Moe Dalitz and the Cleveland Syndicate

[dack2001]

100% Fratianno's book has some detail gaps in his early days but he tells these two stories like they happened yesterday. He probably told that story 100 times over drinks to 100 guys over the years. The point is simple, no matter how much money and power these two guys thought they had what could they do but run to Meyer and what could he do but run to New York to Tommy Brown. Story rings quite true to the documented record regarding the power of Cosa Nostra over other crime groups, especially during that time.

[JCB1977]

Very plausible...but Moe was responsible for making some bosses wealthy beyond their wildest dreams and some Italians are strictly money motivated, he could have had protection. I agree that Italians had more power but Jews had even better political and big time corporate allies because they were good at making $$$ for other people. Moe was one of the most powerful men in America in his prime. He did what many others couldn’t do...parlay his illegal money into an empire in the legitimate casino business.

[Confederate]

I do not know much about him, but I was interested, was he any better than Lansky or Rothstein?

Well he died of old age(better than Rothstein) and was a well respected legitimate millionaire (better than Lansky)

He was worth”hundreds of millions” by the time he died “on paper.”

I'm glad you said "on paper" because he had many partners and when he died I'll bet his family saw very little of it because the partners simply took it over. Maybe I'm wrong but that's what happened with Lansky. His PERSONAL net worth was way less than what the exaggerated media said it was at the time of his death.

[JCB1977]

I do not know much about him, but I was interested, was he any better than Lansky or Rothstein?

Well he died of old age(better than Rothstein) and was a well respected legitimate millionaire (better than Lansky)

He was worth”hundreds of millions” by the time he died “on paper.”

I'm glad you said "on paper" because he had many partners and when he died I'll bet his family saw very little of it because the partners simply took it over. Maybe I'm wrong but that's what happened with Lansky. His PERSONAL net worth was way less than what the exaggerated media said it was at the time of his death.

Lansky couldn’t sniff what Moe was worth. Moe made more money in a day than Lansky made in 2 weeks. His family was left a $110 million estate plus future proceeds.

[Eline2015]

It seems that he succeeded in creating some legit picture of himself but still, his whole life he ducked the cameras and avoided touchy questions by acting deaf or a little bit hostile. Still I think that he was quite aware regarding the general population knowing about his real nature and it bothered him a lot since the whole situation looked like doing makeup and putting perfume on a pig which recently got out of the stinky shit and mud. I wonder how many times occurred to him when real wealthy and powerful snobs told him in his face that he was a crook while sitting on the same table and giving donations to those same snobs....the definition of pure shame lol

Check you pm

[phatmatress777]

100% Fratianno's book has some detail gaps in his early days but he tells these two stories like they happened yesterday. He probably told that story 100 times over drinks to 100 guys over the years. The point is simple, no matter how much money and power these two guys thought they had what could they do but run to Meyer and what could he do but run to New York to Tommy Brown. Story rings quite true to the documented record regarding the power of Cosa Nostra over other crime groups, especially during that time.

Jimmy the weasel was one of the more entertaining snitches. Very charismatic. You can tell he was a pure street guy.

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[Chaps]

If anyone wants to read a good book about Moe Dalitz and his realationship with Cleveland they should read The Silent Syndicate by Hank Messick. A great piece of journalism and very hard to find. The copy I have was purchased through a book search years ago. It’s worth reading.

[DPG]

Lansky lost his load in Cuba

[JCB1977]

100% Fratianno's book has some detail gaps in his early days but he tells these two stories like they happened yesterday. He probably told that story 100 times over drinks to 100 guys over the years. The point is simple, no matter how much money and power these two guys thought they had what could they do but run to Meyer and what could he do but run to New York to Tommy Brown. Story rings quite true to the documented record regarding the power of Cosa Nostra over other crime groups, especially during that time.

Jimmy the weasel was one of the more entertaining snitches. Very charismatic. You can tell he was a pure street guy.

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I agree

[JCB1977]

If anyone wants to read a good book about Moe Dalitz and his realationship with Cleveland they should read The Silent Syndicate by Hank Messick. A great piece of journalism and very hard to find. The copy I have was purchased through a book search years ago. It’s worth reading.

I’ve read it, you’re right.

[JCB1977]

In 1989 when Moe died, in his will, he left $1.3 million to 14 different non-profit organizations. In 1981, Forbes magazine put him on the 400 wealthiest Americans with a net worth of $110 million. Besides the charities/non profit organizations, the rest of his estate was left to his only child/daughter Suzanne.

[Confederate]

In 1989 when Moe died, in his will, he left $1.3 million to 14 different non-profit organizations. In 1981, Forbes magazine put him on the 400 wealthiest Americans with a net worth of $110 million. Besides the charities/non profit organizations, the rest of his estate was left to his only child/daughter Suzanne.

In Godfather II, Hyman Roth should have represented Moe Dalitz instead of Meyer Lansky.

[JCB1977]

In real life, Meyer was more instrumental in the Havana casinos with Traficante, Mannarino, Marcello and others. GF2 was set more In that late 50’s time period where Bautista and Castro changed power.

[Confederate]

In real life, Meyer was more instrumental in the Havana casinos with Traficante, Mannarino, Marcello and others. GF2 was set more In that late 50’s time period where Bautista and Castro changed power.

Yes, you're right about the 50's time period in GF2 and Havana and Lansky. I was just surprised by the power and wealth of Moe Dalitz since you always hear more about Lansky. I admit that I really don't understand these Jew Gangsters and how they were organized. Besides being a partner with the Cleveland Mafia, did Moe Dalitz have any partnerships with Lansky? Was there a Jewish national Syndicate or were the Jews simply partnered with the different Italian Groups? I don't really understand it because I hear it both ways. Seems to me that behind every Jew there was an Italian but I could be wrong?

[JCB1977]

In the 1920’s, he was close to Enoch “Nucky” Johnson in Atlantic City, Lucky & his guys, Purple gang in Detroit and was the eyes and ears for Lucky & Meyer when Siegel was out in Vegas building the Flamingo. He was wired nationwide, going back to the early 1920’s.