More powerful, massino in his heyday or bellomo currently

[SonnyBlackstein]

It cant be argued either way.

That the B's had their boss on the street is literally the only aspect of 'power' the B's can claim over the G's.

Manpower, Rackets, Capos, diversity, sophistication, secrecy etc etc ALL go to the G's.

Its not a debate nor even close.

[Pogo The Clown]

They were of comparable size. Looking deeper into size the number of street crews and actual active members (a better meassure of strength) they are comparable. A lot of the diversification of rackets is also a thing of the past.


In terms of secrecy the Bonannos 1999/2000 had the edge since they hadn't had a made member flip yet while the Genovsese family has had several members (including 2 Capos) flip in recent years. They have just recently been infiltrated by Undercover LE.


Other factors one must consider are demographics, presence on the street, rackets opportunities and earning potential (the economy was a hell of lot better in 1999 than in 2017) and other socio-economic-political factors that would favor 1999 over 2017.


Pogo

[SonnyBlackstein]

Pogo you're holding on too tight to a single offhanded comment made by a Genovese Capo caught on tape years ago.

You're desperately looking for reasons and numerical gymnastics to support this.

Let it go Mav, you're holding on too tight.

[Attaboi 1]

I equate it with this, who was more probable to have you killed, and would I be more afraid of Massino, late 90's, early 2000'so or a current barney. I would have to go with the former man, sorry sonny

[OlBlueEyesClub]

So basically you're asking who was more deadly, ruthless, and likely to have one killed? If I'm understanding right, why do you think Massino was such a bloodthirsty individual, especially in the late 90's and 2000's up into the point the feds knocked on his door to arrest him. We have the murder of the three captains which came prior to his boss reign. Just out of curiousity who did Massino have killed when he was boss? Anyone know, because I don't know too much about that. But I just know later in their reigns, they didn't see the need to kill off damn near everyone. A lot of the murders, during Massinos incarceration were the result of Vinny Gorgeous Basciano and his calling murders himself without consulting Massino. I don't know how debatable that is though, whom was more deadly, how would we know?

[Attaboi 1]

Just off the top of my head you have Gerlando SCia sciascia and Cesar bonventre

[phatmatress777]

We should leave these kind of discussions over at gbb


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Wiseguy]

They were of comparable size. Looking deeper into size the number of street crews and actual active members (a better meassure of strength) they are comparable. A lot of the diversification of rackets is also a thing of the past.


In terms of secrecy the Bonannos 1999/2000 had the edge since they hadn't had a made member flip yet while the Genovsese family has had several members (including 2 Capos) flip in recent years. They have just recently been infiltrated by Undercover LE.


Other factors one must consider are demographics, presence on the street, rackets opportunities and earning potential (the economy was a hell of lot better in 1999 than in 2017) and other socio-economic-political factors that would favor 1999 over 2017.


Pogo

To argue the late 1990s/early 2000s Bonannos and present day Genovese are comparable in size, one has to assume A) we have enough info to judge how many active members there were/are (difficult to do since it's always in a state of flux and most figures are total membership) and B) the Bonannos really did reach as high as 150 members and the vast majority of them were active (again there are conflicting sources on this and one October 2001 article had the Bonannos at 8 working crews.)

True, the Bonannos hadn't had a member flip by that point, though that would soon change. In hindsight, Massino's regime was a house of cards. In recent years the Genovese have had 4 made guys flip - soldiers Anthony Arilotta and George Barone and captains Ray Ruggiero and Felix Tranghese. But these guys were all based in Genovese "outposts" in Springfield and Florida and didn't have much damage or disruption to the organization overall.

Rackets? The Genovese have always had the biggest bookmaking and loansharking operations and those don't seem to have skipped a beat. In that regard, the Bonannos, both then and now, have a smaller market share. Even with reduced labor union and legitimate industry influence (though the least reduced of any of the NY families), the Genovese still have more involvement in that today than the Bonannos ever did. The Bonannos did have their share of the pump and dump stock scams, which have become largely passe, but we have still seen Genovese involvement in scams of their own today including the recent health care fraud bust. Probably the only area the Bonannos had a bigger piece of the pie was narcotics. But in recent times we've seen the Genovese become more involved than they were in the past.

The present day Genovese family still covers more territory too. The Bonannos then, as now, had their base in New York as well as activity in New Jersey and Florida. The Genovese have their New York base, the northern suburbs, parts of Connecticut and Massachusetts, the biggest amount in Jersey by far, and activity in Florida.

I equate it with this, who was more probable to have you killed, and would I be more afraid of Massino, late 90's, early 2000'so or a current barney. I would have to go with the former man, sorry sonny

By that logic, Roy DeMeo was more powerful than either of them.

We should leave these kind of discussions over at gbb


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's was actually my first thought when I read the title of the thread.

[phatmatress777]

I like your Roy demeo comparison..: that should put everything into perspective ... it's very unfair to compare a family of one time frame to a dif family of a dif time frame... we should be asking present day Bonanos vs present day Genovese or 1991 Bonanos vs 1991 Genovese it's totally unfair as we know as the years psss by the Italians loose power...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Fughedaboutit]

I equate it with this, who was more probable to have you killed, and would I be more afraid of Massino, late 90's, early 2000'so or a current barney. I would have to go with the former man, sorry sonny

But why are you trying to skew it so much that you have to go back decades vs current? Weird question I guess, to me.

Like me saying...who is more deadly...Massino now in Idaho with a whopper in his hand...or Barney in the 80s when he was personally doing hits. lol

[Attaboi 1]

Dude, you straight over examined the shit outta this

[Attaboi 1]

Murder is the bottom line, it's what keeps everyone in line, if I ain't scared of you killing me, i'mean not to fucking worried about you, that's just me though I guess. I mean nowadays what's gonna happen, gotta do some serious shit to get clipped

[Attaboi 1]

Murder is the bottom line, it's what keeps everyone in line, if I ain't scared of you killing me, i'mean not to fucking worried about you, that's just me though I guess. I mean nowadays what's gonna happen, gotta do some serious shit to get clipped

Think I'll take my discussion to bb, at least it ain't a bunch of old assholes, fucking fag fest over here

[Fughedaboutit]

Murder is the bottom line, it's what keeps everyone in line, if I ain't scared of you killing me, i'mean not to fucking worried about you, that's just me though I guess. I mean nowadays what's gonna happen, gotta do some serious shit to get clipped

Think I'll take my discussion to bb, at least it ain't a bunch of old assholes, fucking fag fest over here

[OlBlueEyesClub]

Murder is the bottom line, it's what keeps everyone in line, if I ain't scared of you killing me, i'mean not to fucking worried about you, that's just me though I guess. I mean nowadays what's gonna happen, gotta do some serious shit to get clipped

Think I'll take my discussion to bb, at least it ain't a bunch of old assholes, fucking fag fest over here

Good luck, because you're not actually going to get a knowledgable discussion going over there. And nobody gives a shit about these nonsense pissing contests, like whom were more ruthless and shit. Because as said, Roy DeMeo would have them all beat, and he wasnt even a capo. But then again, you might intrigue the idiots, guys like Moe and shit. See ya, its not like we need you hear anyway with a lack of contributions.