Mikey Mancuso running Bonannos from prison.

[Cheech]

This discussion comes up so much I feel like we need a basic Q & A to link to. There is plenty of evidence of caps in NYC and we have a general idea of the sizes, though some of the info is conflicting. Pussy Russo was recorded in the 1960s referencing 300 as the Genovese cap, among other examples.

There was that story about Gotti asking Chin about all of the empty spots they hadn't replaced, where Chin basically told him to mind his own business, so if that's true it's an indication that different families keep tabs on each others' sizes.

Was that in the wire tap gotti book? He says something lime whatya gonna do? Make 60 guys at a wedding?

[Doobeez]

I think Bull's mentioned it in his book, Ciccio..the same meeting I believe where Gotti mentions he was gonna make John, jr and Chin wasn't impressed and even chastised the decision.

[Doobeez]

I think that conversation was detailed in Sammy Bull's book, Ciccio. It was in the same meeting Gotti mentions he was gonna make John, jr and Chin wasn't impressed and even chastised the decision.

^edited...

[gohnjotti]

I think that conversation was detailed in Sammy Bull's book, Ciccio. It was in the same meeting Gotti mentions he was gonna make John, jr and Chin wasn't impressed and even chastised the decision.

^edited...

Didn’t two of Gigantes sons get made, including the recently indicted Esposito? Sounds a bit hypocritical from the Chin.

[newera_212]

I think that conversation was detailed in Sammy Bull's book, Ciccio. It was in the same meeting Gotti mentions he was gonna make John, jr and Chin wasn't impressed and even chastised the decision.

^edited...

Didn’t two of Gigantes sons get made, including the recently indicted Esposito? Sounds a bit hypocritical from the Chin.

i dont think his son andrew was ever made, but maybe the other sons that did "didnt count" since they came from his side girl and not his first/real wife? lol

[Hailbritain]

I think that conversation was detailed in Sammy Bull's book, Ciccio. It was in the same meeting Gotti mentions he was gonna make John, jr and Chin wasn't impressed and even chastised the decision.

^edited...

Didn’t two of Gigantes sons get made, including the recently indicted Esposito? Sounds a bit hypocritical from the Chin.

Maybe Esposito was made after gigante died in 2005

[Doobeez]

They're called "out children" where I'm from, lol, which is probably the case newera describes with these Gigante offsprings..

[SonnyBlackstein]

My understanding is only Esposito is made

[willychichi]

I think that conversation was detailed in Sammy Bull's book, Ciccio. It was in the same meeting Gotti mentions he was gonna make John, jr and Chin wasn't impressed and even chastised the decision.

^edited...

Didn’t two of Gigantes sons get made, including the recently indicted Esposito? Sounds a bit hypocritical from the Chin.

He's a hot head just like his Father.

[johnny_scootch]

This discussion comes up so much I feel like we need a basic Q & A to link to. There is plenty of evidence of caps in NYC and we have a general idea of the sizes, though some of the info is conflicting. Pussy Russo was recorded in the 1960s referencing 300 as the Genovese cap, among other examples.

There was that story about Gotti asking Chin about all of the empty spots they hadn't replaced, where Chin basically told him to mind his own business, so if that's true it's an indication that different families keep tabs on each others' sizes.

Agreed. Mikey Scars also testified about it in Junior Gotti's 2006 trial -

"Every family has a ceiling on how far their family could grow. When you get to your number, you have to wait for somebody to die to replace that number."

I think what HK is questioning is whether there was a membership limit closer to the beginning. Capeci, who said it started with Luciano and the Commission, isn't exactly known for just making things up out of thin air or presenting his assumptions as fact. And the membership limits in the D'Arco book are quite different from the ones Capeci put in his earlier book. In fact, they were relatively low compared to past figures and, regardless of what one thinks about the figures themselves, that leads me to believe it was new info coming from D'Arco.

It also stands to reason that the five families would put a cap on membership early on. Otherwise, what was to stop an arms race, so to speak, of families making as many members as possible?

To double down on that Ed Scarpo interviewed Mikie Scars for his recent article on the Genovese family bust and in reference to the list found in Espositos home he goes on to say

As for the list, DiLeonardo said that "every family has a list of their own family and everyone else's." He said it's possible the feds got their hands on what could amount to a literal directory -- a phonebook of every made Mafia member in New York (and possibly beyond).

"That would be really stupid if he had that list there," DiLeonardo said.

A source connected to law enforcement told Cosa Nostra News. "I can see the government subpoenaing all those guys. They're going to target every person on that list." The list could contain the 450 made guys (in the Genovese crime family) throughout the country, the source said.


http://cosanostranews.com/

[Pogo The Clown]

The quotes and sources in that piece sound made up.


Pogo

[Wiseguy]

This discussion comes up so much I feel like we need a basic Q & A to link to. There is plenty of evidence of caps in NYC and we have a general idea of the sizes, though some of the info is conflicting. Pussy Russo was recorded in the 1960s referencing 300 as the Genovese cap, among other examples.

There was that story about Gotti asking Chin about all of the empty spots they hadn't replaced, where Chin basically told him to mind his own business, so if that's true it's an indication that different families keep tabs on each others' sizes.

Agreed. Mikey Scars also testified about it in Junior Gotti's 2006 trial -

"Every family has a ceiling on how far their family could grow. When you get to your number, you have to wait for somebody to die to replace that number."

I think what HK is questioning is whether there was a membership limit closer to the beginning. Capeci, who said it started with Luciano and the Commission, isn't exactly known for just making things up out of thin air or presenting his assumptions as fact. And the membership limits in the D'Arco book are quite different from the ones Capeci put in his earlier book. In fact, they were relatively low compared to past figures and, regardless of what one thinks about the figures themselves, that leads me to believe it was new info coming from D'Arco.

It also stands to reason that the five families would put a cap on membership early on. Otherwise, what was to stop an arms race, so to speak, of families making as many members as possible?

To double down on that Ed Scarpo interviewed Mikie Scars for his recent article on the Genovese family bust and in reference to the list found in Espositos home he goes on to say

As for the list, DiLeonardo said that "every family has a list of their own family and everyone else's." He said it's possible the feds got their hands on what could amount to a literal directory -- a phonebook of every made Mafia member in New York (and possibly beyond).

"That would be really stupid if he had that list there," DiLeonardo said.

A source connected to law enforcement told Cosa Nostra News. "I can see the government subpoenaing all those guys. They're going to target every person on that list." The list could contain the 450 made guys (in the Genovese crime family) throughout the country, the source said.


http://cosanostranews.com/

450 made guys in the Genovese family? Maybe if this were 75 years ago.

[SonnyBlackstein]

Yeah I really don’t understand these guys. His target audience is Mafia afficanados, I mean who else is visiting a website named ‘cosanostranews’? And he comes out with garbage like that. That’s not a little wrong that’s fucking 100%, double the size, not even ball park, wrong.
Either lazy or stupid.

But either way, Credibility, gone.

[gohnjotti]

Yeah I really don’t understand these guys. His target audience is Mafia afficanados, I mean who else is visiting a website named ‘cosanostranews’? And he comes out with garbage like that.

Credibility, gone.

I always remember when he wrote an article titled "Here's What's Wrong with Mafia-related Journalism." I think back to that article every time he posts something ridiculous, like the detailed chart of the Buffalo crime family's 2017 hierarchy. Buddy - you're what's wrong with Mafia-related journalism.
He claimed an anonymous source provided the information on the chart. Wikipedia was of course updated the day of the article to contain Scarpo's dumb, unfounded chart, and everyone on GBB was swooning over it as if Wikipedia was definitive proof of the chart's legitimacy.

[handy]

Does Vincent Basciano have any say in the Bonannos anymore?