Chicago Outfit-Related Murders 1970's

[Snakes]

Eboli was direct with Aiuppa, I believe. He had a couple of guys that worked for him. Cervone, as you already mentioned, and Buddy Ciotti were two.

Interestingly enough, Fred Pascente also said that Cozzo was not made, at least not at the time of Richard Cain's murder, which would not be too surprising.

[Villain]

I also believe that during one period from the 1980's, according to the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration at the time, Jimmy Cozzo allegedly oversaw a laundering drug money operation through one casino-hotel which was located on the Caribbean island of Curaçao

[Confederate]

Eboli was direct with Aiuppa, I believe. He had a couple of guys that worked for him. Cervone, as you already mentioned, and Buddy Ciotti were two.

Interestingly enough, Fred Pascente also said that Cozzo was not made, at least not at the time of Richard Cain's murder, which would not be too surprising.

But according to that Complaint by the Government against Senese, Talarico and Cozzo, it specifically states that Cozzo was the acting Boss when Lombardo went away which would have been 1985 or thereabouts. That means he had to be made by at least 1985 or sooner. Don't you think?
I don't think some of these guys who say somebody was made or not made REALLY know. They are just guessing in my opinion.
I would think the Government Complaint would be more accurate because if it is not, that would be a loop hole for the defendant to be found innocent.

[Snakes]

I think he could have led the crew for a time without being made, especially on an acting basis. I think the time line in the hearing was messed up as Eboli was definitely installed as the acting boss of the crew first and Cozzo did not take over until 1987 at the earliest. It wasn't a large crew and I can really only think of one other guy in it at the time who could have been made (James D'Antonio).

As far as the loophole is concerned, they don't really have a leg to stand on because unless they provide conflicting information themselves, they cannot irrefutably disprove that they were not made. It's a (somewhat) unfair advantage the government possesses.

[Antiliar]

Marshall Caifano was a made member and part of the crew also, and he and several others could have been examples of older made guys who were essentially out of the picture. So in terms of active members, it was relatively small, but it could have been much larger if you counted retired and shelved guys who were technically still part of the crew.

[Pete]

Antiliar, you have wrong information. Snakes is correct.
Reference: United States versus International Brotherhood of Teamsters dated 7/12/1990
On page 40 of said Government Complaint against Senese, Talarico & Cozzo: Jimmy Cozzo is listed as a "made member" of Chicago La Cosa Nostra and is Joey Lombardo's right hand man and was the acting Boss of the Grand Avenue Crew when Lombardo was away.

Cozzo took over after Eboli died in 87. I would have trouble believing cozzo wasn't made being that he was running that crew. Can you link that doc please confederate?

[Snakes]

I knew about Caifano, Frabotta, DeBiase, etc., but they were all dead or in prison by 1987.

[Antiliar]

Antiliar, you have wrong information. Snakes is correct.
Reference: United States versus International Brotherhood of Teamsters dated 7/12/1990
On page 40 of said Government Complaint against Senese, Talarico & Cozzo: Jimmy Cozzo is listed as a "made member" of Chicago La Cosa Nostra and is Joey Lombardo's right hand man and was the acting Boss of the Grand Avenue Crew when Lombardo was away.

Not all government docs are accurate, and to blindly accept everything in them is to have blind faith that's contradicted by reality. How many gov docs claimed that Ferriola was the top boss of the Outfit, only to be corrected later that he wasn't? In the Commission case, Fat Tony Salerno was the Genovese boss, then in a later case he wasn't in the same time period. The feds relied on people like Red Wemette, Frank Rosenthal and others for their information. I believe Red in this case since he knew first hand.

[Snakes]

That document even gets the date that Cozzo took over wrong. It has him acting for Lombardo in 1985 but it came out later that Eboli was actually the acting boss of the crew at that time.

[Villain]

Regarding the Schiro/Hansen killings, according to the report, before the four men got killed, federal authorities were preparing a case against them by investigating one of their companies of a “boiler-room business” called Steel Liquidation Services and they were also looking at possible charges including interstate transportation of stolen property, mail fraud and telephone fraud. So according to witnesses at the time, the victims were last seen alive about 10:30 p.m. while leaving their offices with two unknown individuals. The investigators called the murders “methodical” and “very professional.” There were 25 to 30 shots from a .22-caliber gun, fired in the elevator at close range, and the thing was that most of the crime syndicate figures from that period have been also killed with .22-caliber pistols. The men have been led into the elevator one by one and shot in the head, neck and chest. The point is that four men wouldn't just stand there and be shot but instead it had to be done by persons they trusted. Robbery was not a motive because the victims’ rings and wallets were not taken and they were heaped atop each other like rag dolls. All four victims were in fact shady businessmen who also dealt in burglar alarms and were connected to many Chicago burglary crews which many were connected to the Outfit, mainly under Tony Spilotro and Joey Lombardo a.k.a. the Grand Avenue Mob. More than six years later after the murders, Mob informant Frank Culotta gave some information regarding the hit and pointed out Paul Schiro as the possible hit man in the whole bloody situation but he was never charged about it. So Schiro was a member of Spilotro’s crew who mostly operated in the Arizona area and his main job was professional burglary and sources say that the main victim who had connection to Schiro or Spilotro was in fact Joseph LaRose. According to another informant, Schiro and Joey Hansen were Spilotro’s main hit men at the time, which again according to the info, Spilotro confirmed this himself .

[cavita]

I'm not sure if this a good gauge or not, but since it's usually the case where a potential associate (being 100% Italian) is up for membership, he needs to commit a murder on behalf of his family. Would it be a good assumption to say that if an Outfit guy was made in, say 1983, that he was involved in a murder within a couple years prior? Could that potentially narrow down who would be responsible for a given hit? Just a thought.

[Pete]

I'm not sure if this a good gauge or not, but since it's usually the case where a potential associate (being 100% Italian) is up for membership, he needs to commit a murder on behalf of his family. Would it be a good assumption to say that if an Outfit guy was made in, say 1983, that he was involved in a murder within a couple years prior? Could that potentially narrow down who would be responsible for a given hit? Just a thought.

Not necessarily. Nick calabrese first hit was in 1970 and he wasn't made until 83

[cavita]

I'm not sure if this a good gauge or not, but since it's usually the case where a potential associate (being 100% Italian) is up for membership, he needs to commit a murder on behalf of his family. Would it be a good assumption to say that if an Outfit guy was made in, say 1983, that he was involved in a murder within a couple years prior? Could that potentially narrow down who would be responsible for a given hit? Just a thought.

Not necessarily. Nick calabrese first hit was in 1970 and he wasn't made until 83

Yeah, I knew some Outfit guys had some gaps like that between murders and being made but thought it might be worth a try. The Outfit certainly did take their time grooming guys to fully initiate on some levels.

[Pete]

It seems to me most guys had been involved in quite a few hits before getting made unlike some families where they get made right after their first hit

[Villain]

I agree, the most important thing in the Outfit was/is the time of grooming, and as a matter of fact if a guy shows that he's good on that position, that same individual can remain forever on that same spot. For example, Prio was the capo of the North Side till his death, even though he was always destined for the top spot. Same thing goes for LaPorte and some other guys. As for the time being groomed, just look at the time periods of some of the underbosses, such as Campagna being on the position for 7 or 8 years and then took the boss position and much later the top spot, Giancana for 9 years and later took the boss position, Ferraro for 7 years and should've been the boss if he didnt died too early, Cerone for almost a decade and thats because he allegedly turned down the boss position because he previously held it, Andriacchi for 8 years, Cataudella from 2010 and allegedly still counting...