Who exactly was involved in the Galante murder planning?

[Dwalin2014]

I just read that, while Carmine Persico's lawyers argue that he wasn't part of the commission in 1979 anyway, Thomas DiBella was the official boss etc (although I read DiBella was just Persico's puppet de-facto), but this article also says there wasn't even a Commission meeting to decide and vote for the Galante murder

http://www.cosanostranews.com/2017/02/p ... tions.html

There was no Commission meeting to determine the fate of Carmine Galante, Massino told the FBI, which detailed his comments on 302s, the form used by FBI agents to report or summarize interviews with certain sources.

In fact, the Galante murder was in-house Bonanno business, Massino told FBI agents. Bonanno boss Philip (Rusty) Rastelli simply ordered the murder of Galante, Massino told the FBI. Massino never testified in court about this information.

But I clearly remember reading earlier that there was a meeting where Tieri attended for the Genoveses, Castellano for the Gambinos, then it was said that "maybe" (why not 100% sure?) Tony Corallo for the Luccheses, and don't remember if it was specified who represented the Colombos, but anyway, I think the vote was 3 to 1, with the Colombos voting against the hit. Somewhere I read it was considered such an important decision than even the retired Joe Bonanno was asked (why the hell ask him, who wasn't boss anymore and was labeled a traitor anyway, for trying to whack the Commission years before, using Magliocco?). Anyway, now they say it was Rastelli alone. I remember reading though, that there were articles mentioning Aniello Dellacroce being filmed greeting and congratulating the people later turned out to be the triggermen (if I remember well), shortly after the hit....Some Gambino characters were proven to be involved somehow, although I don't remember the details and the titles of the articles anymore. But I can search for them, if necessary.

So do you think, was there a Commission meeting to whack Galante or there wasn't there any?

[Antiliar]

In situations like this I use Occam's Razor, that the simplest explanation is usually the best one. What's the easiest one? That Galante was a capo who managed to create a separate faction and claimed he was the boss, and the real boss ordered him taken down. I could see Rastelli sending out word to the other bosses about his plan, but the ultimate decision lied with him. If DiBella was the boss of the Colombos and it can be shown he wasn't a Persico puppet, then Matt Mari has a good case for his client.

[bronx]

Anti liar, i agree, debella was the sitting boss even if l.e. or anyone else say's he was holding it for persico. don't matter debella was boss.. mari should call messino, gravano, darco,scars any and all G witnesses that know..how can the G now say don't believe those rats..?galante was not boss and they did not need C. permission.did they work with gambino's sure not the first time..3 captains, paul c son inlaw and others

[Dwalin2014]

Ok, I understand about the Commission. But for the Colombo situation specifically, was DIBella Persico's puppet after all or wasn't he? First they say 1 thing, then another....It seems the "official boss" position belonged to DiBella, but was he really "independent" (not just "formally") or did he send for Persico's approval in jail, for important decisions? Like all those bosses in Chicago always (or most times) asked Tony Accardo and Paul Ricca?

[bronx]

from what i know persico was boss in waiting when he comes home. only they know debella , him and a few others if he was being kept up to date..every thing else is speculative..still leaves a gray area.

[Rocco]

Anti liar, i agree, debella was the sitting boss even if l.e. or anyone else say's he was holding it for persico. don't matter debella was boss.. mari should call messino, gravano, darco,scars any and all G witnesses that know..how can the G now say don't believe those rats..?galante was not boss and they did not need C. permission.did they work with gambino's sure not the first time..3 captains, paul c son inlaw and others

Got a point about working together. Gene Gotti helped out massino in the 3 capos hit . I believe that Tartaglione testified he dropped off the 3 bodies to Gene Gotti and a few other guys from the ozone park crew. Leads me to believe the Gambino's buried those 3 bonannos in queens. Also they were hit at Gravano's club.

[bronx]

your right on Rocco,

[CarmineGalante]

In the book about Donnie Brasco, Pistone says that Sonny Black went to Staten Island to get Castellano's OK. He had to cut him in on some of the heroin money that they would be getting once Galante was out of the way. Also if I remember correctly didn't they include Galante's murder as a part of the commission trial? I can't answer about your Colombo question but it definitely seems that the Commission was involved in the decision making

[Dwalin2014]

Also if I remember correctly didn't they include Galante's murder as a part of the commission trial?

They did. It was the main crime they were sentenced for, therefore 100 years for everybody, if I got it right.

[B.]

Seems the other families were at least consulted or informed of the hit, especially since it could have provoked open warfare. Galante was not official boss, but like we talked about in another topic a while back, there was a significant faction that regarded Galante as THE boss which made the politics of the hit more complicated.

Regardless of the other families' involvement, I have always wondered how the hit was planned within the Bonannos. It was always assumed that Massino and Napolitano, two of the top rising stars in the Rastelli faction, were participants in the hit, but were they? Maybe Massino testified about it or JD saw something about it Massino's 302s, but I've never seen either of them listed as conspirators in the actual murder though no doubt they were key Rastelli representatives who were used to secure his power.

The guys who have actually been connected to the hit, either through evidence or circumstance, are: Bonventre, Amato, Giordano, Giaccone, the Indelicatos, Trinchera, Louis Giongetti (associate), Cannone, plus Dellacroce.

Bonventre, Amato, and Giordano were part of the "Zip faction" that had been close to Galante, so bringing them over to the other side was a crucial part of the hit. Giordano is believed to have been the driver of the car used in the murder, and Bonventre and Amato as we know survived the hit and likely acted as additional shooters. How were they approached, though?

I don't know what the relationship was between Giaccone, Indelicatos, and Trinchera before the hit, but they would come together to form a powerful faction and Giaccone and Sonny Indelicato were already major players when Galante was running the family and afterward. They seem to have supported Galante while he was still alive, so again what brought them over? I think they saw obvious room to grab more power, which they tried to do and suffered for.

Cannone was likely the main organizer who brought the conspiracy into motion. Not too much to speculate on there, though would be good to know more details about his relationship to Galante, both historically and as consigliere during Galante's time running the family. Underboss Marangello was a former soldier in Galante's crew who deferred to Galante as boss and was demoted, but Cannone stayed loyal to Rastelli and kept his position afterward.

[B.]

Other thoughts:

- Giongetti was a Trinchera associate I believe who supplied some of the weapons used. He was never made and ended up in prison. Not much to speculate on.

- Trinchera was a soldier who would have been brought into the conspiracy without his captain Vito DeFilippo's knowledge, as DeFilippo was a Galante loyalist demoted afterward. This Bronx crew had originally been a part of Galante's decina in the 1950s and Trinchera was likely crucial in initially bringing the Bronx crew over to the Rastelli faction. Seems he also had an existing friendship with Giaccone and Indelicato pre-Galante murder.

- Trinchera has always been assumed to be one of the shooters in the Galante hit, and I believe the "pot-bellied shooter" is often thought to be him. However, Trinchera was an absolute mountain of a man, incredibly tall and heavy. The descriptions of the shooters I've seen don't mention anyone as massive as him, so unless I've missed this sort of description I wonder if he was actually in Joe and Mary's that day.

- Bruno Indelicato's promotion to captain following the murder is strange. He was almost surely one of the lead shooters and this was his reward, but his father was already a captain in the family so why reward his young son with a promotion over another major crew? Guys did hits all the time and weren't rewarded with a promotion. It doesn't make sense with Bruno and they gave the Indelicatos a great deal of power by giving them both crews... we know how that worked out.

- Giaccone had been under Rastelli years earlier and he had Rastelli's protege Massino in his crew, but it's not clear to me what his relationship was like with either Rastelli or Galante by the late 1970s. He was likely promoted to captain by Galante and placed on a panel that (I believe) followed Galante's direction. My guess is that Giaccone was a crucial political figure in all of this who bridged the gap between Rastelli and Galante factions.

- The zips are a pretty straightforward part of this. Bonventre was promoted to captain following this and it gave the zips control over multiple crews in the family.

[Hailbritain]

Other thoughts:

- Giongetti was a Trinchera associate I believe who supplied some of the weapons used. He was never made and ended up in prison. Not much to speculate on.

- Trinchera was a soldier who would have been brought into the conspiracy without his captain Vito DeFilippo's knowledge, as DeFilippo was a Galante loyalist demoted afterward. This Bronx crew had originally been a part of Galante's decina in the 1950s and Trinchera was likely crucial in initially bringing the Bronx crew over to the Rastelli faction. Seems he also had an existing friendship with Giaccone and Indelicato pre-Galante murder.

- Trinchera has always been assumed to be one of the shooters in the Galante hit, and I believe the "pot-bellied shooter" is often thought to be him. However, Trinchera was an absolute mountain of a man, incredibly tall and heavy. The descriptions of the shooters I've seen don't mention anyone as massive as him, so unless I've missed this sort of description I wonder if he was actually in Joe and Mary's that day.

- Bruno Indelicato's promotion to captain following the murder is strange. He was almost surely one of the lead shooters and this was his reward, but his father was already a captain in the family so why reward his young son with a promotion over another major crew? Guys did hits all the time and weren't rewarded with a promotion. It doesn't make sense with Bruno and they gave the Indelicatos a great deal of power by giving them both crews... we know how that worked out.

- Giaccone had been under Rastelli years earlier and he had Rastelli's protege Massino in his crew, but it's not clear to me what his relationship was like with either Rastelli or Galante by the late 1970s. He was likely promoted to captain by Galante and placed on a panel that (I believe) followed Galante's direction. My guess is that Giaccone was a crucial political figure in all of this who bridged the gap between Rastelli and Galante factions.

- The zips are a pretty straightforward part of this. Bonventre was promoted to captain following this and it gave the zips control over multiple crews in the family.

Russell Mauro a lead shooter also

[B.]

Other thoughts:

- Giongetti was a Trinchera associate I believe who supplied some of the weapons used. He was never made and ended up in prison. Not much to speculate on.

- Trinchera was a soldier who would have been brought into the conspiracy without his captain Vito DeFilippo's knowledge, as DeFilippo was a Galante loyalist demoted afterward. This Bronx crew had originally been a part of Galante's decina in the 1950s and Trinchera was likely crucial in initially bringing the Bronx crew over to the Rastelli faction. Seems he also had an existing friendship with Giaccone and Indelicato pre-Galante murder.

- Trinchera has always been assumed to be one of the shooters in the Galante hit, and I believe the "pot-bellied shooter" is often thought to be him. However, Trinchera was an absolute mountain of a man, incredibly tall and heavy. The descriptions of the shooters I've seen don't mention anyone as massive as him, so unless I've missed this sort of description I wonder if he was actually in Joe and Mary's that day.

- Bruno Indelicato's promotion to captain following the murder is strange. He was almost surely one of the lead shooters and this was his reward, but his father was already a captain in the family so why reward his young son with a promotion over another major crew? Guys did hits all the time and weren't rewarded with a promotion. It doesn't make sense with Bruno and they gave the Indelicatos a great deal of power by giving them both crews... we know how that worked out.

- Giaccone had been under Rastelli years earlier and he had Rastelli's protege Massino in his crew, but it's not clear to me what his relationship was like with either Rastelli or Galante by the late 1970s. He was likely promoted to captain by Galante and placed on a panel that (I believe) followed Galante's direction. My guess is that Giaccone was a crucial political figure in all of this who bridged the gap between Rastelli and Galante factions.

- The zips are a pretty straightforward part of this. Bonventre was promoted to captain following this and it gave the zips control over multiple crews in the family.

Russell Mauro a lead shooter also

I've read that, but do you know where the info comes from?

Edit: Also, what crew would he have been with? I am thinking Giaccone but not sure.

[Hailbritain]

Other thoughts:

- Giongetti was a Trinchera associate I believe who supplied some of the weapons used. He was never made and ended up in prison. Not much to speculate on.

- Trinchera was a soldier who would have been brought into the conspiracy without his captain Vito DeFilippo's knowledge, as DeFilippo was a Galante loyalist demoted afterward. This Bronx crew had originally been a part of Galante's decina in the 1950s and Trinchera was likely crucial in initially bringing the Bronx crew over to the Rastelli faction. Seems he also had an existing friendship with Giaccone and Indelicato pre-Galante murder.

- Trinchera has always been assumed to be one of the shooters in the Galante hit, and I believe the "pot-bellied shooter" is often thought to be him. However, Trinchera was an absolute mountain of a man, incredibly tall and heavy. The descriptions of the shooters I've seen don't mention anyone as massive as him, so unless I've missed this sort of description I wonder if he was actually in Joe and Mary's that day.

- Bruno Indelicato's promotion to captain following the murder is strange. He was almost surely one of the lead shooters and this was his reward, but his father was already a captain in the family so why reward his young son with a promotion over another major crew? Guys did hits all the time and weren't rewarded with a promotion. It doesn't make sense with Bruno and they gave the Indelicatos a great deal of power by giving them both crews... we know how that worked out.

- Giaccone had been under Rastelli years earlier and he had Rastelli's protege Massino in his crew, but it's not clear to me what his relationship was like with either Rastelli or Galante by the late 1970s. He was likely promoted to captain by Galante and placed on a panel that (I believe) followed Galante's direction. My guess is that Giaccone was a crucial political figure in all of this who bridged the gap between Rastelli and Galante factions.

- The zips are a pretty straightforward part of this. Bonventre was promoted to captain following this and it gave the zips control over multiple crews in the family.

Russell Mauro a lead shooter also

I've read that, but do you know where the info comes from?

Edit: Also, what crew would he have been with? I am thinking Giaccone but not sure.

Not sure where the info that he was a shooter came from to be honest , as for crews he was with Indelicato, then to Lino, then to Vitale, then he was killed

[HairyKnuckles]

The planning of the murder took place inside of the Ravenite Social Club according to Manhattan District Attorney Robert Morgenthau. LE had stumbled upon the planning (although Galante´s name was never mentioned and the bug which was planted inside was found and ripped out) while trying to listen in on Dellacroce´s loansharking and drug operations. The men seen meeting inside and outside the club at around the time of the murder became subjects in a Grand Jury probing and because all of them refused to answer any questions, they were in March of 1980 indicted on contempt charges. Stefano Cannone was one of them. So B could be right on Cannone´s deep involvement with the planning of the murder. Cannone was also one of the three Bonanno members who were part of a ruling panel immediately set up after the hit. Giaccone and Sonny Red were the other two on that panel. My guess is that all three of them were in on the planning.

I wonder why exactly Dellacroce was involved. Articles from the 1970s claim Dellacroce and Galante were rivals and that both of them were eyeing the position of boss of bosses (nonsense of course). A bunch of articles also claim that Galante had ordered the killings of several Gambino members but I haven´t seen any evidence for that. And as I posted in the Gallo thread, the Gambinos wanted Galante dead already back in 1974. Perhaps Rastelli knew about the Gambinos animosity towards Galante and okayed their participation in the planning.

And one more thing, no boss needs the Commission´s permission to whack an underling. The Commission would not interfere and have a vote about it. But If Galante was the official boss (and he may have been who knows), then the Commission´s involvement would have been a necessity.

Adding - Frank Lino testified that Russell Mauro was the shooter who actually killed Galante. He most ptobably came up under Giaccone or Sonny Red.