Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Discuss all mafia families in the U.S., Canada, Italy, and everywhere else in the world.

Moderator: Capos

Post Reply
User avatar
Angelo Santino
Filthy Few
Posts: 6564
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 8:15 am

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Angelo Santino »

B. wrote:Dave Critchley who wrote the best mafia history book is practically a supervillain to some folks on the boards.
Yeah it's a great book. No argument there. But let's say I wrote a book on the Philadelphia Mafia and included exclusive information that you provided (your time and perhaps even money) as my own and I took all the credit. You'd feel differently about it if it became the greatest book about Philadelphia ever. :mrgreen:

I was 16 years old translating Gentile, not a fucking lick of credit given he later stated in an interview his intention was to write a book about Gentile's life. Now granted a credit wasn't pre-arranged. But I'm 30 now and if I had a fucking kid from Angola translate something from Bakongo that relates to the Luanda Mob Family that I was writing about, I'd at the very least credit the kid. Requires one line of text. And that's just my story, he flat out fucking took credit for other people's research. Whether they want to go into it is up to them.

As far as him being a supervillian I never characterized him that way. But when I look back on the translated pages I sent him, I kinda feel like Richard Pryor unknowingly assisting Ross Webster to fuck over Superman in part 3.
User avatar
Lupara
Full Patched
Posts: 3044
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2014 7:24 pm

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Lupara »

B. wrote:Don't take the jokes I was doing personally, Scott. Think of it like the Onion but for mob followers.

I am glad you share info and I find the descriptions really entertaining honestly. I mean it really IS the Cheesesteak City.

Remember too that Capeci gets hated on every Thursday when Gangland comes out and that Dave Critchley who wrote the best mafia history book is practically a supervillain to some folks on the boards.
Even though these jokes are hilarious I also like Scott's writings.
User avatar
Lupara
Full Patched
Posts: 3044
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2014 7:24 pm

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Lupara »

Chris Christie wrote:
B. wrote:I was 16 years old translating Gentile, not a fucking lick of credit given he later stated in an interview his intention was to write a book about Gentile's life. Now granted a credit wasn't pre-arranged. But I'm 30 now and if I had a fucking kid from Angola translate something from Bakongo that relates to the Luanda Mob Family that I was writing about, I'd at the very least credit the kid. Requires one line of text. And that's just my story, he flat out fucking took credit for other people's research. Whether they want to go into it is up to them.
That's a bitch move. He could've easily list your name on the last page. I understand your frustration.
User avatar
DPG
Sergeant Of Arms
Posts: 803
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2016 11:04 am
Location: You can find me in Saint Louie

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by DPG »

When I first joined rd and relized all the authors on there I reached out to all of them. Dave was one of the only to reply, we chatted some and he eventually asked me a question about the post casino economy of Hot Springs. I answered him with all the info I could find and told him of a couple of books I was trying to find. Few days later he emails me asking for passages from these books, I explained they were self published and I was having trouble finding them.That was 2012 and he hasn't talked to me one time since, if you want Dave off a thread anywhere on the forums pm me and Ill post on it :mrgreen:
I get it....first rule of fight club.
User avatar
Ivan
Full Patched
Posts: 3865
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:33 am
Location: The center of the universe, a.k.a. Ohio

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Ivan »

I like Dave's work too, but that thing where Tommy blew up on him out of nowhere was hilarious.
EYYYY ALL YOU CHOOCHES OUT THERE IT'S THE KID
User avatar
phatmatress777
Full Patched
Posts: 1413
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 6:53 pm

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by phatmatress777 »

Scott is a great author and I know he has taken this thread in stride. He has a passion for everything he writes. I especially apperciate his passion for getting white boy Rick released from prison. When it finanlly happens both Rick and Scott will take great joy because I know that Scott has went above and beyond to help him out !!!! Not only a great author but a great humanitarian in my book !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
User avatar
SonnyBlackstein
Filthy Few
Posts: 7576
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2014 2:21 am

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by SonnyBlackstein »

Chris Christie wrote: I think you'll find Sonny's the most offensive and I would too.
Dear god.

Seriously?


Care to explain?
Don't give me your f***ing Manson lamps.
User avatar
Pogo The Clown
Men Of Mayhem
Posts: 14150
Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2014 7:02 am

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Pogo The Clown »

Ivan wrote:I like Dave's work too, but that thing where Tommy blew up on him out of nowhere was hilarious.

I must have been gone by this time. What was this about? :mrgreen:


Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
User avatar
Ivan
Full Patched
Posts: 3865
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:33 am
Location: The center of the universe, a.k.a. Ohio

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Ivan »

Pogo The Clown wrote:
Ivan wrote:I like Dave's work too, but that thing where Tommy blew up on him out of nowhere was hilarious.

I must have been gone by this time. What was this about? :mrgreen:
I can't remember the exact quote and it's not coming up in a search over there, but Dave started complaining about how he couldn't get help accessing some website and then threatened that he wouldn't help anyone else with anything after that, and Tommy was like "Oh shut the fuck up already, you would give an aspirin a headache. I've seen guys piss and moan but you take it to a whole new level." There was more to Tommy's rant after that but I can't remember it. It was just funny for a forum moderator to come out of nowhere with that.
EYYYY ALL YOU CHOOCHES OUT THERE IT'S THE KID
User avatar
Pogo The Clown
Men Of Mayhem
Posts: 14150
Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2014 7:02 am

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Pogo The Clown »

Thanks Ivan. 8-)


Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
User avatar
DPG
Sergeant Of Arms
Posts: 803
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2016 11:04 am
Location: You can find me in Saint Louie

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by DPG »

I remember when he asked someone to send him a pdf of a Informer article or book. Anyway I think Tommy asked him how he would like pdfs of his book being passed around on the site.
I get it....first rule of fight club.
User avatar
Angelo Santino
Filthy Few
Posts: 6564
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 8:15 am

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Angelo Santino »

SonnyBlackstein wrote:
Chris Christie wrote: I think you'll find Sonny's the most offensive and I would too.
Dear god.

Seriously?


Care to explain?
Yeah, seriously. It's obvious you don't fully trust the guy to be honest in his intentions to be truthful, as is your right. Now there's no beef between us, I like you, I like your posts and what you contribute. There's certain posters I skim over when they make a post, you are not one of them. I find you very informative and I've learned or gained new perspectives from your posts on certain topics. There are are areas that you blow me out of the water on, all things being equal. But speaking as someone published, if you made that post to me in response over an article I put blood, sweat, tears and cytoplasm into, I wouldn't even bother with responding, I'd be thinking "fuck this guy!" Everyone can be a critic. But to actually take the time and put something together, to invest the time and (loss of) money into writing, editing and essentially blogging semi-professional articles, from someone who's gone through the process, that's deserving of respect dammit! And I contributed only to ONE article as a co-author, that's my claim to to fame. Scott on the other hand releases periodical articles. And he's well placed to do so. He:

A) has law enforcement connections. (The info and photos on the 2000 Chicago chart I made, you can thank Scott for that 100% which was provided to him by the CCC (Has anyone ever called the CCC asking for info?- I have- I was told the current info is classified and to go read one of the many books that have been published.) Without the info he provided for that chart, I'd be a monkey with photoshop.) viewtopic.php?f=32&t=819
B) has underworld connections (was invited to Detroit LCN captain Frank Bommarito's birthdays but declined out of professional objectivity and how his law enforcement sources/friends would perceive it (would others do the same?).
C) has been endorsed by both Capeci and Anastasia and has collaborated on projects with them or at their behalf. Email them and ask them their honest thoughts on Mr. Burnstein. Everyone flocks to Thursdays With Capeci and if he said so-and-so was the new boss of whatever family, 8 out of 10 here would take it as fact. So I challenge anyone to contact Capeci and ask his honest assertion regarding Burnstein. Go ahead!
D) published with Sam Giancana (IE- wrote the fucking book and Giancana took a co-author credit with a larger font size listing his name mentioning "& Scott Burnstein." Since he's Jewish you know he knows he took a loss. I can only surmise he did it out of love for the topic that we all equally love but what the fuck do I know?
E) He's related to the Burnstein bootlegging brothers of the 1930's and their descendants who remained distinct but in the same worldly orbit as some Detroit syndicate members, enough for him to get his foot in the door and get people talking with him. (He didn't take up an Italian surname and start a website full of adware installments upon visiting filled with gossip and the occasional deleting of a blog here and there because it sparked chatter on a subject that couldn't be backed up with a straight face.)
& F) he has more connections/links/padding on his resume than ANYONE here. And he doesn't expect or want to be placed on a pedestal, but he would appreciate some appreciation for his time and effort? Who else writes/blogs about Detroit, St. Louis (with our own BobbyBats confirming that Scott's SL info was more or less QUITE accurate) or Philly (with the obvious exception of Dave Schratwesier the journalistic ambulance chaser or the great Anastasia himself, who has all but admitted he has grown bored of Italo-American OC and thus passed the Leonetti project onto Burnstein, a project George had hoped to do in the 1990's until Gravano published Underboss and that stole that thunder.

What the fuck does Scott need to do-- sacrifice a goat?

We as mob historians/researchers/affictionados disagree, that's what we do. But we can learn from eachother and inspire conversation. Scott's calling LaMare a "rat for the feds" is misleading, I know because I alone discovered the information in which he based that article on, I provided it to him and Rick who shared it with JimmyB. But outside of the 3 Detroit-orientied posters how many people ever fucking heard of LaMare? It took Scott to get the ball rolling and get a discussion on it. Had I come out a year ago and said LeMare was this or that who but 3 people would give a shit or even know who the fuck that is? We can disagree, but let's respect those who have established themselves and build on that.

I'd like to get Scott more involved in this board, where we can argue/debate with him. That's not going to happen if the conversation starts with: "I think you're a lying fraud but if you prove me wrong I may change my mind." That's how he is treated here. And it's misplaced. He has good intentions and he's not going to write a book with Jack Tocco's cousins' brothers' former roommate and put him on the cover next to Capone and Gotti mugshots.

And if I can quote decent etiquette I can follow it: despite my low opinion of Dave C. If anyone asked me what's one of the best books written on early Mafia history it'd be biased not to suggest that book, and that pains me to say but the truth is bigger than my own ego.
B.
Men Of Mayhem
Posts: 10692
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2014 10:18 pm
Contact:

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by B. »

Chris Christie wrote:
B. wrote:Dave Critchley who wrote the best mafia history book is practically a supervillain to some folks on the boards.
Yeah it's a great book. No argument there. But let's say I wrote a book on the Philadelphia Mafia and included exclusive information that you provided (your time and perhaps even money) as my own and I took all the credit. You'd feel differently about it if it became the greatest book about Philadelphia ever. :mrgreen:

I was 16 years old translating Gentile, not a fucking lick of credit given he later stated in an interview his intention was to write a book about Gentile's life. Now granted a credit wasn't pre-arranged. But I'm 30 now and if I had a fucking kid from Angola translate something from Bakongo that relates to the Luanda Mob Family that I was writing about, I'd at the very least credit the kid. Requires one line of text. And that's just my story, he flat out fucking took credit for other people's research. Whether they want to go into it is up to them.

As far as him being a supervillian I never characterized him that way. But when I look back on the translated pages I sent him, I kinda feel like Richard Pryor unknowingly assisting Ross Webster to fuck over Superman in part 3.
Oh I didn't mean for my comment to be taken that way. I've heard enough from people and talked to you personally on the phone about it, so I know what your experiences are. "Supervillain" was just some hyperbole. My point is that he wrote an important book that I'm sure almost everyone here has benefited from either directly or indirectly, but that doesn't mean people don't have justifiable issues with him.

I also don't mean to compare Scott to Dave, either. Scott has devoted his life to covering a subject that barely makes headlines nowadays. He gets a bit colorful with the titles, nicknames, and language, but it's in good fun when we talk about that. I think it's good that people challenge some of his info, too. If we didn't respectfully challenge info, we'd be in a big fucking mess.
User avatar
Snakes
Full Patched
Posts: 4412
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 7:00 am
Location: Elvis Country

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Snakes »

Chris Christie wrote:Has anyone ever called the CCC asking for info?
Yeah, several times, and I never got a response.
User avatar
Lupara
Full Patched
Posts: 3044
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2014 7:24 pm

Re: Borgesi meets with the Gambinos

Post by Lupara »

Ivan wrote:
Pogo The Clown wrote:
Ivan wrote:I like Dave's work too, but that thing where Tommy blew up on him out of nowhere was hilarious.

I must have been gone by this time. What was this about? :mrgreen:
I can't remember the exact quote and it's not coming up in a search over there, but Dave started complaining about how he couldn't get help accessing some website and then threatened that he wouldn't help anyone else with anything after that, and Tommy was like "Oh shut the fuck up already, you would give an aspirin a headache. I've seen guys piss and moan but you take it to a whole new level." There was more to Tommy's rant after that but I can't remember it. It was just funny for a forum moderator to come out of nowhere with that.
I remember that, this was years ago even before Tag was banned there.
Post Reply