Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by JeremyTheJew »

eboli wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:20 am War of the Godfathers is up there with The Godfather sequel books by Winegardner. I never undestood why Roemer used real life figures in a fictional universe. I'll tell you this, after reading it for the first time, my estimation about Bill Roemer as a writer fucking plummeted. :D
You know what was good tho?? THE family Corleone by Ed Falco. Its the prequel to GF. Excellebt book. Follows along w the Castellmarese War. Very good, no Nick Geraci.

Yes War of GodfThers is a asshole being in the true crime section...
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Slick »

Rocco wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:00 am
Frank wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:43 pm
Pogo The Clown wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:57 pm Vincent "Elmo" Amarante was the Bonanno member. If I remember right he ran a club or strip club in Chicago.


Pogo
Yes that is the guy. I remember he ran a club. I just ran across his age and it appears he was young at that time. At the time I was thinking he was an older member that had family in Chicago. Without a big incident about it, I figured it must have been a favor. Yes there was bad blood between the Families, due to Joe Bonanno planting his flag all over the place. I believe Giancana was on the hit list of Bonanno's planned hit of Commission members. There is an incident with a cheese company in Chicago and Wisconsin of Bonanno being a partner or owner of. I'm interested about the war about Vegas you mentioned, was anyone killed? Also this Elmo guy must of had permission, because Chicago was still watching people in that time period, unless they thought it just wasn't worth the trouble.
There must be some agreement or relationship between the bonnanos and the outfit. bonnanos soldier vinny faraci worked with joey the clowns brother on a daily basis for many yrs at the crazy horse in vegas. I would imagine elmo being in Chicago was part of that connection.
Can't remember where I read it, but when Joey the Clown was in prison in the 80's and early 90's, one of his close friends was and old school east coast wiseguy. It did not say who, but with Vinny working with his brother Rocco, I always guessed it was Vinny's father or some other Bonanno.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Adam »

JeremyTheJew wrote: Sat Nov 17, 2018 9:51 pm
eboli wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:20 am War of the Godfathers is up there with The Godfather sequel books by Winegardner. I never undestood why Roemer used real life figures in a fictional universe. I'll tell you this, after reading it for the first time, my estimation about Bill Roemer as a writer fucking plummeted. :D
You know what was good tho?? THE family Corleone by Ed Falco. Its the prequel to GF. Excellebt book. Follows along w the Castellmarese War. Very good, no Nick Geraci.

Yes War of GodfThers is a asshole being in the true crime section...
Well we all like different things, but I thought that one was pretty crappy too. Hagen sleeping with Brasi's girlfriend. Thought that was weak. Brasi's whole character in that book is different from his character in The Godfather. Vito ordering Toms dad's murder. There's other stuff I didn't care for.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Snakes »

Slick wrote: Sun Nov 18, 2018 3:56 pm
Rocco wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:00 am
Frank wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:43 pm
Pogo The Clown wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:57 pm Vincent "Elmo" Amarante was the Bonanno member. If I remember right he ran a club or strip club in Chicago.


Pogo
Yes that is the guy. I remember he ran a club. I just ran across his age and it appears he was young at that time. At the time I was thinking he was an older member that had family in Chicago. Without a big incident about it, I figured it must have been a favor. Yes there was bad blood between the Families, due to Joe Bonanno planting his flag all over the place. I believe Giancana was on the hit list of Bonanno's planned hit of Commission members. There is an incident with a cheese company in Chicago and Wisconsin of Bonanno being a partner or owner of. I'm interested about the war about Vegas you mentioned, was anyone killed? Also this Elmo guy must of had permission, because Chicago was still watching people in that time period, unless they thought it just wasn't worth the trouble.
There must be some agreement or relationship between the bonnanos and the outfit. bonnanos soldier vinny faraci worked with joey the clowns brother on a daily basis for many yrs at the crazy horse in vegas. I would imagine elmo being in Chicago was part of that connection.
Can't remember where I read it, but when Joey the Clown was in prison in the 80's and early 90's, one of his close friends was and old school east coast wiseguy. It did not say who, but with Vinny working with his brother Rocco, I always guessed it was Vinny's father or some other Bonanno.
I thought it was a Colombo, but I may be thinking of a guy that Frank Sr was with.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by JCB1977 »

Wiseguy wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:03 pm
Frank wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:43 pm
Pogo The Clown wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:57 pm Vincent "Elmo" Amarante was the Bonanno member. If I remember right he ran a club or strip club in Chicago.


Pogo
Yes that is the guy. I remember he ran a club. I just ran across his age and it appears he was young at that time. At the time I was thinking he was an older member that had family in Chicago. Without a big incident about it, I figured it must have been a favor. Yes there was bad blood between the Families, due to Joe Bonanno planting his flag all over the place. I believe Giancana was on the hit list of Bonanno's planned hit of Commission members. There is an incident with a cheese company in Chicago and Wisconsin of Bonanno being a partner or owner of. I'm interested about the war about Vegas you mentioned, was anyone killed? Also this Elmo guy must of had permission, because Chicago was still watching people in that time period, unless they thought it just wasn't worth the trouble.
It was a strip club called Arnie's. 20 girls were also arrested at the time on charges of prostitution.

Hardly unheard of but, considering a strip club can be a technically legit, all cash place for the mob to skim and/or launder money, you'd think they wouldnt want to jeopardize it with the girls turning tricks on the side.
Adam wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 4:59 pm
Pogo The Clown wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:44 pm
Frank wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:36 pm Not Pogo , the Clown Lombardo and it was nearly 20 years ago

Willy is joking. :mrgreen:

Villain wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:18 pm It seems that Chicago and the Bonannos had a long standing beef. They even had some sort of conflict in Arizona

They even went to war over Las Vegas back in the mid 1980s.


Pogo
Ha. I remember back in the day people having to explain to new people over and over again how War of the Godfathers was fiction. And weirdly written fiction even for Roemer. Gotta love him having the boss of Chicago doing a hit on The Strip to take out Dalitz. Never got why he had Zerilli alive almost a decade after he was dead. And Bonanno actually running the Bonanno family in the 80s. Just a really weird confusing book. Like the diary of a madman.
The best part is Bonanno and Accardo meeting with Gotti in New York over the issue. :lol:
Turning tricks!!! :lol: I haven’t heard it put like that in a long time! Thanks for the chuckle WG, my grandmother used to say that! Great memories. I never understood what it meant considering the “tricks” were not really “tricks” but rather acts of depravity by an insecure runaway.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by DPG »

JeremyTheJew wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 11:24 pm The thing about War of the Godfathers is that in libraries its categorozed in the True Crime section (364.01 is the # section in libraries everywhere for true crime)
I lived in this section in college.
I get it....first rule of fight club.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by DPG »

Adam wrote: Sun Nov 18, 2018 5:28 pm
JeremyTheJew wrote: Sat Nov 17, 2018 9:51 pm
eboli wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:20 am War of the Godfathers is up there with The Godfather sequel books by Winegardner. I never undestood why Roemer used real life figures in a fictional universe. I'll tell you this, after reading it for the first time, my estimation about Bill Roemer as a writer fucking plummeted. :D
You know what was good tho?? THE family Corleone by Ed Falco. Its the prequel to GF. Excellebt book. Follows along w the Castellmarese War. Very good, no Nick Geraci.

Yes War of GodfThers is a asshole being in the true crime section...
Well we all like different things, but I thought that one was pretty crappy too. Hagen sleeping with Brasi's girlfriend. Thought that was weak. Brasi's whole character in that book is different from his character in The Godfather. Vito ordering Toms dad's murder. There's other stuff I didn't care for.
I also was not a fan. Luca having a social club where he and his crew stay up playing cards all night? Luca had no crew.
I get it....first rule of fight club.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by JeremyTheJew »

JCB1977 wrote: Sun Nov 18, 2018 9:48 pm
Wiseguy wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:03 pm
Frank wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:43 pm
Pogo The Clown wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:57 pm Vincent "Elmo" Amarante was the Bonanno member. If I remember right he ran a club or strip club in Chicago.


Pogo
Yes that is the guy. I remember he ran a club. I just ran across his age and it appears he was young at that time. At the time I was thinking he was an older member that had family in Chicago. Without a big incident about it, I figured it must have been a favor. Yes there was bad blood between the Families, due to Joe Bonanno planting his flag all over the place. I believe Giancana was on the hit list of Bonanno's planned hit of Commission members. There is an incident with a cheese company in Chicago and Wisconsin of Bonanno being a partner or owner of. I'm interested about the war about Vegas you mentioned, was anyone killed? Also this Elmo guy must of had permission, because Chicago was still watching people in that time period, unless they thought it just wasn't worth the trouble.
It was a strip club called Arnie's. 20 girls were also arrested at the time on charges of prostitution.

Hardly unheard of but, considering a strip club can be a technically legit, all cash place for the mob to skim and/or launder money, you'd think they wouldnt want to jeopardize it with the girls turning tricks on the side.
Adam wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 4:59 pm
Pogo The Clown wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:44 pm
Frank wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:36 pm Not Pogo , the Clown Lombardo and it was nearly 20 years ago

Willy is joking. :mrgreen:

Villain wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:18 pm It seems that Chicago and the Bonannos had a long standing beef. They even had some sort of conflict in Arizona

They even went to war over Las Vegas back in the mid 1980s.


Pogo
Ha. I remember back in the day people having to explain to new people over and over again how War of the Godfathers was fiction. And weirdly written fiction even for Roemer. Gotta love him having the boss of Chicago doing a hit on The Strip to take out Dalitz. Never got why he had Zerilli alive almost a decade after he was dead. And Bonanno actually running the Bonanno family in the 80s. Just a really weird confusing book. Like the diary of a madman.
The best part is Bonanno and Accardo meeting with Gotti in New York over the issue. :lol:
Turning tricks!!! :lol: I haven’t heard it put like that in a long time! Thanks for the chuckle WG, my grandmother used to say that! Great memories. I never understood what it meant considering the “tricks” were not really “tricks” but rather acts of depravity by an insecure runaway.
We still say turnin tricks in detroit. Turnin tricks for treats.
HANG IT UP NICKY. ITS TIME TO GO HOME.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Pogo The Clown »

DPG wrote: Mon Nov 19, 2018 6:51 am I also was not a fan. Luca having a social club where he and his crew stay up playing cards all night? Luca had no crew.

I haven't read this book but in The Godfather it is mentioned that Luca liked to spend his nights playing cards with the boys. I believe from the Sonny Crew.


Pogo
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by SILENT PARTNERZ »

Slick wrote: Sun Nov 18, 2018 3:56 pm
Rocco wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:00 am
Frank wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:43 pm
Pogo The Clown wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:57 pm Vincent "Elmo" Amarante was the Bonanno member. If I remember right he ran a club or strip club in Chicago.


Pogo
Yes that is the guy. I remember he ran a club. I just ran across his age and it appears he was young at that time. At the time I was thinking he was an older member that had family in Chicago. Without a big incident about it, I figured it must have been a favor. Yes there was bad blood between the Families, due to Joe Bonanno planting his flag all over the place. I believe Giancana was on the hit list of Bonanno's planned hit of Commission members. There is an incident with a cheese company in Chicago and Wisconsin of Bonanno being a partner or owner of. I'm interested about the war about Vegas you mentioned, was anyone killed? Also this Elmo guy must of had permission, because Chicago was still watching people in that time period, unless they thought it just wasn't worth the trouble.
There must be some agreement or relationship between the bonnanos and the outfit. bonnanos soldier vinny faraci worked with joey the clowns brother on a daily basis for many yrs at the crazy horse in vegas. I would imagine elmo being in Chicago was part of that connection.
Can't remember where I read it, but when Joey the Clown was in prison in the 80's and early 90's, one of his close friends was and old school east coast wiseguy. It did not say who, but with Vinny working with his brother Rocco, I always guessed it was Vinny's father or some other Bonanno.
Here is an article that delves into the cheese business mentioned:
In March of 1980, after a two year investigation, the Pennsylvania Crime Commission released a Report of the Study of Organized Crime’s Infiltration of the Pizza and Cheese Industry. Wisconsin’s Grande Cheese Co of Fond du Lac was referenced several times.


Grande Cheese Co., mentioned in the body of the report in reference to Joseph Bonanno, Roma Foods and the Falcone Brothers, was born out of a Chicago gang war in 1939. During the first few years of its operation, at least five men, including the owner, were killed. Chicago crime boss Ross Prio eventually gained control of the company. Over the years Grande has been owned by or associated with numerous organized crime figures.


In the 1950's the ownership of Grande Cheese passed from Ross Prio to the DiBella family, John and his sister, Rose. John DiBella became corporate President in 1959. John had ties
to Milwaukee crime boss John Alioto, who was Frank Balistrieri’s father-in-law. John Alioto was the Milwaukee mob boss from 1952 until 1961 when he handed over control to his son-in-law, Frank Balistrieri. DiBella’s sister Rose took over her brother's stock after his death in 1964, and later sold her interest to the Candela and Gaglio families. The Gaglio family owned Ontario Importing, founded by the family patriarch, Vito Gaglio, in the mid-1960's.


The actual control of the cheese and pizza business began with no less a figure than Joseph Bonanno, Sr. Bonanno, living at that time in Tucson, Arizona, was regarded as one of the most powerful leaders of Organized Crime in America. Bonanno initiated a conspiracy to control the specialty cheese business in the United States in the early 1940's and even in 1980, he and his associates controlled the activities of some of the largest and most prosperous specialty cheese companies. Bonanno had direct ties to Grande Cheese of Wisconsin; through it to Grande's exclusive distributor in the Pennsylvania area, Roma Foods of South Plainfield, New Jersey; and through the distributor to hundreds of retail pizza shops which were financed and controlled by the organization in Pennsylvania and New Jersey.


The Falcone brothers of Brooklyn, New York--formerly associated with Bonanno-tied Grande Cheese and partners with a Grande officer in other Wisconsin cheese companies--built and operated for a decade a network of fraudulent "paper companies" designed to produce millions of dollars for the Falcones only to collapse financially when challenged by claims of their legitimate business victims.


The Pennsylvania Crime Commission investigation had determined that the Falcones and Thomas Gambino drove another company into bankruptcy in 1976. In December of 1975, the
Falcones and Gambino bought 70% of the stock of the previously family-owned Badger State' Cheese Company in Luxemburg, Wisconsin. Eight months later, Badger State Cheese collapsed in disarray with $1.3-million in debts. The Falcones and Gambino had taken over Badger and arranged that Capitol Cheese of Brooklyn, New York be the major customer and distributor for Badger. Capitol Cheese of Brooklyn was operated by Joseph and Thomas Gambino. Joseph Gambino was a leader in the Carlo Gambino crime organization.
Capitol Cheese directed delivery of Badger State cheese to Capitol's customers, collected payment from the customers, and then the cash disappeared. When Capitol Cheese owed Badger State Cheese $560,000, Badger State closed down and the Wisconsin State Department of Agriculture placed the company in trusteeship. Capitol Cheese, the Gambino business in Brooklyn, afterward, went out of business.


Also involved in the Crime Commission Investigation:
F & A CHEESE of Grand Rapids, Michigan, owned by Francesco and Angelo Terranova. The Company was started with a loan from the uncle of the Terranovas, John DiBella of Grande Cheese. F & A Cheese had another office in Upland, California. Raffael Quasarano, a
member of the Joseph Zerilli criminal organization of Detroit, and Peter Vitale were indicted by a federal grand jury in Detroit in November, 1979 for allegedly extorting $270,000 from the Terranovas. They were also charged with mail fraud, tax fraud and racketeering. According to the indictment Quasarano and Vitale used "fear of economic loss" and threats of "force and violence" to gain control of an F & A subsidiary, Rogersville Cheese Factory, Inc. in Wisconsin.

According to a report printed in the Milwaukee Sentinel on Aug. 7, 1980, the owner of a Wisconsin cheese factory (Rodgersville Cheese Factory) allegedly taken over by organized crime bosses from Detroit was told by either Quasarano or Vitale in 1974, “The big fish is swallowing the little fish, and you're lucky your legs aren't broken, according to Federal Court testimony that day. Both eventually pled guilty and were sentenced to prison terms of four years each in 1981.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Slick »

Found it Snakes. This doesn't say what family the guy from New York was. Maybe you seen more info somewhere else that stated he was a Columbo

https://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Maga ... -Lost-Don/


So where is the Clown?

“My suggestion to my former associates at the FBI was that he’s down with Frankie [Schweihs] in a retirement community in Florida,” says Wagner. “Who’s going to notice two old men?”


“The most obvious place to me where somebody should be looking is down in Curaçao,” says Wacks.

“Tijuana,” says Cooley.

“Sicily,” says O’Rourke. “His best friend in prison was an old-time Mafia boss from New York, who had a brother and some other relatives in Sicily. The boss would brag that he’d take care of his friend Joey if he ever got in trouble.”
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Snakes »

If that's the case, it would probably be either Bonanno or Gambino, as they have the most Sicilians out of the Five Families.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Moscone65 »

True. Lombardo is from Bari, still southern Italy but quite a bit different than sicily. Maybe he would have more protection in Sicily and be noticed less, who knows where he was before.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Frank »

Moscone65 wrote: Tue Nov 20, 2018 7:12 am True. Lombardo is from Bari, still southern Italy but quite a bit different than sicily. Maybe he would have more protection in Sicily and be noticed less, who knows where he was before.
I don't believe he left Chicago when he went into hiding. He certainly didn't travel from Italy to Chicago to see a dentist.
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Re: Did The Clown say NY wanted to take over Chicago?

Post by Frank »

Slick wrote: Mon Nov 19, 2018 5:48 pm Found it Snakes. This doesn't say what family the guy from New York was. Maybe you seen more info somewhere else that stated he was a Columbo

https://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Maga ... -Lost-Don/


So where is the Clown?

“My suggestion to my former associates at the FBI was that he’s down with Frankie [Schweihs] in a retirement community in Florida,” says Wagner. “Who’s going to notice two old men?”


“The most obvious place to me where somebody should be looking is down in Curaçao,” says Wacks.

“Tijuana,” says Cooley.

“Sicily,” says O’Rourke. “His best friend in prison was an old-time Mafia boss from New York, who had a brother and some other relatives in Sicily. The boss would brag that he’d take care of his friend Joey if he ever got in trouble.”
I know for sure I read something about this prison friend of Lombardo's. Can't remember if it was the same article. I think I might have read who this person was. I'll have to look for it. Another interesting thing is about LE telling Lombardo that his life could be in danger. What about Marcello's life being in danger, he had not been on the streets to long after doing about 10 years. It just doesn't sound correct. You don't just order a hit on Joey Lombardo and don't go threw with it. Besides that all indications are that Lombardo was in the administration at the time and could have possibly outranked Marcello. I think LE was just trying to turn Joey by saying this.
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