When were bosses present at ceremonies?

[axx]

Was it always necessary for a family boss to be present at induction ceremonies of new soldiers?
In lcnbios' 1957 colombo ceremony description Magliocco as underboss was present but not Profaci. William Dara talks about a banquet and states that he had no formal induction ceremony which ceased years before him. Instead he was merely informed he is a now member (this seems frankly unbelievable, is there any other proof he was actually a member and not just an associate). Of course you have Valachi and ceremony with Maranzano.
Undoubtedly things changed when the books were opened in 70s and bosses were present at ceremonies.
Is there any more info on how 1930s - 50s ceremonies were handled and by whom?

[chin_gigante]

Dara was a member. The Bonannos frequently used informal ceremonies to induct new members. Joe Massino was inducted through a verbal oath only.

[thekiduknow]

Dara was a member. The Bonannos frequently used informal ceremonies to induct new members. Joe Massino was inducted through a verbal oath only.

They used a verbal oath but Galante presided over the ceremony.

Massino presided over ceremonies once he was released, but I believe they were all verbal oaths.

For what it’s worth, Bonanno said in his autobiography that there were members of his family that he never met, implying that there were at least some he didn’t induct.

[johnny_scootch]

A boss doesn't have to be present there are numerous examples of Underbosses, Consigliere's and Captains conducting initiations. It's been the smart move for a boss to avoid these ceremonies for a long time.

[Fughedaboutit]

Dara was a member. The Bonannos frequently used informal ceremonies to induct new members. Joe Massino was inducted through a verbal oath only.

What do you mean by verbal oath? A normal ceremony but without guns and the burning card?

[johnny_scootch]

Dara was a member. The Bonannos frequently used informal ceremonies to induct new members. Joe Massino was inducted through a verbal oath only.

What do you mean by verbal oath? A normal ceremony but without guns and the burning card?

No gun no knife no finger pricking no burning of holy cards. They'll ask you if you know why you're here if you want to be a member if you say yes they say a few words go over the rules maybe tell you who the bosses are assign you a capo and you're in. Very very basic same scenario for guys like Joe Massino who was made by Galante in a bar all the way to Vincenzo Morena who was made by Damiano Zummo in Canada. Decavalcante family did the same thing for a long time also.

[Fughedaboutit]

Dara was a member. The Bonannos frequently used informal ceremonies to induct new members. Joe Massino was inducted through a verbal oath only.

What do you mean by verbal oath? A normal ceremony but without guns and the burning card?

No gun no knife no finger pricking no burning of holy cards. They'll ask you if you know why you're here if you want to be a member if you say yes they say a few words go over the rules maybe tell you who the bosses are assign you a capo and you're in. Very very basic same scenario for guys like Joe Massino who was made by Galante in a bar all the way to Vincenzo Morena who was made by Damiano Zummo in Canada. Decavalcante family did the same thing for a long time also.

I got ya...so the ceremony without the props

[moneyman]

Dara was a member. The Bonannos frequently used informal ceremonies to induct new members. Joe Massino was inducted through a verbal oath only.

Not only was there no formal ceremony, but the ceremony was conducted at night at a back of a bar. The bar wasnt even closed when the ceremony took place, regular customers were present at the bar when it took place.

[johnny_scootch]

I got ya...so the ceremony without the props

Basically yes, it's also worth mentioning that the Bonanno's would sometimes mention to the inductees that there was supposed to be a gun and knife present at the ceremony but 'because of the way things are now' we don't have them. 'The way things are' meaning law enforcement pressure.

[JMAN723]

I got ya...so the ceremony without the props

Basically yes, it's also worth mentioning that the Bonanno's would sometimes mention to the inductees that there was supposed to be a gun and knife present at the ceremony but 'because of the way things are now' we don't have them. 'The way things are' meaning law enforcement pressure.

True. I think they were doing that all the way back in 77. I know Frank Lino said that they said “Pretend there is a gun and knife on the table because we can’t take a chance the cops might bust us on a weapons charge”

[johnny_scootch]

I got ya...so the ceremony without the props

Basically yes, it's also worth mentioning that the Bonanno's would sometimes mention to the inductees that there was supposed to be a gun and knife present at the ceremony but 'because of the way things are now' we don't have them. 'The way things are' meaning law enforcement pressure.

True. I think they were doing that all the way back in 77. I know Frank Lino said that they said “Pretend there is a gun and knife on the table because we can’t take a chance the cops might bust us on a weapons charge”

Some people might use Joe Bonanno's description of his initiation as evidence they used short ceremonies all the way back in the 1920's but I am of the opinion he purposefully left that info out for whatever reason. There is absolutely no reason I can think of that would make them want or need to do a quick ceremony in those days.

[Wiseguy]

I got ya...so the ceremony without the props

Basically yes, it's also worth mentioning that the Bonanno's would sometimes mention to the inductees that there was supposed to be a gun and knife present at the ceremony but 'because of the way things are now' we don't have them. 'The way things are' meaning law enforcement pressure.

True. I think they were doing that all the way back in 77. I know Frank Lino said that they said “Pretend there is a gun and knife on the table because we can’t take a chance the cops might bust us on a weapons charge”

They make anyone and everyone over there. And the way they do it is all fucked up. There's no sword or gun on the table. Guys don't get their finger pricked. Either it has meaning or no meaning.

[JMAN723]

I got ya...so the ceremony without the props

Basically yes, it's also worth mentioning that the Bonanno's would sometimes mention to the inductees that there was supposed to be a gun and knife present at the ceremony but 'because of the way things are now' we don't have them. 'The way things are' meaning law enforcement pressure.

True. I think they were doing that all the way back in 77. I know Frank Lino said that they said “Pretend there is a gun and knife on the table because we can’t take a chance the cops might bust us on a weapons charge”

They make anyone and everyone over there. And the way they do it is all fucked up. There's no sword or gun on the table. Guys don't get their finger pricked. Either it has meaning or no meaning.

Haha.

[Lefty_Ruggiero]

I got ya...so the ceremony without the props

Basically yes, it's also worth mentioning that the Bonanno's would sometimes mention to the inductees that there was supposed to be a gun and knife present at the ceremony but 'because of the way things are now' we don't have them. 'The way things are' meaning law enforcement pressure.

True. I think they were doing that all the way back in 77. I know Frank Lino said that they said “Pretend there is a gun and knife on the table because we can’t take a chance the cops might bust us on a weapons charge”

They make anyone and everyone over there. And the way they do it is all fucked up. There's no sword or gun on the table. Guys don't get their finger pricked. Either it has meaning or no meaning.

David Chase must have looked at Bonnano ceremonies before writing that line.

[Pogo The Clown]

Pretty sure it was in reference to the DeCavalcantes not doing the traditional ceremony and Gotti making them redo when he found out. That information came out only a few years before that episode.


Pogo