Family Councils / Consigli / Seggia / Elders / Inner Circle

[Angelo Santino]

I wonder what led to their decline in NY. Perhaps the Commission at large assumed more of their duties that 5 panels became unnessecary and weren't replaced once panel holders died.

The Bonanno panel apparent functioned very differently as their role wasnt to judge members but to be supervisors. This function likely existed during Schiros tenure and perhaps Maggadino seen the folly of such a body. There are instances, like with the Good Killers, that would seemingly run counter to Schiro. He was known as a pragmatic and neutral leader in the political arena yet the GK under Bonventre were hitting Morello rivals who were likely Gambinos during the time Gentile arrived.

[B.]

Is there info that the Good Killers were acting counter to Schiro's wishes? Or do you think Schiro was pretending to maintain neutrality (like Gentile said of him) while secretly enabling the Killers to help his allies?

I think one of the reasons for the joint-consiglio in NYC is sources said a new rule was developed where the consiglio had to judge/approve a murder and a boss alone couldn't order the murder of a member of his own Family without going through that process. Probably because a murder in any Family in NYC had a direct impact on other Families.

The single consiglio in smaller Families was also in charge of underworld trials but the life/death of a member would only directly impact the local Family so they could be the arbiters of that. Of course if the guy was related to someone in another city that might matter... when Pete Misuraca was put on trial by the San Jose consiglio they consulted his brother w/ the Profacis.

[Angelo Santino]

No, we dont know what Schiro thought of the GK but their actions chip away at the neutral reputation that Schiro carried. He either approved of it or was in the dark. My thinking in regards to Magaddino is that he witnessed the dynamic and when he had a chance at the position he didnt want history to repeat itself so he did away with it or let the existing body lapse.

[B.]

Magaddino says he was schooled by Schiro and credits him for his early understanding -- Joe Bonanno was molded by Maranzano, but we might get an idea of Schiro's leadership style from Magaddino.

Magaddino often tries to give an impression of neutrality as a national statesman but everyone seemed to think he was a major schemer. Everyone was so paranoid and read into every little action it's hard to say how much was true vs. in their own heads. Probably some of both.

Hard to gauge if Buffalo did/didn't have a consiglio by the mid-1960s given they didn't have a member informant. Recordings of bosses doesn't give much indication of the existence of a consiglio even in Families where they had them. It's like a recording of someone saying they're going to meet the boss... they're probably just going to say "I'm going to meet Joe" not "I'm going to meet Joe, who is our rappresentante officiale." The Milwaukee consiglio meet recorded by the FBI didn't begin with "Now begins a meeting of the seggia, which is our term for council, let's begin..."

[davidf1989]

According to Fratianno in his book Bompensiero was made the consigliere so he would drop his guard and make it easier for their boss Brooklier and others to have him killed as they suspected he was an informant.

[B.]

Yeah official consigliere. Antiliar and someone else pointed out LA did have a council but called it the "Bastoni" which means sticks but is used to mean walking canes. Seem to refer to them being elders, i.e. they carry canes.

[Antiliar]

Yeah official consigliere. Antiliar and someone else pointed out LA did have a council but called it the "Bastoni" which means sticks but is used to mean walking canes. Seem to refer to them being elders, i.e. they carry canes.

"Bastones" came from an early informant, I believe in the 1950s, in Tom Dragna's FBI file. So its accuracy and value are debatable.

[davidf1989]

Yeah official consigliere. Antiliar and someone else pointed out LA did have a council but called it the "Bastoni" which means sticks but is used to mean walking canes. Seem to refer to them being elders, i.e. they carry canes.

"Bastones" came from an early informant, I believe in the 1950s, in Tom Dragna's FBI file. So its accuracy and value are debatable.

Was this Tom Dragna the brother or nephew of Jack Dragna?

[B.]

So not definitive but worthy of inclusion in a discussion about the consiglio.

[Antiliar]

Yeah official consigliere. Antiliar and someone else pointed out LA did have a council but called it the "Bastoni" which means sticks but is used to mean walking canes. Seem to refer to them being elders, i.e. they carry canes.

"Bastones" came from an early informant, I believe in the 1950s, in Tom Dragna's FBI file. So its accuracy and value are debatable.

Was this Tom Dragna the brother or nephew of Jack Dragna?

Brother. The nephew was Louis Thomas Dragna.

[PolackTony]

Also reason to believe some Families didn't have an official consigliere and distributed the duties among the consiglio. There is evidence of that in San Jose and Buscetta said something similar about some Sicilian Families.

This was the way that CG-T1 (I believe Teddy DeRose) explained the channel that a member's grievance would follow (1964). We know that the sponsor in Chicago was typically a capodecina. From there the matter would be arbitrated by the Outfit's "committee". If this information is accurate (and I believe it is, if coming from DeRose, as while he was an associate he was a very knowledgeable one and "passed" as Italian, so I find it plausible that members may have divulged info about these matters to him) then we see that one of the roles of the "committee" was to handle problems or grievances among the membership, which certainly sounds like a duty of a consigliere distributed over a council to me.


Not sure about the veracity of this "source" here (1974), but this is another reference to a "committee" in Chicago that I don't think has been posted before. At the least, it goes to show that the source believed that there was a committee and that an order to kill a member would've come from them.


Another source from the 70s states that Aiuppa, as boss, served "under" the ruling board/committee/council consisting of senior members. So if this was a consiglio, it was a "Consiglio of Power".

[B.]

Hesitant to comment too much on Chicago's hierarchy given how controversial the subject tends to be, but the fleeting references to their "committee" sound like they concerned similar duties as the formal consiglio in other Families, whether official or defacto.

Consiglio duties / attributes:

- Approved transfers (probably inductions as well)
- Discussed Family rules / policy
- Oversaw / voted on underworld trials for members accused of infractions
- Consiglio members could voice themselves as peers of the boss
- Arbited sitdowns/disputes, especially matters of life and death
- Could hold any rank from "soldier" to boss but a seat on the consiglio was official/formal, not musical chairs

Very similar duties to the rank of official consigliere in some ways but distributed among a group.

I suspect they were involved in organizing elections for the boss position when it opened, though haven't seen evidence of it. There's a wiretap of SF boss Jimmy Lanza implying the council in San Jose has the power to go to New York (the Commission) if the boss Cerrito acts out of line. So when the council is fully functioning like it was in SJ they have an immense amount of power.

[Antiliar]

I don't think that we should lose sight that these consiglios had someone who was the final word. In Giuseppe Morello's day the general assemblies and other meetings followed parliamentary procedure. I suspect that the more modern consiglios were a lot less formal.

I don't know if it was mentioned, but in The Last Mafioso when Fratianno was in New York he met with the Genovese leaders. He described a vote being taken to order a hit. I think the leaders were Funzi Tieri, Fat Tony Salerno, and the Chin. This administration meeting sounds like a partial consiglio.

I also suspect that all these ruling panels are types of consiglios.

[PolackTony]

Hesitant to comment too much on Chicago's hierarchy given how controversial the subject tends to be, but the fleeting references to their "committee" sound like they concerned similar duties as the formal consiglio in other Families, whether official or defacto.

Consiglio duties / attributes:

- Approved transfers (probably inductions as well)
- Discussed Family rules / policy
- Oversaw / voted on underworld trials for members accused of infractions
- Consiglio members could voice themselves as peers of the boss
- Arbited sitdowns/disputes, especially matters of life and death
- Could hold any rank from "soldier" to boss but a seat on the consiglio was official/formal, not musical chairs

Very similar duties to the rank of official consigliere in some ways but distributed among a group.

I suspect they were involved in organizating elections for the boss position when it opened, though haven't seen evidence of it.

One thing that strikes me about the references (and there are a number of them, though frustratingly lacking in the sort of detail that we'd like to see) to Chicago's council is that it is clearly described as a "ruling" or "head" body. Instead of serving the rappresentante, the picture that we have is the inverse. The day-to-day executive responsibility was delegated to the boss, but this was invested in the boss at the will of the council. The way that I've come to see it is that the council was the source of ultimate executive authority in the family. This is clear when we have an account from a CI that the ultimate source of authority was not the boss but "the Man", who was the "Chairman". I don't believe that this was simply an analogy or turn of phrase, but an accurate descriptor of the roles occupied by Ricca and Accardo. As the most senior member, they headed the council that represented the interests of the family as a collective. Rule and policy were reached by consensus, and I see Ricca and Accardo as something like "capi consiglieri". though, perhaps, capi consiglieri Of Power.

Maybe this is a marked distinction from the way similar bodies were structured anfd functioned in other families. Or maybe not. In that the consigli/saggie in other families were clearly holdovers from an era when the boss was still "rappresentante" and authority less invested in a single office, perhaps these councils were ultimately the seat (pun intended) of authority as well. Worth reflecting on what is connoted by terms such as "saggia" or "bastone" (if the latter is indeed an accurate account).

I don't think that we should lose sight that these consiglios had someone who was the final word. In Giuseppe Morello's day the general assemblies and other meetings followed parliamentary procedure. I suspect that the more modern consiglios were a lot less formal.

I don't know if it was mentioned, but in The Last Mafioso when Fratianno was in New York he met with the Genovese leaders. He described a vote being taken to order a hit. I think the leaders were Funzi Tieri, Fat Tony Salerno, and the Chin. This administration meeting sounds like a partial consiglio.

I also suspect that all these ruling panels are types of consiglios.

Good points. I think that if and when push came to shove someone had the final say. In Chicago, it seems clear that this was the "Chairman" (though presumably this only happened in rare circumstances, as I believe that consensus was most likely the goal). This is why I see their role as akin to the way that Bonanno describes the "capo consigliere". First among equals, but all indicators point to them having the final say if things came to that.

Latter-day ruling panels may certainly have been a vestige or echo of a more formalized structure from the past, by that point perhaps denuded but not forgotten.

[B.]

- San Jose's consiglio had a "secretary" who was formally chosen and an informant knew the succession of who held this role -- very significant position and was not held by the boss. From what CC found doing his Detroit chart, John Priziola held this role on the Detroit council. Plays into what Antiliar said, though I don't know that they so much had "final word" as much as they were in charge of organizing and maintaining the process.

- Calderone said during a boss election a "secretary" is elected who presides. Doesn't say it's part of the consiglio or who the election secretary usually is. He did reference the consiglio's existence in other cooperation and says those who sit on the consiglio are naturally called "consiglieri" (plural).

- Joe Bonanno felt the capo dei capi ("capo consigliere" as he called it) operated closer to this, presiding in more of an advisory role as a first among equals. I think there was a macro/micro set-up where the national government had a capo with a similar relationship to the Gran Consiglio just as most Families had a capo and a consiglio. Not all personalities and dynamics were the same but the Family + national structures mirrored each other to some degree.

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Here is what the co-author of Gentile's memoir wrote:

Third: Gentile was more or less a CapoFamiglia of sorts. And a Consigliere to the Capo of the Consiglio Supremo, an intermediary and a peacemaker

- Consiglio Supremo and Gran Consiglio are synonyms. This is the co-author, not Gentile, but he had the impression the capo presided over the Gran Consiglio which does fit Joe Bonanno's "capo consigliere" take by definition. "Capo of the Consiglio Supremo" = Capo Consigliere.

- Gentile says a meeting of the Gran Consiglio had to be called to bring the Pittsburgh Camorristi into Cosa Nostra which seems obvious to me. Just as the Family consiglio dictated who joined/transferred (the SF consiglio had to approve Gentile's transfer), would make sense the Gran Consiglio had to approve the induction of Camorristi into the Sicilian-centric Honored Society. He says the Gran Consiglio called for an Assemblea Generale to iron out the dispute between the Camorra and mafia as part of this process.

- A question is if the Gran Consiglio could have "soldiers" on it.Gentile indicates he held national importance even during periods when he was a "soldier" so maybe Gentile had a Gran Consiglio seat regardless of his rank at a given time which would explain why he was constantly sought out to help with national disputes beyond his esteemed reputation alone. Buscetta said the first Sicilian mafia Commission purposely elected "soldiers" to sit on it, so this may be an older process.

Gentile interview with co-author:

Chilanti: And what about the Consiglio of the Capi?
Gentile: They speak for the Capo dei Capi and address the Assemblea.

- So they speak on behalf of the capo and in his memoir it's clear the capo could greatly influence the Gran Consiglio/Assemblea but we also know Gentile sometimes disagreed with the capo and successfully argued an outcome against D'Aquila's wishes. Definitely wasn't as simple as everyone always doing what the capo wanted even though he was massively influential.

Gentile says this regarding a dispute within the Gambino Family Agrigento faction:

I also added that if he did not change his conduct, I would be compelled to report it to the Consiglio of the Onorata Società that would be able to arbitrate between the two about who was right and who was wrong.

- He doesn't say "Gran" Consiglio and is referring to a dispute between a Gambino soldier and his captain. He could be referring to a Family consiglio in the Gambino Family, the NYC joint-consiglio, or the Gran Consiglio but the function of high-level arbitration is consistent with the consiglio on every scale.

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Tony -- I added this to my post after you replied:

There's a wiretap of SF boss Jimmy Lanza implying the council in San Jose has the power to go to New York (the Commission) if the boss Cerrito acts out of line. So when the council is fully functioning like it was in SJ they have an immense amount of power.

- If it's true the Chicago rappresentante operated at the discretion of the committee to some degree, that would be consistent with the San Jose consiglio's authority over Cerrito. I know the early 1970s member informant (Gianola?) said Ricca and Accardo were primarily concerned with preventing murders at that time. The "chairman" term is also consistent with the consiglio, as it was called the "chair" in Detroit and Milwaukee, therefore those with a seat were "chairmen".

- Like Antiliar kind of hit upon, ruling panels and committees are also a natural development in any org, mafia or not. I don't want someone to take this info and apply it to every single ruling panel up to present day, but there is no question the Sicilian mafia and early US had a formal body called the consiglio with specific duties and huge power. The boss was part of the consiglio in every example we have, so it wasn't apart from him though it offered other avenues of authority than just rappresentante controlling everything.