General Mob Questions

[Pogo The Clown]

Because the whole "dumb idiot" thing is largely a forum creation used back in the day to justify the fresh street talk that Nick Corozzo was the real Boss. Really he is no dumber than the average mobster.


Pogo

[gohnjotti]

Because the whole "dumb idiot" thing is largely a forum creation used back in the day to justify the fresh street talk that Nick Corozzo was the real Boss. Really he is no dumber than the average mobster.


Pogo

http://nymag.com/nymetro/news/crimelaw/features/10869/

It seems that a lot of people in the mob seemed to think Peter was a dope, including his own brother John.

[Pogo The Clown]

Yeah but it was greatly exaggerated on the forums. Besides John Gotti is one to talk. In many ways Peter was smarter than him.


Pogo

[Snakes]

What's the total number of made guys from all ~30 families who have flipped combined? A friend wants to know.

Here is what I have. These are just the ones who publically flipped or were outted. There were of course many more in each family who were secretly providing info.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Philly- 18
Bonanno – 16
Lucchese – 16
Colombo – 15
Gambino – 14
Genovese – 8
New England – 7
Rochester - 6
Los Angeles - 5
Chicago – 4?
DeCavalcante – 3
San Jose – 3
Buffalo - 2
Kansas City - 1
Milwaukee - 1
Pittsburgh -1
Tampa – 1
St. Louis - 1
Detroit – 1?


So well over a 100. Enough to start a 6th family.


Pogo

"These fucking dagos all snitch on each other!"

Thanks Pogo.

who is the four MADE MEN from chicago rhat flipped? Calabrese is the only one (and then his uncle)

Nick Calabrese is the only one to testify in court. Gerald Scarpelli cooperated but hung himself before any indictments were handed down. Vic Arrigo was a lower level made guy who worked for Joe DiVarco that didn't start cooperating until he was on the shelf. Not sure who the fourth would be. Maybe Lou Bombacino? I am not sure he was made but he testified against some top Outfit guys in the late sixties that resulted in some convictions.

Not counting guys like Richard Cain or Butch Blasi who were later outed as confidential informants.

[gohnjotti]

Yeah but it was greatly exaggerated on the forums. Besides John Gotti is one to talk. In many ways Peter was smarter than him.


Pogo

Interesting. I was always under the impression that he wasn’t respected in his family at all and no one bothered taking orders from him. Not saying that the former is true, but that is what I always thought.
How do you think his leadership was, both as a capo and a boss? I don’t know too much about the guy.

[Pogo The Clown]

He was on the ruling panel/Acting Boss/Official Boss from 1991-2002. All things considered that is a pretty impresive run. The only other guy's who managed to last at that top level for that long during that era were Gigante and Massino. And unlike his brother he actually has a chance of getting of prison one day.


Pogo

[gohnjotti]

He was on the ruling panel/Acting Boss/Official Boss from 1991-2002. All things considered that is a pretty impresive run. The only other guy's who managed to last at that top level for that long during that era were Gigante and Massino. And unlike his brother he actually has a chance of getting of prison one day.


Pogo

Fair point. Any wiretapped conversations, remarks by informers, etc. regarding his reign or character (from anyone other than his brother)?

[JeremyTheJew]

from what iv read.... behind his back they call him one eye bc he lost his eye. as well as make fun of h bc he was a garbage man.

and he also is called stupid bc at court he would keep sayiglng he didnt understsnd certain things which were not complicated.

[Frank]

What's the total number of made guys from all ~30 families who have flipped combined? A friend wants to know.

Here is what I have. These are just the ones who publically flipped or were outted. There were of course many more in each family who were secretly providing info.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Philly- 18
Bonanno – 16
Lucchese – 16
Colombo – 15
Gambino – 14
Genovese – 8
New England – 7
Rochester - 6
Los Angeles - 5
Chicago – 4?
DeCavalcante – 3
San Jose – 3
Buffalo - 2
Kansas City - 1
Milwaukee - 1
Pittsburgh -1
Tampa – 1
St. Louis - 1
Detroit – 1?


So well over a 100. Enough to start a 6th family.


Pogo

"These fucking dagos all snitch on each other!"

Thanks Pogo.

who is the four MADE MEN from chicago rhat flipped? Calabrese is the only one (and then his uncle)

Nick Calebrese was made, his nephew wasn't.

[SonnyBlackstein]

Appears to be a decent doco on Serpico just out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvkJb2PjGW8

[SonnyBlackstein]

Great article for our history buffs:

http://www.foxbusiness.com/features/201 ... space.html

[gohnjotti]

Was combing through the 2011 Colombo indictment and noticed this:

the defendant NICKY
RIZZO, together with others, did knowingly and intentionally
steal property by extortion, in that the defendant and others
obtained property, to wit: money, by compelling and inducing John
Doe #1, an individual whose identity is known to the Grand Jury,
to deliver such property by instilling in him a fear that, if the
property were not so delivered, a person would testify and
provide information with respect to another’s legal claim and
defense, contrary to New York Penal Law Sections 155.30(6),
155.05(2)(e)(vii) and 20.00.

It seems to me that the charge is suggesting that Nicky Rizzo, a Colombo soldier, extorted a man by threatening that he, or someone he knew, would testify against him. How could a wiseguy do that without being considered a rat?

For context, here is a usual extortion charge:
the defendant, together with others, did knowingly and
intentionally steal property by extortion, in that the defendant
and others obtained property, to wit: money, by compelling and
inducing John Doe #2, an individual whose identity is known to
the Grand Jury, to deliver such property by instilling in him a
fear that, if the property were not so delivered, the defendant
and others would (1) cause physical injury to John Doe #2 in the
future and (2) cause damage to property, contrary to New York
Penal Law Sections 155.40(2), 155.05(2)(e)(i), 155.05(2)(e)(ii)
and 20.00.

Thanks in advance.

[bronx]

he may be a ci for decades

[gohnjotti]

he may be a ci for decades

This charge occurred in 1996. He was indicted for it in 2011, in Mafia Takedown Day. He was charged with other crimes up until 2011, including money laundering in 2008, etc. He got three years behind bars. He wasn't put into witness security or anything. If he WAS a CI, he wouldn't be exposed in an indictment and arrested. Which is why this charge is confusing to me.

[gohnjotti]

he may be a ci for decades

This charge occurred in 1996. He was indicted for it in 2011, in Mafia Takedown Day. He was charged with other crimes up until 2011, including money laundering in 2008, etc. He got three years behind bars. He wasn't put into witness security or anything. If he WAS a CI, he wouldn't be exposed in an indictment and arrested. Which is why this charge is confusing to me.

Correction: He got six months in prison and six months home detention, but the inmate tracker has him as being released on 04/09/2014. Perhaps he violated his home detention terms?