“The mafia is dead”
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NinoFromNYC2
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Re: “The mafia is dead”
Oh really that’s why Sam The Plumber died in 1997 Joe Bonanno in 2002 Carlo Gambino in 1976
Re: “The mafia is dead”
I've been rewatching it recently and I've noticed that, as harmless as the gay jokes are, a lot of people today would be very offended, especially with those two stereotypical Hispanic queers. Or what about that episode where George tries to find a black friend in order to impress a black colleague? People today would lose their shit.SonnyBlackstein wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:24 pmThe amazing tragedy of today’s PC society? Jerry has been quoted as saying he would never be able to make ‘Seinfeld’ in this day and age.
‘Seinfeld’. Unbelievable.
“What ‘delay’ industries?”
The stupid thing is, these jokes have no malice or prejudice - they're making fun of society's own preconceptions, like how George feels he has to have a black friend in order to impress a colleague.
Anyways, we shouldn't derail this thread with Seinfeld talk. I think the Mafia will always exist as long as there's money to be made. That seems to be the only constant with the Mob. As the potential to earn money has diminished, the Mafia has equally diminished to accommodate. If you look at Staten Island, Howard Beach, certain areas of the Bronx and, hell, even areas in Brooklyn, you can see that there are still a whole lot of young Italian-Americans with a gold chain around their neck who would leap at the chance to be in the Mafia. Maybe not the sort of recruiting pool that Lucky Luciano had in mind, but as long as enough of these "guidos" - excuse the racism - can see that there is money to be made, the Mafia will not run out of new recruits. Not to mention the amount of made guys who push their sons, nephews and cousins into the life.
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slimshady_007
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Re: “The mafia is dead”
The mafia still seems to be recruiting young members. The Lucchese family had millennial mobster Vincent Bruno, just in his mid 30’s, pleading guilty to conspiracy to commit murder. Chances are when he gets out, he’ll get his button and maybe he’ll rise through the ranks. Other young mob members include Bonanno soldiers Johnny Joe Spirito Jr and Ernest Aiello who both got made at a pretty young age. There’s always gunna be some young Italian American looking for a sense of purpose who can easily be fall for the appeal of lcn.gohnjotti wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:27 pmI've been rewatching it recently and I've noticed that, as harmless as the gay jokes are, a lot of people today would be very offended, especially with those two stereotypical Hispanic queers. Or what about that episode where George tries to find a black friend in order to impress a black colleague? People today would lose their shit.SonnyBlackstein wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:24 pmThe amazing tragedy of today’s PC society? Jerry has been quoted as saying he would never be able to make ‘Seinfeld’ in this day and age.
‘Seinfeld’. Unbelievable.
“What ‘delay’ industries?”
The stupid thing is, these jokes have no malice or prejudice - they're making fun of society's own preconceptions, like how George feels he has to have a black friend in order to impress a colleague.
Anyways, we shouldn't derail this thread with Seinfeld talk. I think the Mafia will always exist as long as there's money to be made. That seems to be the only constant with the Mob. As the potential to earn money has diminished, the Mafia has equally diminished to accommodate. If you look at Staten Island, Howard Beach, certain areas of the Bronx and, hell, even areas in Brooklyn, you can see that there are still a whole lot of young Italian-Americans with a gold chain around their neck who would leap at the chance to be in the Mafia. Maybe not the sort of recruiting pool that Lucky Luciano had in mind, but as long as enough of these "guidos" - excuse the racism - can see that there is money to be made, the Mafia will not run out of new recruits. Not to mention the amount of made guys who push their sons, nephews and cousins into the life.
Wise men listen and laugh, while fools talk.
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Grouchy Sinatra
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Re: “The mafia is dead”
Did anyone ever really say the mafia is dead? Is that a direct quote or just a simplification of the takes that the mob just isn't what it used to be? Even Gravano says at the end of his book that there is no way they will be able to just kill something that took nearly a century to build.
I think what's happened in the past 30 years is that the culture of organized crime and the culture of the legitimate business world met half way. You don't have to be a wiseguy to make a quick buck anymore.
I think what's happened in the past 30 years is that the culture of organized crime and the culture of the legitimate business world met half way. You don't have to be a wiseguy to make a quick buck anymore.
Glick told author Nicholas Pileggi that he expected to meet a banker-type individual, but instead, he found Alvin Baron to be a gruff, tough-talking cigar-chomping Teamster who greeted him with, “What the fuck do you want?”
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West Coast1
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Re: RE: Re: “The mafia is dead”
I am kind of in agreement but I take it another way.Lupara wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:13 pmI tend to disagree with this. During their height the mob was all over the place. Everyone in those neighborhoods knew who they were but no one dared to speak about it, because of their presence, power and influence. With no RICO and an FBI that had better things to do at the time, they could affort being out in the open. Today with television, cameras everywhere, mobile phones, social media and LE with incredible technology they actually have to be more secretive and discplined than ever in order to survive.Wiseguy wrote:When some more in the know say the mob is dead, it seems they mean in the sense of what it once was, i.e a more secretive, disciplined, Omerta-following, tight knit criminal organization at the height of its power.
I think the frequent statements of mobsters today lacking the mentality of their predecessors is overblown and exaggerated. The bosses of the 1950s would've met the same fate as those of the 1980s under the same circumstances. Gotti brought a lot of attention by the media, but the feds were already adament of taking down the mob before Gotti came to power. It was just a matter of time. If Gravano wouldn't have flipped someone else of his stature would eventually.
Guys in the know don't say it's dead. They say it's over
It's over is the proper term.
People are still doing things....
The term gangster also has another meaning these days. Gangsters seem to be referred to as current street gangs
Old school guys have no respect for current street gangs.
Trying to be politically correct. Lol.
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West Coast1
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Re: “The mafia is dead”
It's over means. This thing is probably over. Now it's
Take care of yourself and maybe there are a few left that you can trust.
Take care of yourself and maybe there are a few left that you can trust.
Re: “The mafia is dead”
Thought this thread (rather than the Jewish mob thread) would be an appropriate one to post some quotes. Particularly for bert's enlightenment. 
In recent years, the LCN has been severely crippled by law enforcement, and over the past decade has been challenged in a number of its criminal markets by other organized crime groups. Nevertheless, with respect to those criteria that best define the harm capacity of criminal organizations, it is still pre-eminent. The LCN has greater capacity to gain monopoly control over criminal markets, to use or threaten violence to maintain that control, and to corrupt law enforcement and the political system than does any of its competitors. As one eminent scholar has also pointed out, "no other criminal organization [in the United States] has controlled labor unions, organized employer cartels, operated as a rationalizing force in major industries, and functioned as a bridge between the upperworld and the underworld." It is this capacity that distinguishes the LCN from all other criminal organizations in the U.S. La Cosa Nostra’s monopoly control over various illegal markets, and its diversification into legal markets, has so far not been matched by any other criminal organization in the United States. This is so despite its having been substantially weakened over the last decade.
- UN report on La Cosa Nostra (1999)
The Mafia is a mirror image of capitalism: whatever works. That distinction still exists today. The Mafia has such a lot going for it. The Latin Americans - Colombians and Mexicans - are into one thing: narcotics. They don't have the know how to do these other kinds of crimes. Same thing with the Asian gangs, the Chinese. They may be involved in smuggling immigrants or do shake down rackets on stores and restaurants in Chinatown and Queens. But they're not involved in other things."
- Selwyn Raab (2006)
Albanian gangsters are the latest ethnic criminals to be presented by authorities as competition for the old and dying Mafiosi. Like Irish, Cuban, Russian, Chinese and Greek hoodlums before them, the Albanians are not serious competition for what the F.B.I. calls traditional organized crime, the Italian mob. There are nowhere near enough of them.
- Jerry Capeci (2007)
The Italians may still control the lion's share of illegal organized crime activity but competitors are vying for a piece of the action. Law enforcement officials say Asians, Russians, and Albanians have established their own organizations in the U.S. These groups are smaller and more disorganized than their Italian counterparts but pose their own danger. Russian and Albanian groups 'are more like criminal enterprises than organized crime,' observes agent Dennis Bolles, who heads the squad investigating them."
- CNN (2008)
Despite their weakened state, the five families of the (NY) Cosa Nostra still form the largest and most organized crime syndicate in the country. Law enforcement sources said its unlikely any group will become as successful or entrenched as the Cosa Nostra did, since the FBI learned by prosecuting Italian gangsters how to combat organized crime effectively. 'These groups are more about particular scams than taking over huge pieces of territory or whole industries,' said one law enforcement source. But they're very good at it and the're very hard to infiltrate.'"
- New York Post (2009)
Over the past three decades, Russian mobsters, Chinese gangsters, Mexican cartels and a host of other groups have all grabbed slices of the criminal activity traditionally dominated by the Mafia. But none of have come close to exerting the kind of wide-ranging influence still enjoyed by La Cosa Nostra, as the Italian-American mob is known. This is partly because of how the different gangs have organized themselves. The Mafia has a strict hierarchical structure, law enforcement officials said, and it has proven capable of finding new soldiers. Even after imprisonment of senior leadership, it survives, and in some places thrives, though most experts agree that its operations are now largely confined to its traditional bases in the Northeast and Chicago.
- Wall Street Journal (2011)
In New York, most Asian gangs remain small compared with much larger Mafia families. Members, most of whom are 15-30 years old, and tend to victimize only members of their own immigrant group. In the late 1980s, Chinese and Vietnamese gangs such as the Ghost Shadows, Born to Kill and Flying Dragons were operating in New York City's Chinatown, engaging in gambling, drug-trafficking, prostitution, robbery, extortion and other crimes, including murder. A series of racketeering prosecutions in the 1980's and 1990's (at least 15 Chinese groups were indicted) effectively dismantled the most dangerous of these groups, reducing them to smaller, less ambitious groups that were more akin to "roaming wolf packs" than true street gangs.
- Wall Street Journal (2011)
"The Five Families of La Cosa Nostra remain the most potent organized crime threat in New York and have diversified their operations, despite an apparent decline in their power and influence."
"Yet even as LCN’s influence shrinks in New York, authorities consulted by Jane’s agree that it is still the most successful model of organized crime in the city."
"Many organized crime groups - different in size, reach, ethnicity, and capabilities - are active in New York, but traditional Italian-American criminal families such as LCN enjoy a particular status built on reputation, contacts, violence, and territorial control. LCN families in New York are embedded in the economic fabric of the city, as both underworld actors and legal investors and power brokers, placing them at the top of threat assessments."
- Jane's report (2018)
In recent years, the LCN has been severely crippled by law enforcement, and over the past decade has been challenged in a number of its criminal markets by other organized crime groups. Nevertheless, with respect to those criteria that best define the harm capacity of criminal organizations, it is still pre-eminent. The LCN has greater capacity to gain monopoly control over criminal markets, to use or threaten violence to maintain that control, and to corrupt law enforcement and the political system than does any of its competitors. As one eminent scholar has also pointed out, "no other criminal organization [in the United States] has controlled labor unions, organized employer cartels, operated as a rationalizing force in major industries, and functioned as a bridge between the upperworld and the underworld." It is this capacity that distinguishes the LCN from all other criminal organizations in the U.S. La Cosa Nostra’s monopoly control over various illegal markets, and its diversification into legal markets, has so far not been matched by any other criminal organization in the United States. This is so despite its having been substantially weakened over the last decade.
- UN report on La Cosa Nostra (1999)
The Mafia is a mirror image of capitalism: whatever works. That distinction still exists today. The Mafia has such a lot going for it. The Latin Americans - Colombians and Mexicans - are into one thing: narcotics. They don't have the know how to do these other kinds of crimes. Same thing with the Asian gangs, the Chinese. They may be involved in smuggling immigrants or do shake down rackets on stores and restaurants in Chinatown and Queens. But they're not involved in other things."
- Selwyn Raab (2006)
Albanian gangsters are the latest ethnic criminals to be presented by authorities as competition for the old and dying Mafiosi. Like Irish, Cuban, Russian, Chinese and Greek hoodlums before them, the Albanians are not serious competition for what the F.B.I. calls traditional organized crime, the Italian mob. There are nowhere near enough of them.
- Jerry Capeci (2007)
The Italians may still control the lion's share of illegal organized crime activity but competitors are vying for a piece of the action. Law enforcement officials say Asians, Russians, and Albanians have established their own organizations in the U.S. These groups are smaller and more disorganized than their Italian counterparts but pose their own danger. Russian and Albanian groups 'are more like criminal enterprises than organized crime,' observes agent Dennis Bolles, who heads the squad investigating them."
- CNN (2008)
Despite their weakened state, the five families of the (NY) Cosa Nostra still form the largest and most organized crime syndicate in the country. Law enforcement sources said its unlikely any group will become as successful or entrenched as the Cosa Nostra did, since the FBI learned by prosecuting Italian gangsters how to combat organized crime effectively. 'These groups are more about particular scams than taking over huge pieces of territory or whole industries,' said one law enforcement source. But they're very good at it and the're very hard to infiltrate.'"
- New York Post (2009)
Over the past three decades, Russian mobsters, Chinese gangsters, Mexican cartels and a host of other groups have all grabbed slices of the criminal activity traditionally dominated by the Mafia. But none of have come close to exerting the kind of wide-ranging influence still enjoyed by La Cosa Nostra, as the Italian-American mob is known. This is partly because of how the different gangs have organized themselves. The Mafia has a strict hierarchical structure, law enforcement officials said, and it has proven capable of finding new soldiers. Even after imprisonment of senior leadership, it survives, and in some places thrives, though most experts agree that its operations are now largely confined to its traditional bases in the Northeast and Chicago.
- Wall Street Journal (2011)
In New York, most Asian gangs remain small compared with much larger Mafia families. Members, most of whom are 15-30 years old, and tend to victimize only members of their own immigrant group. In the late 1980s, Chinese and Vietnamese gangs such as the Ghost Shadows, Born to Kill and Flying Dragons were operating in New York City's Chinatown, engaging in gambling, drug-trafficking, prostitution, robbery, extortion and other crimes, including murder. A series of racketeering prosecutions in the 1980's and 1990's (at least 15 Chinese groups were indicted) effectively dismantled the most dangerous of these groups, reducing them to smaller, less ambitious groups that were more akin to "roaming wolf packs" than true street gangs.
- Wall Street Journal (2011)
"The Five Families of La Cosa Nostra remain the most potent organized crime threat in New York and have diversified their operations, despite an apparent decline in their power and influence."
"Yet even as LCN’s influence shrinks in New York, authorities consulted by Jane’s agree that it is still the most successful model of organized crime in the city."
"Many organized crime groups - different in size, reach, ethnicity, and capabilities - are active in New York, but traditional Italian-American criminal families such as LCN enjoy a particular status built on reputation, contacts, violence, and territorial control. LCN families in New York are embedded in the economic fabric of the city, as both underworld actors and legal investors and power brokers, placing them at the top of threat assessments."
- Jane's report (2018)
Last edited by Wiseguy on Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
All roads lead to New York.
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maxiestern11
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Re: “The mafia is dead”
Wiseguy..... EXCELLENT post! Clearly explains the state of affairs of OC across the board. Very well put together my friend. My compliments! I think that should end any argument or controversy previously debated! .... and btw: it makes perfect sense, and it is from “multiple”
reliable sources.
reliable sources.
Re: “The mafia is dead”
Wiseguy said:
"Thought this thread (rather than the Jewish mob thread) would be an appropriate one to post some quotes. Particularly for bert's enlightenment. "
The day I need enlightenment from you is the day I need lessons on how to be a dork. You are getting a bit obsessed over me.
"Thought this thread (rather than the Jewish mob thread) would be an appropriate one to post some quotes. Particularly for bert's enlightenment.
"The day I need enlightenment from you is the day I need lessons on how to be a dork. You are getting a bit obsessed over me.
Re: “The mafia is dead”
bert wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2019 2:52 pm Wiseguy said:
"Thought this thread (rather than the Jewish mob thread) would be an appropriate one to post some quotes. Particularly for bert's enlightenment.
The day I need enlightenment from you is the day I need lessons on how to be a dork. You are getting a bit obsessed over me.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
All roads lead to New York.
Re: “The mafia is dead”
I bet you're called pretty a lot. Pretty stupid, pretty annoying, pretty retarded........Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2019 3:42 pml-16850-when-youre-winning-the-argument-with-facts-and-they-start-attacking-you-personally-instead-of-addressing-the-topic.jpgbert wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2019 2:52 pm Wiseguy said:
"Thought this thread (rather than the Jewish mob thread) would be an appropriate one to post some quotes. Particularly for bert's enlightenment.
The day I need enlightenment from you is the day I need lessons on how to be a dork. You are getting a bit obsessed over me.
Re: “The mafia is dead”
It figures you would use a pic of Jim Carrey. The two of you are very much alike. Can't get facts straight, head stuck up ass, are you Jim Carrey?Wiseguy wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2019 3:42 pml-16850-when-youre-winning-the-argument-with-facts-and-they-start-attacking-you-personally-instead-of-addressing-the-topic.jpgbert wrote: ↑Sun Jun 09, 2019 2:52 pm Wiseguy said:
"Thought this thread (rather than the Jewish mob thread) would be an appropriate one to post some quotes. Particularly for bert's enlightenment.
The day I need enlightenment from you is the day I need lessons on how to be a dork. You are getting a bit obsessed over me.
Re: “The mafia is dead”
Are you Dan?
(You're still avoiding the issue by the way. Stubborn SOB, aren't you?)
All roads lead to New York.
Re: “The mafia is dead”
Re: “The mafia is dead”
I guess you lost track too.
Pull your head out of your ass, slowly take a look around, and try to focus.