Castellano's election as boss late 1976

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Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by Ivan » Wed Mar 29, 2023 7:32 am

CornerBoy wrote: Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:49 am is it credible. i assume largely but no way kurins and the big irsh guy actually penetrated the house.

They have special teams at quantico that specialize in this type of thing---breaching houses/buildings in stealthy way etc
Why have those Two do it?

Once the tactical units had the diagrams from julie miron and intell from kurins and okelly or obrien? they had enough info to plant the bug(s)
The way it was really done was revealed in Jules Bonovolonta's book. They messed with Paul's TV to screw up the reception and then sent in a fake repair guy to "fix" the TV (he installed the bug with Bilotti watching him the whole time).

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by CornerBoy » Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:49 am

is it credible. i assume largely but no way kurins and the big irsh guy actually penetrated the house.

They have special teams at quantico that specialize in this type of thing---breaching houses/buildings in stealthy way etc
Why have those Two do it?

Once the tactical units had the diagrams from julie miron and intell from kurins and okelly or obrien? they had enough info to plant the bug(s)

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by OmarSantista » Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:10 pm

CabriniGreen wrote: Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:39 am Terry Zappi is Ettore Zappi? Or no?
Yes, that's him

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by Nasabeak » Sun Jan 08, 2023 12:34 am

don-shunter wrote: Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:06 am I wonder why Neil dellacroce never became boss if you go with what this informant claimed that Castellano and Gallo were prepared to let Neil become boss? Something must have happened between October 76 and November 76 to change castellanos mind and make him want the job and for Neil to let him take it unopposed.
Neil didn’t want it. In the late 60s, he was manuevering to try to unseat Carlo not in favor of himself, but to put Joe N. Gallo on the throne. There is no indication that Neil ever wanted to be Boss. His underlings might’ve wanted that (for obvious reasons), but let’s remember that John Gotti’s partisans are the ones who have largely written the history.

Even if he had wanted it, he was not in a good position to take it in 1976:

He had just spent the last four years in prison,

Charlie Wagons, his top Capo, was having legal problems and was slowing down toward retirement

John Gotti was in jail in 1976

He wasn’t exactly in any position for warfare even if that would’ve been his inclination

Paul Castellano had a massive crew; He had the support of the majority of the Captains; he likely had the support of the other Bosses also; He had spent the last 9 years as Acting Boss and securing a power base; had the support of Joe N. Gallo (and thus his partisans also) to take over as Gallo didn’t want it himself.

So he had the political support, and the firepower.

As early as 1967, an informant confidently stated that Paul would “undoubtedly” be the next Boss, and ruled out Neil as being the Boss. His star had been on the rise since Applachin.

If Neil had contested it to the point of war in 1976, he and his faction would’ve lost.

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by Adam » Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:05 pm

The Vernor fish market murders of Milazzo and Parrino that lead to the Crosstown mob war in Detroit in 1930. That was supposed to be a peace meeting.

Stanfa was going to call in Merlino, Ciancaglini and Lucibello for a peace meeting and have Licata and Sparacio there to make them feel safe and kill all three of them in 1993.

Re: Confirmed made members in Montreal

by Pogo The Clown » Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:34 am

Ivan wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:06 am Capone meeting with Anselmi, Scalise, and Giunta (if the story is true).

"I hear you want my job." - Al Capone before he started swinging the bat.


Pogo

Re: Confirmed made members in Montreal

by Ivan » Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:06 am

Frank Matthew wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:23 pm
Lupara wrote: Sat Feb 02, 2019 9:19 pm Seems like Montiglio dramatized this event by claiming he, Gaggi and perhaps a few others were loaded and anticipating for things to turn ugly. When in the history of the mob did such a high-level meeting actually turn into a cowboy shootout? Only in movies afaik.
The 3 Capo murders in the Bonanno family. Very high level meeting that turned into a blood bath.
Capone meeting with Anselmi, Scalise, and Giunta (if the story is true).

Re: Confirmed made members in Montreal

by Frank Matthew » Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:23 pm

Lupara wrote: Sat Feb 02, 2019 9:19 pm Seems like Montiglio dramatized this event by claiming he, Gaggi and perhaps a few others were loaded and anticipating for things to turn ugly. When in the history of the mob did such a high-level meeting actually turn into a cowboy shootout? Only in movies afaik.
The 3 Capo murders in the Bonanno family. Very high level meeting that turned into a blood bath.

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by Adam » Mon Nov 08, 2021 1:56 pm

Ivan wrote: Mon Nov 08, 2021 11:36 am Question about the O'Brien/Kurins book: Is that thing credible? I enjoyed reading it when I was a teenager a million years ago as I liked the writing style and how it felt like a novel (though the nonstop "they're all inbred and stupid" comments got a little old). However, its description of the Castellano bugging was completely made up, a bunch of silly James Bond shit. I understand they didn't include the real bugging as they thought it might compromise FBI techniques, but they could have just wrote "we did the bugging but can't provide details". Instead, they wrote a fairy tale for that chapter. Is the rest of the book bullshit too?
It's got actual transcripts from the bugs so that stuff you can just accept. So conversations between Castellano and guys like Tommy Gambino and Joe Armone are pretty interesting and can be trusted. I find it odd that Gravano never comes up. We know he was meeting regularly with Castellano but he never gets mentioned. I don't buy a lot of the conversations they claim they had with some people the way they describe it. Like Gallo and Bilotti. And it's weird to me that they spend a few pages about how amazing it was that one of them got a picture of Joe N. Gallo. So what?

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by Ivan » Mon Nov 08, 2021 11:36 am

Question about the O'Brien/Kurins book: Is that thing credible? I enjoyed reading it when I was a teenager a million years ago as I liked the writing style and how it felt like a novel (though the nonstop "they're all inbred and stupid" comments got a little old). However, its description of the Castellano bugging was completely made up, a bunch of silly James Bond shit. I understand they didn't include the real bugging as they thought it might compromise FBI techniques, but they could have just wrote "we did the bugging but can't provide details". Instead, they wrote a fairy tale for that chapter. Is the rest of the book bullshit too?

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by Snakes » Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:25 am

thekiduknow wrote: Mon Nov 08, 2021 6:10 am
stortvloed wrote: Mon Nov 08, 2021 4:18 am
B. wrote: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:25 pm - A meeting was held at a Brooklyn residence in October 1976 between "several capos" of the Gambino family. After around a six hour discussion, it was decided that Paul Castellano and Joe N. Gallo would be in charge of the family until Aniello Dellacroce's release from prison, at which point he (Dellacroce) would potentially head the family if he was in good enough health. At this meeting Joe N. Gallo also spoke with each man in attendance about their "activities and payoffs" to be made to the family leadership. They agreed to give all forthcoming payments to Gallo who would keep Castellano in the loop.

Among those in attendance at the meeting:

David Amodeo
Paul Castellano
(Redacted)
Joe N. Gallo
(Redacted)
(Redacted)
Nick Patti
Terri Zappi
Fank Piccolo
Frank Perrone

- It should be noted that a report from before Gambino's death described Castellano as still being acting boss (he was appointed in the late 1960s), with the incarcerated Dellacroce at underboss, and Joe N. Gallo as consigliere, with Jimmy Failla helping to run the family. Castellano was said to represent Gambino when Gambino himself could not attend meetings and Castellano was described as the leader of the family's "Brooklyn faction."

- A month later in November 1976, an informant stated that a boss had still not been selected in the Gambino family but that prior to Carlo Gambino's death, captains in the family had been pushing for Joe N. Gallo to take over as boss but he declined and Gambino was allowed to stay on as boss until his death. This informant stated Gallo was the most "powerful and respected" member of the family and speculated that Dellacroce will probably take over as the new boss upon his release from prison. He said that while this new boss would run the Gambino family, he would not have the same control over other families that Gambino had. Other information from November suggested that the new boss would be Castellano or Gallo.

- Finally, following Dellacroce's release, a meeting was held at a residence in Brooklyn in mid-December 1976 and attended by several captains in the Gambino family. The meeting lasted several hours and each attendee was "greeted individually" by Paul Castellano, Neil Dellacroce, and Joe N. Gallo. The attendees had dinner and afterward Castellano announced that he had been nominated as the new boss of the family. Castellano said he was appointing Dellacroce as underboss and "suggesting" that Joe N. Gallo be named consigliere (remember that a consigliere must technically be voted in, not appointed by boss). The captains in attendance then did a "voice vote" and approved the new administration.

At this meeting Paul Castellano stated that the family was "united", without "friction", and that this new administration would run the family in the same way it had been run under Gambino and reiterated that the family was not to be involved in prostitution and narcotics. He also expressed an interest in developing contacts in Atlantic City and other areas, as they wanted to have "friends in the hotels and casinos in Atlantic City when it opens for gambling." He told those in attendance that any family members investing in Atlantic City should be made known to him, Dellacroce, or Gallo, and that a captain is "not to handle this area on his own without permission from one of them."

To conclude the meeting, Castellano told the attendees that "this would be the last meeting of all the capos" and Castellano instructed Frank Piccolo to visit Ray Patriarca in Providence in the next few days to tell him of Castellano's promotion to boss and to "wish him the very best" from Castellano.

Following the meeting, the informant in attendance told the FBI that David Amodeo and another individual from the Bronx were not happy with Joe N. Gallo as consigliere and would have preferred Joe Zingaro as the new consigliere. The informant felt that several of the captains were unhappy with Gallo because of the way he had run the family for Carlo Gambino during the previous year.

Among those who attended the meeting were:

David Amodeo
(Redacted)
Paul Castellano
(Redacted)
(Redacted)
Frank Piccolo
Terry Zappi
Frank Perrone
Joe Zingaro
Peter Stincone
Sorry for digging up an old topic but I am really curious, what is the source for this? Also, the meeting I put in bold, seems to be the same meeting as Kurins & Obrien place on November 24th of 1976 in their 1991 Boss of Bosses book.
https://archive.org/details/CosaNostra- ... 1/mode/2up

It's the first few pages, its funny it was released with files on the Bonanno family.
That particular file collects intelligence on all of the New York families and some overall LCN intel cross-pollinates into it. This one contains some Bonanno-specific intel (the subject of the request) but also happened to have to some Gambino stuff, too. One random thing I did notice when I read that file was that in 1969, the FBI received information that the Commission was considering recognizing two new LCN families: one in the south (not named or redacted) and one from Tucson under Joe Bonanno, officially splitting him off from the larger Bonanno family. I'm not sure if this ever came to fruition because I don't know if Tucson ever actually became recognized as independent, but others here (Antilliar? B?) may know. I have seen later files recognizing them as separate but I'm not sure if that was conjecture on the FBI's part or not.

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by thekiduknow » Mon Nov 08, 2021 6:10 am

stortvloed wrote: Mon Nov 08, 2021 4:18 am
B. wrote: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:25 pm - A meeting was held at a Brooklyn residence in October 1976 between "several capos" of the Gambino family. After around a six hour discussion, it was decided that Paul Castellano and Joe N. Gallo would be in charge of the family until Aniello Dellacroce's release from prison, at which point he (Dellacroce) would potentially head the family if he was in good enough health. At this meeting Joe N. Gallo also spoke with each man in attendance about their "activities and payoffs" to be made to the family leadership. They agreed to give all forthcoming payments to Gallo who would keep Castellano in the loop.

Among those in attendance at the meeting:

David Amodeo
Paul Castellano
(Redacted)
Joe N. Gallo
(Redacted)
(Redacted)
Nick Patti
Terri Zappi
Fank Piccolo
Frank Perrone

- It should be noted that a report from before Gambino's death described Castellano as still being acting boss (he was appointed in the late 1960s), with the incarcerated Dellacroce at underboss, and Joe N. Gallo as consigliere, with Jimmy Failla helping to run the family. Castellano was said to represent Gambino when Gambino himself could not attend meetings and Castellano was described as the leader of the family's "Brooklyn faction."

- A month later in November 1976, an informant stated that a boss had still not been selected in the Gambino family but that prior to Carlo Gambino's death, captains in the family had been pushing for Joe N. Gallo to take over as boss but he declined and Gambino was allowed to stay on as boss until his death. This informant stated Gallo was the most "powerful and respected" member of the family and speculated that Dellacroce will probably take over as the new boss upon his release from prison. He said that while this new boss would run the Gambino family, he would not have the same control over other families that Gambino had. Other information from November suggested that the new boss would be Castellano or Gallo.

- Finally, following Dellacroce's release, a meeting was held at a residence in Brooklyn in mid-December 1976 and attended by several captains in the Gambino family. The meeting lasted several hours and each attendee was "greeted individually" by Paul Castellano, Neil Dellacroce, and Joe N. Gallo. The attendees had dinner and afterward Castellano announced that he had been nominated as the new boss of the family. Castellano said he was appointing Dellacroce as underboss and "suggesting" that Joe N. Gallo be named consigliere (remember that a consigliere must technically be voted in, not appointed by boss). The captains in attendance then did a "voice vote" and approved the new administration.

At this meeting Paul Castellano stated that the family was "united", without "friction", and that this new administration would run the family in the same way it had been run under Gambino and reiterated that the family was not to be involved in prostitution and narcotics. He also expressed an interest in developing contacts in Atlantic City and other areas, as they wanted to have "friends in the hotels and casinos in Atlantic City when it opens for gambling." He told those in attendance that any family members investing in Atlantic City should be made known to him, Dellacroce, or Gallo, and that a captain is "not to handle this area on his own without permission from one of them."

To conclude the meeting, Castellano told the attendees that "this would be the last meeting of all the capos" and Castellano instructed Frank Piccolo to visit Ray Patriarca in Providence in the next few days to tell him of Castellano's promotion to boss and to "wish him the very best" from Castellano.

Following the meeting, the informant in attendance told the FBI that David Amodeo and another individual from the Bronx were not happy with Joe N. Gallo as consigliere and would have preferred Joe Zingaro as the new consigliere. The informant felt that several of the captains were unhappy with Gallo because of the way he had run the family for Carlo Gambino during the previous year.

Among those who attended the meeting were:

David Amodeo
(Redacted)
Paul Castellano
(Redacted)
(Redacted)
Frank Piccolo
Terry Zappi
Frank Perrone
Joe Zingaro
Peter Stincone
Sorry for digging up an old topic but I am really curious, what is the source for this? Also, the meeting I put in bold, seems to be the same meeting as Kurins & Obrien place on November 24th of 1976 in their 1991 Boss of Bosses book.
https://archive.org/details/CosaNostra- ... 1/mode/2up

It's the first few pages, its funny it was released with files on the Bonanno family.

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by stortvloed » Mon Nov 08, 2021 4:18 am

B. wrote: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:25 pm - A meeting was held at a Brooklyn residence in October 1976 between "several capos" of the Gambino family. After around a six hour discussion, it was decided that Paul Castellano and Joe N. Gallo would be in charge of the family until Aniello Dellacroce's release from prison, at which point he (Dellacroce) would potentially head the family if he was in good enough health. At this meeting Joe N. Gallo also spoke with each man in attendance about their "activities and payoffs" to be made to the family leadership. They agreed to give all forthcoming payments to Gallo who would keep Castellano in the loop.

Among those in attendance at the meeting:

David Amodeo
Paul Castellano
(Redacted)
Joe N. Gallo
(Redacted)
(Redacted)
Nick Patti
Terri Zappi
Fank Piccolo
Frank Perrone

- It should be noted that a report from before Gambino's death described Castellano as still being acting boss (he was appointed in the late 1960s), with the incarcerated Dellacroce at underboss, and Joe N. Gallo as consigliere, with Jimmy Failla helping to run the family. Castellano was said to represent Gambino when Gambino himself could not attend meetings and Castellano was described as the leader of the family's "Brooklyn faction."

- A month later in November 1976, an informant stated that a boss had still not been selected in the Gambino family but that prior to Carlo Gambino's death, captains in the family had been pushing for Joe N. Gallo to take over as boss but he declined and Gambino was allowed to stay on as boss until his death. This informant stated Gallo was the most "powerful and respected" member of the family and speculated that Dellacroce will probably take over as the new boss upon his release from prison. He said that while this new boss would run the Gambino family, he would not have the same control over other families that Gambino had. Other information from November suggested that the new boss would be Castellano or Gallo.

- Finally, following Dellacroce's release, a meeting was held at a residence in Brooklyn in mid-December 1976 and attended by several captains in the Gambino family. The meeting lasted several hours and each attendee was "greeted individually" by Paul Castellano, Neil Dellacroce, and Joe N. Gallo. The attendees had dinner and afterward Castellano announced that he had been nominated as the new boss of the family. Castellano said he was appointing Dellacroce as underboss and "suggesting" that Joe N. Gallo be named consigliere (remember that a consigliere must technically be voted in, not appointed by boss). The captains in attendance then did a "voice vote" and approved the new administration.

At this meeting Paul Castellano stated that the family was "united", without "friction", and that this new administration would run the family in the same way it had been run under Gambino and reiterated that the family was not to be involved in prostitution and narcotics. He also expressed an interest in developing contacts in Atlantic City and other areas, as they wanted to have "friends in the hotels and casinos in Atlantic City when it opens for gambling." He told those in attendance that any family members investing in Atlantic City should be made known to him, Dellacroce, or Gallo, and that a captain is "not to handle this area on his own without permission from one of them."

To conclude the meeting, Castellano told the attendees that "this would be the last meeting of all the capos" and Castellano instructed Frank Piccolo to visit Ray Patriarca in Providence in the next few days to tell him of Castellano's promotion to boss and to "wish him the very best" from Castellano.

Following the meeting, the informant in attendance told the FBI that David Amodeo and another individual from the Bronx were not happy with Joe N. Gallo as consigliere and would have preferred Joe Zingaro as the new consigliere. The informant felt that several of the captains were unhappy with Gallo because of the way he had run the family for Carlo Gambino during the previous year.

Among those who attended the meeting were:

David Amodeo
(Redacted)
Paul Castellano
(Redacted)
(Redacted)
Frank Piccolo
Terry Zappi
Frank Perrone
Joe Zingaro
Peter Stincone
Sorry for digging up an old topic but I am really curious, what is the source for this? Also, the meeting I put in bold, seems to be the same meeting as Kurins & Obrien place on November 24th of 1976 in their 1991 Boss of Bosses book.

Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by NothingNew44 » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:59 pm

Paul was the right choice. Having Neil stay on as UB was a smart play. Jimmy Brown would’ve been a great consigliere even boss in his own right.

Re: RE: Re: Castellano's election as boss late 1976

by Eline2015 » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:51 pm

phatmatress777 wrote: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:05 pm
Costigan wrote:
Super wrote: Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:50 pm Paul was the right decision with out a doubt neil was a gangster paul could see the future neil was stuck in time i feel they had a good admin but not overly sure about gallo think there might have been better candidates
I agree that Paul was a better gangster than some people give him credit for, I mean he gets type-cast as this old milk drinker, a white collar criminal afraid of violence, etc...but what about his decision to name Tommy Bilotti his new underboss? That was a bad move & must have really pissed off some people.
There were more murders under Paul's reign than there were under gottis.

Sent from my SM-J337V using Tapatalk
Could you please provide more info about this

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