Rules and regulations of Society of the Banana

[Stroccos]

rules of the society

[Cheech]

cool find!

[Stroccos]

cool find!

I have yet to order This book
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.marion ... /448607002

[Angelo Santino]

This is the part where I come in as an "early expert" and explain but... this has stumped me. I cannot explain it. All I can say is:

1) I have yet to see any equivalent of these rules anywhere else. That doesn't mean it's not there but this is very non-mafia like when compared to the contemporary mafia of 1910 in both America and Sicily, compounded by the fact that
2) The mafia generally never has written rules. The only example was Bernardo Provenzano's typed up list (which was that even necessary? All it served was another Franzese documentary in a leather jacket in a dark room staring at the camera with his best gangster face explaining the 10 Mafia Commandments to us pointless peasants. Great, grand, wonderful ). But I digress back to my point: very few examples.

Now this Ohio Black Hand book is going to be good for people who wish to read what's been published about this group. But honestly, if you got time to search through about 100 news articles you can find everything in the book in newspaper form. I checked the book's sources and it's all news articles. I don't say this arrogantly or snobbishly just a statement of fact. It's good for people who don't want to go through newspaper archives and instead have everything (that's been previously written) in one consolidated book.

But, while I can't go into detail here, I can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt with multiple examples from different documents that this group was officially part of the Pittsburgh Family. They had no connection to the Cleveland-Akron based group. Some of these so-called Banana members including Lima made his way out to San Francisco where in the 60's you had an informant providing a strange set up, nothing like the mafia we're accustomed to. I'm curious the connection between these cities. Some of Pittsburgh's earliest identified members of the 1910's were previously in San Francisco and New Orleans, so the connection goes far back. Could there be a link between these two groups/areas - PB and SF which at different times had members affiliated with both groups as well as the odd rules and ceremonies and setup that we see?

I think for anyone truly interested in learning more, we'd be better off ordering the court transcripts. It costs about 550.00, JCB and I were discussing splitting it 2 ways but if other people get in we just keep dividing it equally and share the file. It'd be a look at original testimony and not someone's interpretation that was published in a newspaper and then reinterpreted into a book 100 years later.

[aleksandrored]

This is the part where I come in as an "early expert" and explain but... this has stumped me. I cannot explain it. All I can say is:

1) I have yet to see any equivalent of these rules anywhere else. That doesn't mean it's not there but this is very non-mafia like when compared to the contemporary mafia of 1910 in both America and Sicily, compounded by the fact that
2) The mafia generally never has written rules. The only example was Bernardo Provenzano's typed up list (which was that even necessary? All it served was another Franzese documentary in a leather jacket in a dark room staring at the camera with his best gangster face explaining the 10 Mafia Commandments to us pointless peasants. Great, grand, wonderful ). But I digress back to my point: very few examples.

Now this Ohio Black Hand book is going to be good for people who wish to read what's been published about this group. But honestly, if you got time to search through about 100 news articles you can find everything in the book in newspaper form. I checked the book's sources and it's all news articles. I don't say this arrogantly or snobbishly just a statement of fact. It's good for people who don't want to go through newspaper archives and instead have everything (that's been previously written) in one consolidated book.

But, while I can't go into detail here, I can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt with multiple examples from different documents that this group was officially part of the Pittsburgh Family. They had no connection to the Cleveland-Akron based group. Some of these so-called Banana members including Lima made his way out to San Francisco where in the 60's you had an informant providing a strange set up, nothing like the mafia we're accustomed to. I'm curious the connection between these cities. Some of Pittsburgh's earliest identified members of the 1910's were previously in San Francisco and New Orleans, so the connection goes far back. Could there be a link between these two groups/areas - PB and SF which at different times had members affiliated with both groups as well as the odd rules and ceremonies and setup that we see?

I think for anyone truly interested in learning more, we'd be better off ordering the court transcripts. It costs about 550.00, JCB and I were discussing splitting it 2 ways but if other people get in we just keep dividing it equally and share the file. It'd be a look at original testimony and not someone's interpretation that was published in a newspaper and then reinterpreted into a book 100 years later.

I do not know if it was a good subject, because although similar, Sicily Mafia and American Mafia have their differences. (I like the franzese, but is it my impression or does it seem that in every new documentary he gives more information or different information?)

[Angelo Santino]

Different. Compare his first book to his ones now, his narrative changes from acting capo loyal to his father a la Bill Bonanno to, last I seen, his destiny being preplanned to be Underboss to Alphonse Persico. Joe Pistone's pulled the same personality change, in the 80's he "was a loyal FBI agent who's Italian heritage was secondary to personal duty to God and country," today it's "Okaya, so I was around wise-a-guys. Had I been ordered to do the hita, fuck it, I woulda did the hita. Fuhgedaboutit means Fuhgedaboutit."

Both are not only mob stories but examples of how some profit off the mob. Despite one claiming to be a born again Christian and the other being a patriotic G man, both of them love to dress the part and do their best to act in front of cameras. It's all commercialized and neither men can realistically define themselves as anti-mafia when their current conduct over the past decade speaks otherwise. Franzese makes 5K a pop off every college speaking engagement, rather than donate that money to charity he chooses to profit off essentially reliving his glory days speaking in present tense. As for Pistone, if I was an Agent entrusted to infiltrate NAMBLA who posed as a pedophile I wouldn't be writing books glorifying them, adopting my mannerisms to match theirs (to this day) and writing books about how they conduct themselves in a glorifying manner. I can only imagine other agents find his conduct to be despicable but remain silent due to his semi-celebrity status.

Which is why nothing will convince me otherwise that Jack Falcone didn't go into his undercover FBI role without stars and $$$ in his mind, he was probably writing his manuscript as he went along, fear for his personal safety was porbably number 4 of 5 down on the list. Today he get's paid to take newscasters with nothing better to report on, into the super market, grab a rubber band off a stalk of broccoli to reveal that's what wiseguy's use that to wrap their cash in. Fucking riveting reporting!

[B.]

Different. Compare his first book to his ones now, his narrative changes from acting capo loyal to his father a la Bill Bonanno to, last I seen, his destiny being preplanned to be Underboss to Alphonse Persico. Joe Pistone's pulled the same personality change, in the 80's he "was a loyal FBI agent who's Italian heritage was secondary to personal duty to God and country," today it's "Okaya, so I was around wise-a-guys. Had I been ordered to do the hita, fuck it, I woulda did the hita. Fuhgedaboutit means Fuhgedaboutit."

Which is why nothing will convince me otherwise that Jack Falcone didn't go into his undercover FBI role without stars and $$$ in his mind, he was probably writing his manuscript as he went along, fear for his personal safety was porbably number 4 of 5 down on the list. Today he get's paid to take newscasters with nothing better to report on, into the super market, grab a rubber band off a stalk of broccoli to reveal that's what wiseguy's use that to wrap their cash in. Fucking riveting reporting!

That breakdown on the Brasco "evolution" is too accurate, haha.

I bought the Falcone book in the dollar bin and there are countless parts of his narrative lifted directly from Donnie Brasco. Terrible, throwaway book despite a few interesting bits about the Gambinos/modern NY.

Also bought Pistone's Unfinished Business in the same dollar bin and that one is his version of Forrest Gump: Pistone summarizing all of the major headline mob cases from the 1980s forward and how his work as Donnie Brasco had some direct or indirect influence on the investigation/prosecution/outcome of each case, with some "entertaining" writing thrown in. When I heard he was testifying about Montreal I was wondering what exactly he could say about them. In the Brasco book I believe he mentions that someone from Montreal was backing up Anthony Mirra in his claims about "Brasco's" heroin dealing and I was always curious who this could be and how or why they would have even been in a position to back Mirra in these allegations. Mirra was under Bonventre by this time who was close to Montreal so maybe he brought them into the plot, assuming it's true.

This Society of the Banana story is interesting, especially since it seems like an early coalition of Sicilian Pittsburgh mafiosi and non-Sicilians. Makes you wonder if it predated the inclusion of non-Sicilians into the mafia and was used as a substitute "combination" group to keep things organized. Just wild speculation.

[SonnyBlackstein]

Today he get's paid to take newscasters with nothing better to report on, into the super market, grab a rubber band off a stalk of broccoli to reveal that's what wiseguy's use that to wrap their cash in. Fucking riveting reporting!

You do make me chuckle CC.

[Angelo Santino]

To me, these men are the equivalent of evening news pundits. Both have been unconnected to "the life" for three decades but they'll gladly shave, don a dago suit and appear on national television for a few grand to dole out largely irrelevant opinions. Before the finale of Sopranos Season 3 aired, a reporter "tracked down" Pistone on a crowded street in NY's Little Italy wearing a leather coat and sunglasses to ask him The Question: "Is Jackie Jr. getting Whacked?" He responds that in the old days he would have. He's got a supposed $500,000 may-fia bounty on his head but holeeee fuck the agent who took down the mob just came out of hiding to discuss the Sopranos . A few years later after Massino et al were rounded up Pistone dropped this gem: "Joey's the last of the old-timers. A true traditionalist. He'll never flip." (Queue the Curb your Enthusiasm theme). That right there personifies his relevance, he should stick to handycapping Sonny Black's racing pigeons.

Today he get's paid to take newscasters with nothing better to report on, into the super market, grab a rubber band off a stalk of broccoli to reveal that's what wiseguy's use that to wrap their cash in. Fucking riveting reporting!

You do make me chuckle CC.

I wasn't being sarcastic, this really happened. He got paid to walk into the produce section and steal a rubberband. Damn shame the Gambinos didn't use the three seashells in the piscione so he could explain how that one works.

[Angelo Santino]

This Society of the Banana story is interesting, especially since it seems like an early coalition of Sicilian Pittsburgh mafiosi and non-Sicilians. Makes you wonder if it predated the inclusion of non-Sicilians into the mafia and was used as a substitute "combination" group to keep things organized. Just wild speculation.

It's possible but I will say this group is in touch with both the mafia and other criminal elements, which were both up and running. It seems to lead back to the Lima brothers and others from Termini Imerese, that was the bulk of the members. And interestingly many of them were in the US since before 1900, some as early as 1880. So this wasn't a group of recent arrivals, some were very well established market and fruit vendors, a few farmers which some of them continued to be into the 1940's.

But then I look at Pittsburgh's other Mafiosi and they have no criminal records. You can find their names and photos in certain papers written about as completely legitimate leading members of the Italian community, involved in benevolent charities and Italian social functions. This was the mafia Gentile was a part of, and he sir mentioned no Bananas.

I haven't been able to develop any working theories without evidence immediately refuting it:
1) Early Pittsburgh called itself the Banana society - no sources indicate that and they likely would have.
2) The Banana Society was akin to the Lima Crew - one article said it had more than 50 members spread across Ohio
3) This Banana Society wasn't the mafia but a Mafia copycat - they are linked to PB members and the Limas continued their Mafia tradition in San Francisco for another 50 years.
4) The Mafia did keep early documents outlining the rules but the Banana case is the only example - yet NOTHING has come out of Palermo, Monreale, Favara, Trapani anywhere in 1870-1900 or San Francisco to NY 1880-1930 remotely similar.

We need the court transcripts to know more.

[aleksandrored]

It is that I think it is hypocritical for a person to say that life in La Cosa nostra is bad because it destroys families, but at the same time the person profiting by making mafia musicals in Las Vegas, publishing books, giving interviews about the mafia, somehow the person lives in the Mafia, nothing against the show in Las Vegas, may be cool, but I think it kind of ridiculed the Mafia, just as those already mentioned the infamous Henry Hill was also putting several different information after the success of godfellas.

[Angelo Santino]

It is that I think it is hypocritical for a person to say that life in La Cosa nostra is bad because it destroys families, but at the same time the person profiting by making mafia musicals in Las Vegas, publishing books, giving interviews about the mafia, somehow the person lives in the Mafia, nothing against the show in Las Vegas, may be cool, but I think it kind of ridiculed the Mafia, just as those already mentioned the infamous Henry Hill was also putting several different information after the success of godfellas.

That's my point, it's all commercialization and Pistone and Franzese are no exception at cashing in. Maybe they earned it. Regardless, their public personas are 100% fake, everything is carefully scripted and presented, from Franzese speaking about 30 year old events in present tense to college students to Pistone being called a "fookin ratttt" from across the street. At this point it's really no different than bringing out Shatner to speak about the latest Star Trek film dressed in his original 1960's makeup.

[Stroccos]

Which is why nothing will convince me otherwise that Jack Falcone didn't go into his undercover FBI role without stars and $$$ in his mind, he was probably writing his manuscript as he went along, fear for his personal safety was porbably number 4 of 5 down on the list. Today he get's paid to take newscasters with nothing better to report on, into the super market, grab a rubber band off a stalk of broccoli to reveal that's what wiseguy's use that to wrap their cash in. Fucking riveting reporting!

One questions double C , did you start using those bands on your roll?

I don't blame any of those guys for getting paid. Hell if you want to pay me 5 figures to speak to a bunch of jerk offs for a hour or so , I surprised anyone still pays Franzese has been spewing his same bs for years now. he comes off as phoney as a 3 dollar bill.

[Angelo Santino]

Which is why nothing will convince me otherwise that Jack Falcone didn't go into his undercover FBI role without stars and $$$ in his mind, he was probably writing his manuscript as he went along, fear for his personal safety was porbably number 4 of 5 down on the list. Today he get's paid to take newscasters with nothing better to report on, into the super market, grab a rubber band off a stalk of broccoli to reveal that's what wiseguy's use that to wrap their cash in. Fucking riveting reporting!

One questions double C , did you start using those bands on your roll?

I don't blame any of those guys for getting paid. Hell if you want to pay me 5 figures to speak to a bunch of jerk offs for a hour or so , I surprised anyone still pays Franzese has been spewing his same bs for years now. he comes off as phoney as a 3 dollar bill.

What a stupid question. Yes. A single 100 note wrapped around 25 singles, slide on that rubber band and I exit Publix feeling like Funzi fucking Tieri.

To us, Franzese and Pistone do, to the general public its probably riveting.

[Stroccos]

Which is why nothing will convince me otherwise that Jack Falcone didn't go into his undercover FBI role without stars and $$$ in his mind, he was probably writing his manuscript as he went along, fear for his personal safety was porbably number 4 of 5 down on the list. Today he get's paid to take newscasters with nothing better to report on, into the super market, grab a rubber band off a stalk of broccoli to reveal that's what wiseguy's use that to wrap their cash in. Fucking riveting reporting!

One questions double C , did you start using those bands on your roll?

I don't blame any of those guys for getting paid. Hell if you want to pay me 5 figures to speak to a bunch of jerk offs for a hour or so , I surprised anyone still pays Franzese has been spewing his same bs for years now. he comes off as phoney as a 3 dollar bill.

What a stupid question. Yes. A single 100 note wrapped around 25 singles, slide on that rubber band and I exit Publix feeling like Funzi fucking Tieri.

To us, Franzese and Pistone do, to the general public its probably riveting.

Hahahahah , but it all seriousness it does make a good money clip

ok A real queston , do you know If the banana society operated in Sicily as well?