Pogo The Clown wrote: ↑Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:00 pm
Since he was replaced as Consigliere he is most likely a Soldier. I can't think of anyone who went from Consigliere or UnderBoss back down to Capo.
I dont know thats likely the case. What years do we have him as consig and who do we have as acting for that tenure? Cefalu?
@Slim: Regards Carniglia, he's in the same boat as Gene Gotti IE probation (he was sentenced to 50yrs, served 30) so theres almost no way he'll risk going inside for another 20. Id say the life is over for them. They'll each get a nice envelope and buy a porch chair and pipe.
Pogo The Clown wrote: ↑Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:00 pm
Since he was replaced as Consigliere he is most likely a Soldier. I can't think of anyone who went from Consigliere or UnderBoss back down to Capo.
I dont know thats likely the case. What years do we have him as consig and who do we have as acting for that tenure? Cefalu?
@Slim: Regards Carniglia, he's in the same boat as Gene Gotti IE probation (he was sentenced to 50yrs, served 30) so theres almost no way he'll risk going inside for another 20. Id say the life is over for them. They'll each get a nice envelope and buy a porch chair and pipe.
Very good point. The leadership could just send them an envelope and thank them for keepin thier mouths shut. If that happens, everyone is happy. Only problem that either gene or john could cause is if they start demanding shit from the admin like more money.
Pogo The Clown wrote: ↑Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:00 pm
Since he was replaced as Consigliere he is most likely a Soldier. I can't think of anyone who went from Consigliere or UnderBoss back down to Capo.
I dont know thats likely the case. What years do we have him as consig and who do we have as acting for that tenure? Cefalu?
He was promoted to Consigliere in 1999. Imprisoned in 2008. He was indicted again in early 2011. Later in 2011 Capeci refers to Bobby Vernace as the Consigliere in one of his columns. Don't recall any mention of an Acting Consigliere during that period.
The leadership could just send them an envelope and thank them for keepin thier mouths shut.
The leadership doesn't give you money for going to prison or keeping your mouth shut. They don't work that way.
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
Pogo The Clown wrote: ↑Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:00 pm
Since he was replaced as Consigliere he is most likely a Soldier. I can't think of anyone who went from Consigliere or UnderBoss back down to Capo.
I dont know thats likely the case. What years do we have him as consig and who do we have as acting for that tenure? Cefalu?
He was promoted to Consigliere in 1999. Imprisoned in 2008. He was indicted again in early 2011. Later in 2011 Capeci refers to Bobby Vernace as the Consigliere in one of his columns. Don't recall any mention of an Acting Consigliere during that period.
The leadership could just send them an envelope and thank them for keepin thier mouths shut.
The leadership doesn't give you money for going to prison or keeping your mouth shut. They don't work that way.
So Consig from 99-08/11. Cefalu took over in 11 and then Vernace was named Consig. So Jojo losing Consig as the new regime took over makes sense. Weirdly he was Consig under the Gotti et al regimes (Gotti, Peter, Zeke, D’Amico) when the Corrozzo’s apparently weren’t fond of the gottis and vice versa. Perhaps what Scars said about the Consig being elected by the members was true to a later date. Though why Jojo is beyond me, I understand he’s not overly liked, ‘miserable’.
So Pogo pure right it’s unkikely he holds Admin. I would think with his previous standing and his brothers power he’d at least have his stripes though.
Maybe not.
And regards Gene and John getting an envelope? Absolutely they will. Perhaps not directly but they’ll get a
Racket or some gesture. And that’s from bronx. So I’m going with him.
Go with who you want I'm just saying that is not how the mob works. The top guy's don't give charity to the lower ranks for going to prison. You don't get paid for not ratting since not ratting and doing your time is what you are supposed to do.
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
What message does it send if he does thirty for the family at the behest of his brother (refusing plea) comes out and gets nothing? In this day and age.
I don’t believe they’d be stupid enough
And gene and johns situation is different. Guys now are allowed to plea. So they took an extra twenty each for the family. That’s a different situation than most guys doing time.
Yeah the life is cruel but that is the way it is. You don't get paid for doing your duty. If a guy does his time that might factor in when it comes to getting made or getting a promotion but they don't hand you cash simply for doing so. We have seen countless guy's come out broke and having to get involved in petty stuff to make a living because they have nothing to show for it. It is why so many get violated.
If Gene and Carneglia want to jump back in they might be given a loan to get started up again in bookmaking or loasharking but they have to kick from that. It won't be free money so they can live happily in retirement. Even that is not a given. So many of these guy's are forgotten about when they get out. Wouldn't be surprised if it happens here since they are relics from another era. Most of the top guys now weren't even made when Gene and Carneglia went away. They probably have never even met them.
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
richy67 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:42 pm
Are guys that go away families no looked after pogo? Or is that another rumor? Not talking megabucks but helped out to live?
Some are. Depends on the guy, his rank, the rackets he has on the street, how many relative/friends/allies he has on the street and his length of incarceration. Most of the lower ranks don't get shit. In fact the opposite usually happens when a guy goes away. The sharks descend to take whatever he has on the street.
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
Pogo The Clown wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:39 pm
Yeah the life is cruel but that is the way it is. You don't get paid for doing your duty. If a guy does his time that might factor in when it comes to getting made or getting a promotion but they don't hand you cash simply for doing so. We have seen countless guy's come out broke and having to get involved in petty stuff to make a living because they have nothing to show for it. It is why so many get violated.
If Gene and Carneglia want to jump back in they might be given a loan to get started up again in bookmaking or loansharking but they have to kick from that. It won't be free money so they can live happily in retirement. Even that is not a given. So many of these guy's are forgotten about when they get out. Wouldn't be surprised if it happens here since they are relics from another era. Most of the top guys now weren't even made when Gene and Carneglia went away. They probably have never even met them.
Pogo
Reminds me of the Sopranos. Remember when that guy (forgot his name was it Cheech?) got out of prison after being there for several years and Tony welcomed him back and ONLY gave him a LOAN to get started. That was it. There was NO reward money given for doing his duty. Then, since he was an older guy, he started to question Tony about certain things and showed him disrespect. Tony then arranged for him to violate his parole and the guy went back to prison.
Pogo The Clown wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:39 pm
Yeah the life is cruel but that is the way it is. You don't get paid for doing your duty. If a guy does his time that might factor in when it comes to getting made or getting a promotion but they don't hand you cash simply for doing so. We have seen countless guy's come out broke and having to get involved in petty stuff to make a living because they have nothing to show for it. It is why so many get violated.
If Gene and Carneglia want to jump back in they might be given a loan to get started up again in bookmaking or loasharking but they have to kick from that. It won't be free money so they can live happily in retirement. Even that is not a given. So many of these guy's are forgotten about when they get out. Wouldn't be surprised if it happens here since they are relics from another era. Most of the top guys now weren't even made when Gene and Carneglia went away. They probably have never even met them.
I’m glad you know what they’ll be given and what will happen.
My opinion, remains different and I’ve nothing more to add.
I don't know what will happen but I know what doesn't happen.
Confederate wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:55 pm
Reminds me of the Sopranos. Remember when that guy (forgot his name was it Cheech?) got out of prison after being there for several years and Tony welcomed him back and ONLY gave him a LOAN to get started. That was it. There was NO reward money given for doing his duty. Then, since he was an older guy, he started to question Tony about certain things and showed him disrespect. Tony then arranged for him to violate his parole and the guy went back to prison.
That was Feech LaMala.
Pogo
It's a new morning in America... fresh, vital. The old cynicism is gone. We have faith in our leaders. We're optimistic as to what becomes of it all. It really boils down to our ability to accept. We don't need pessimism. There are no limits.
aleksandrored wrote: ↑Tue Jun 19, 2018 7:45 pm
Does anyone know the largest number of members a family has ever had?
That is a loaded question for a lot of debate. LOL
As far as made men in the National LCN, (which would make Chicago smaller in numbers) I would say it HAS to be either the Genovese or Gambino Families in New York. The number of made guys from 60 years ago was difficult to determine and I'm sure Associates were counted as made members many times by mistake years ago. The New York Guys would know better than me but I would guess conservatively (without exaggerating) between 350 to 400 at the peak many years ago.
