Double Affiliation

[Frank]

It appears that with Galante going up to Canada in the 1950s, obviously a Bonanno man, to me it appears that the Cotroni we're a separate group. It would seem they were not made in any U.S. LCN family at least to the time Bill Bonanno went up there. If they were already LCN members, who made them? Or were the Camorra or N'drangheta members? I was under they impression that Cotroni and his group were Bonanno going back to the 1950s.

I think the group already existed in some form but was organized and absorbed into the Bonannos by Galante in the 50s. Joe Bonanno was held in the highest esteem by the people in Montreal. When he was incarcerated there for a short time he was treated as a celebrity. Other inmates called him 'le grand boss' and offered to work for him. So it was pretty clear to everyone who was ultimately in charge of Montreal. The Bonannos back then were Mafia royalty.

I think because Cotroni's "gang" existed in Montreal before Galante's arrival, they were allowed to remain fairly autonomous and were basically a small family in their own right, but it was to their advantage to be attached to the Bonannos in New York.

Ok thanks. But why the mysterious talk of Maggadino? Was he just unaware if the Bonanno activity in Montreal? What prompted Bill Bonanno's visit to refresh Cotroni's memory?

[Lupara]

It appears that with Galante going up to Canada in the 1950s, obviously a Bonanno man, to me it appears that the Cotroni we're a separate group. It would seem they were not made in any U.S. LCN family at least to the time Bill Bonanno went up there. If they were already LCN members, who made them? Or were the Camorra or N'drangheta members? I was under they impression that Cotroni and his group were Bonanno going back to the 1950s.

I think the group already existed in some form but was organized and absorbed into the Bonannos by Galante in the 50s. Joe Bonanno was held in the highest esteem by the people in Montreal. When he was incarcerated there for a short time he was treated as a celebrity. Other inmates called him 'le grand boss' and offered to work for him. So it was pretty clear to everyone who was ultimately in charge of Montreal. The Bonannos back then were Mafia royalty.

I think because Cotroni's "gang" existed in Montreal before Galante's arrival, they were allowed to remain fairly autonomous and were basically a small family in their own right, but it was to their advantage to be attached to the Bonannos in New York.

Ok thanks. But why the mysterious talk of Maggadino? Was he just unaware if the Bonanno activity in Montreal? What prompted Bill Bonanno's visit to refresh Cotroni's memory?

Because Magaddino, as jealous as he was of his younger cousin, felt that Canada as a whole belonged to him. And the Cotronis, just like the other crews in New York, had the opportunity to side against the Bonanno faction. Bill went there to make sure they remained loyal to his father which they did.

[Frank]

It appears that with Galante going up to Canada in the 1950s, obviously a Bonanno man, to me it appears that the Cotroni we're a separate group. It would seem they were not made in any U.S. LCN family at least to the time Bill Bonanno went up there. If they were already LCN members, who made them? Or were the Camorra or N'drangheta members? I was under they impression that Cotroni and his group were Bonanno going back to the 1950s.

I think the group already existed in some form but was organized and absorbed into the Bonannos by Galante in the 50s. Joe Bonanno was held in the highest esteem by the people in Montreal. When he was incarcerated there for a short time he was treated as a celebrity. Other inmates called him 'le grand boss' and offered to work for him. So it was pretty clear to everyone who was ultimately in charge of Montreal. The Bonannos back then were Mafia royalty.

I think because Cotroni's "gang" existed in Montreal before Galante's arrival, they were allowed to remain fairly autonomous and were basically a small family in their own right, but it was to their advantage to be attached to the Bonannos in New York.

Ok thanks. But why the mysterious talk of Maggadino? Was he just unaware if the Bonanno activity in Montreal? What prompted Bill Bonanno's visit to refresh Cotroni's memory?

Because Magaddino, as jealous as he was of his younger cousin, felt that Canada as a whole belonged to him. And the Cotronis, just like the other crews in New York, had the opportunity to side against the Bonanno faction. Bill went there to make sure they remained loyal to his father which they did.

Ok that makes sense with what was going on with the Bonnano at the time. Also Maggadino always seemed to be undermining his cousin at this time. It's funny we don't read too much of that in previous decades, of his jealousy.

[NickleCity]

It appears that with Galante going up to Canada in the 1950s, obviously a Bonanno man, to me it appears that the Cotroni we're a separate group. It would seem they were not made in any U.S. LCN family at least to the time Bill Bonanno went up there. If they were already LCN members, who made them? Or were the Camorra or N'drangheta members? I was under they impression that Cotroni and his group were Bonanno going back to the 1950s.

I think the group already existed in some form but was organized and absorbed into the Bonannos by Galante in the 50s. Joe Bonanno was held in the highest esteem by the people in Montreal. When he was incarcerated there for a short time he was treated as a celebrity. Other inmates called him 'le grand boss' and offered to work for him. So it was pretty clear to everyone who was ultimately in charge of Montreal. The Bonannos back then were Mafia royalty.

I think because Cotroni's "gang" existed in Montreal before Galante's arrival, they were allowed to remain fairly autonomous and were basically a small family in their own right, but it was to their advantage to be attached to the Bonannos in New York.

Ok thanks. But why the mysterious talk of Maggadino? Was he just unaware if the Bonanno activity in Montreal? What prompted Bill Bonanno's visit to refresh Cotroni's memory?

Because Magaddino, as jealous as he was of his younger cousin, felt that Canada as a whole belonged to him. And the Cotronis, just like the other crews in New York, had the opportunity to side against the Bonanno faction. Bill went there to make sure they remained loyal to his father which they did.

Ok that makes sense with what was going on with the Bonnano at the time. Also Maggadino always seemed to be undermining his cousin at this time. It's funny we don't read too much of that in previous decades, of his jealousy.

Lupara definitely explains the majority view on this matter well. Montreal was likely given to Bonanno early on at the first commission meeting or shortly thereafter. But that doesn't mean Magaddino liked it and wasn't working to undermine that early decision. Like I mentioned earlier their is always an able being worked. Therefore, I don't think organizational lines can be tied up so neatly. We do it to try to simply understand, but the more we understand the more we realize things are more complicated than they originally appeared. Here is a quote from the book Iced: The Story of Organized Crime in Canada:

In 1963, Paolo left Ontario for Montreal, supposedly on the orders of Luppino so he would not clash with another ambitious Hamilton mobster named John Papalia. Accounts differ on whether Magaddino approved of Violi coming within the orbit of the Montreal mafia and, by extension, the Bonanno Family. While it is possible that Magaddino may have felt betrayed by the move — and was reportedly persuaded to spare Paolo’s life by Luppino — some also believe that he backed the decision to send Violi to Quebec and may even have instigated it to provide him with a toehold in the province. When he arrived in Montreal, Paolo opened Violi Pizzeria in the city’s north end, which he used as his base to extort members of the Italian community of St. Leonard.

Schneider, Stephen. Iced: The Story of Organized Crime in Canada (Kindle Locations 8242-8247). HarperCollins Publishers. Kindle Edition.

I think we have to be careful to dismiss the idea that Paolo Violi who married into the Luppino family wouldn't help his Father-in-Law ingratiate himself with Magaddino in the '60's.

But at the same time, Violi was eying his own cause and advancement at the expense of Magaddino and Bonanno:

While Paolo would pay his respects to both Cotroni and Luppino, as well as Bonanno and Magaddino, he was playing a dangerous game. According to Peter Edwards, “Paolo Violi clearly had his own ideas. He privately told Luppino that the Cotroni family should strike out on its own and should be subordinate to neither the Magaddino nor the Bonanno family.

Schneider, Stephen. Iced: The Story of Organized Crime in Canada (Kindle Locations 8255-8257). HarperCollins Publishers. Kindle Edition.

I think this is all important as we consider double affiliation. It is especially important as one attempts to identify where Paolo's grandkids Dominico and Giuseppe Violi fit into the Bonanno making ceremony and the Todaro/Buffalo family (or family remnant) arrests mentioned in the Otremens Operation.

One thing I think is clear: Organizational lines, loyalties, and working relationships between groups are not clear, ever evolving, and constantly change.

[CabriniGreen]

I want to get your guys opinion of a few other suspected Double Affiliates...

1. Rosario Naimo
2. This Paul Semplice and the Toronto based crime family
3. Frank Coppola
4. The Gambino clan- specifically, Francesco, John, and Rosario....

[NickleCity]

As I read more and more about Buffalo it seems there are many people who are part Ndrangheta clan in Hamilton/Toronto but made in Buffalo. Iced mentions several gangsters like this and really shows how closely Buffalo worked with the Calabrians in Canada going back to the '30's when Magaddino was starting out and taking over the gangs/clans in Southern Ontario.

[NickleCity]

Is Stephan Schneider or is Lee Coppola asserting the Violi’s were under the Magaddino/Buffalo Crime Family banner? I can’t tell if that is Schneider’s thoughts between the dashes.

Coppola, who was the dean of the journalism school at St. Bonaventure University in New York State when he made these comments, was adamant that “for all intents and purposes, the Buffalo mob —as it once was when Magaddino actually ruled that part of Toronto and the Papalias and Violis were under him —is all diminished and has been diminishing over the last couple of decades to a point now where there is no leadership, there is no structure, and there certainly is not power.”

This is from Schneider’s book Iced: The Story of Organized Crime in Canada.

[Frank]

I want to get your guys opinion of a few other suspected Double Affiliates...

1. Rosario Naimo
2. This Paul Semplice and the Toronto based crime family
3. Frank Coppola
4. The Gambino clan- specifically, Francesco, John, and Rosario....

John and Joe Gambino, we're made in the Gambino Family. Rosario Gambino was made in Sicily

[CabriniGreen]

@Frank

Hence my question....

Were they loyal to the Gambino family FIRST?
OR, were they representing the palermo Families' interest in NY, and secondly, was Gambino membership a mechanism to facilitate the drug trade, to make it easier for mafiosi to business unobstructed?

[CabriniGreen]

Also Francesco wasnt a made Gambino, but he was " Head of the Sicilian mafia" in NY. Yet he MUST have worked under the Gambino banner, but his business HAD to have tethered him to Sicily. Again allegiances....

Also, I think if there was no Iron Tower, John and Joe possibly arnt made with the Gambinos, they stick with Palermo, Riina as well I think factored in heavily...

[Frank]

@Frank

Hence my question....

Were they loyal to the Gambino family FIRST?
OR, were they representing the palermo Families' interest in NY, and secondly, was Gambino membership a mechanism to facilitate the drug trade, to make it easier for mafiosi to business unobstructed?

[Frank]

Yes I get what you are saying now. The fact that the 2 Gambino Bros were made in the Gambino Family and other Gambino zips were made members of Sicily brings up the question of why. I would assume that once John and Joe we're inducted in the Gambino Family, there allegiance was to the Gambino Family. It would be interesting to find more info of the begining of the arrangement or what ever it was called they had with Carlo.

[cavita]

Francesco "Three Fingers" Coppola and Vincenzo Troia get my vote for double affiliation.

[CabriniGreen]

Vincenzo Troia.... You have me intrigued.... If you feel like it, please add more...

[cavita]

Vincenzo Troia.... You have me intrigued.... If you feel like it, please add more...

I say Troia because he was made a member in the SGI family, seemed to transfer to New York before relocating to Madison, Wisconsin briefly. Then worked under the Rockford LCN boss for a time. There was speculation on the board here he could very well have been the first boss of the Springfield, Illinois family before aligning with Salvatore Maranzano in NY before his murder in NJ. The guy got around for sure.