corralo, Castellano and Gigante ALL AGAINST drugs. Yet you have a quorum, the Gambino, Luchesse, and Bonnano families, all with active Sicilian factions, ALL engaged in narcotics.
My theory is they understood that they couldnt stop the sicilians, in fact, were kinda obligated to accommodate them. So they took the next best step they could, and banned THEIR guys from engaging in it. That's the only way the whole thing makes any sense to me.
I dont think Corralo recruited them...... AT ALL. I think this is something they got correct in the Sixth Family book. The sicilians were COMING OVER, they wernt exactly invited or recruited. (Well, the Gambinos are different )They were running from Sicily because it was too hot. They were coming over as early as 64, possibly earlier....
Now, felice posted something in the " Some info on the Gambinos"..... that the sicilians made some sort of compromise with Castellano, and were allowed to increase THEIR drug business. Not that the Americans had some great urge to engage in narcotics, more like, the Sicilians needed access to New York to make the big money. So Castellano accommodated them, most likely because saying no would probably have been politically.........unpredictable. Not saying it would have been a confrontation, but it might have damaged his standing with the Sicilian families.
It's why I previously referenced your post on Castellanos meeting with the Sicilian boss Geraci, on how Castellano told him that guys were coming over and doing whatever, and that they had to be with a family, like represented properly. And I think you posted the Luchesses made 10 right away....... it does all tie in I think....
[quote]Not a whole lot of evidence that drug trafficking by itself played a role in Sicilians' formal affiliation with US families, though so little is known about how/why the Luccheses recruited them I wouldn't rule anything out.[/quote]
Ok.... heres part of the disconnect I think. I dont think the Sicilians got made with ANY family because of THAT families interest in narcotics.
I hope you guys follow me here. The Americans DIDNT CARE about narcotics. They already had everything that was any good. Whereas, the Sicilians were only over here TO MOVE narcotics. And this was only because of the liquidity crises they had in Sicily. If you disagree, the SAME situation occured decades later, when Nicchi meets with Cali to get into drugs, because of a liquidity crises in Sicily. And I dont think Cali gave a fuck about drug trafficking at that point in his career. But he seemed to be in the same situation as Castellano, he couldnt refuse a " friend", for his own political standing.
I think they got made as a political concession by the Americans. I think the Sicilians were granted basically "work visas" to operate in NY, that they paid for with a piece of the action. I dont think, excluding the Inzerillo- Gambino clan, I dont think they really would have cared WHAT family they got made into, as long as they were respected as friends, and could operate with the same respect and freedom afforded to American mafia members.... basically, narcotics made the world smaller, and they wanted have the same freedom of movement between Palermo and NY, as the Americans move borough to borough. And the thing is...if I've read guys like Chris Christie right, that how it originally was, before the sundering took hold between the organizations.
Also, I gotta add.. the Sicilians were doing a LOT of rule adaptations at this time, to accommodate evolution in the criminal landscape. They had a rule about initiating too many relatives in the same family. Then they go and recognize the Caruana- Cuntreras, a family of literal blood relations. And I suspect they ONLY did it because of their importance in narcotics, the same reason they recognized the 3 Naples families during the same time period. Take away Zazas smuggling, the mafia didnt need him.... same with the Caruanas....
[quote]
Onofrio Milazzo might be the biggest mystery of them all. He was a fairly recent emigrant from Sicily and by the late 1960s represented NJ Lucchese associates in a sitdown with Funzi Tieri and Patty Macchiarole. He was treated like a made member by Tieri, Macchiarole, and John DiGiglio. His cousin was Jimmy Sinatra, but would be strange if Milazzo was allowed to transfer to the Luccheses just because his cousin was an unpopular associate. The roots of the NJ Lucchese crew are heavily from Trapani, like Milazzo, so could have been a factor.
What's important is there seems to be no continuity between a zip like Milazzo and the Palermitani zips who joined the Luccheses in the years after Milazzo returned to Sicily. You do see continuity of some kind or another with the zips in other families.
[/quote]
Question here B.
Do you think, with Milazzo being treated like a made man, that this was an outlier, an exception? Or would this have been the attitude of the average mafia soldier?
Was Milazzo especially respected? Or was this a general courtesy that any Sicilian mafia member could expect if he came to NY? Was he an exception? Or the norm?
This goes to the points I've made above, about what expectations the Sicilians might have had from the Americans as far as respect and membership and equivalence. No one gave Milazzo a 5 year rule before he could be considered a friend, I'm assuming...