General Chicago Outfit Info Dumping Ground

[Snakes]

Either there really isn't much going on with the Outfit or they are pretty low key these days.

I don’t think this has any bearing on this one way or the other to be honest.

I got the sense from that article that the FBI in 2016 started a sprawling investigation they hoped would become Family Secrets 2.

The FBI had been authorized to wiretap phones as far back as 2016 as it attempted to build racketeering cases involving the Outfit’s notorious Elmwood Park and Grand Avenue street crews, a federal judge revealed in an opinion last year in a related case against one reputed bookie.

And for all that, the only case they've brought is a very bad case that was just dismissed.

LOL. I guess you have not been following the huge sports betting busts from 2018 and 2019 (Paloan, Poeta, Frontier and Delgiudice. 4 of the biggest operations ended up being all connected. Prostitution case was discovered bc of the investigation into Gary Gags. If it wasn’t, it wouldn’t have been a federal case. Then you have the Cassano case which involved a lot of different type of crimes. All those indictments stemmed from that initial investigation. If anything it says there’s a lot going on.

Yeah, the Nesbitt case was allegedly tied to Gagliano but I assume they didn't have enough evidence to include him, although who knows what they have in the hopper.

[funkster]

If anything we’re seeing Gary Gags might be a bigger player than we might have realized, though Mags hinted at it on his short lived Fosco cast. The Feds build on things, can see more coming from it.z

[Patrickgold]

If anything we’re seeing Gary Gags might be a bigger player than we might have realized, though Mags hinted at it on his short lived Fosco cast. The Feds build on things, can see more coming from it.z

Think Gags semi retired to Naples Florida for a reason. He knew the heat was on.

[Ivan]

I don’t put a ton of stock in the FS 2 thing, feels just like the usual outfit post family secrets throw in line. I think Chicago crime reporters are going to be using it for another 20 years.

Beat me to it.

It's a media cliche and I've never seen anything concrete to back it up. Have any feds actually come out and said "we're working on Family Secrets 2"?

I think the media had such a field day and got so much attention and mileage out of Family Secrets (so much mayhem to talk about! so much drama! so many books to write!) that they got psychologically addicted to it and hope for a Family Secrets 2 the way a smackhead chases highs. Family Secrets 1 itself had a nostaligic element like this too in that everything in it was 15+ years old and it let crime reporters write about the mob the way they could back in the good old days of Trunk Music.

There will always be Outfit investigations as long as the Outfit still exists, and any decent-sized one could be termed a "Family Secrets 2", so yeah you're right they'll be doing this forever.

[Ivan]

Now I’m very curious because I’d imagine it’d have to be a tough guy to give Cassano a beating, he’s not a spring chicken but he’s a big dude.

Yeah you'd think it would be like that thing where Fat Pete Chiodo's blubber saved his life by absorbing all the bullets pumped into him.

[Snakes]

I don’t put a ton of stock in the FS 2 thing, feels just like the usual outfit post family secrets throw in line. I think Chicago crime reporters are going to be using it for another 20 years.

Beat me to it.

It's a media cliche and I've never seen anything concrete to back it up. Have any feds actually come out and said "we're working on Family Secrets 2"?

I think the media had such a field day and got so much attention and mileage out of Family Secrets (so much mayhem to talk about! so much drama! so many books to write!) that they got psychologically addicted to it and hope for a Family Secrets 2 the way a smackhead chases highs. Family Secrets 1 itself had a nostaligic element like this too in that everything in it was 15+ years old and it let crime reporters write about the mob the way they could back in the good old days of Trunk Music.

There will always be Outfit investigations as long as the Outfit still exists, and any decent-sized one could be termed a "Family Secrets 2", so yeah you're right they'll be doing this forever.

All of the big names they could have rolled up into it are dead (excepting Andriacchi, but he was never a well-known figure to the public) so anything labeled as such in the future would almost certainly be a disappointment -- at least to the media.

[Ivan]

All of the big names they could have rolled up into it are dead (excepting Andriacchi, but he was never a well-known figure to the public) so anything labeled as such in the future would almost certainly be a disappointment -- at least to the media.

How well known to the public is Solly D in Chicago? I remember him doing that goofy interview, and there was the whole "you are trunk music, my friend" brouhaha, so he might be somewhat known the general public, then again those things were a long time ago.

Cataudella (I've given up on trying to remember how to spell that right) is an impressively low-key guy. Very high rank and has been an important player for quite a while, but there's only a couple photos of him in circulation and the media seems totally uninterested in him as a "personality" to cover.

[funkster]

I would say there is no outfit guy after difronzo died that would be known to the general public here in Chicago, and JD might even be pushing it. These guys just aren’t well known any more.

[PolackTony]

Brawling at Volare lol great food there

Gotta be a bad look there, brawling at a classy joint like Volare lol. Benny Siddu has had some important friends, such as Marco D’Amico and Eddie Greco.

[PolackTony]

Either there really isn't much going on with the Outfit or they are pretty low key these days.

I don’t think this has any bearing on this one way or the other to be honest.

I got the sense from that article that the FBI in 2016 started a sprawling investigation they hoped would become Family Secrets 2.

The FBI had been authorized to wiretap phones as far back as 2016 as it attempted to build racketeering cases involving the Outfit’s notorious Elmwood Park and Grand Avenue street crews, a federal judge revealed in an opinion last year in a related case against one reputed bookie.

And for all that, the only case they've brought is a very bad case that was just dismissed.

LOL. I guess you have not been following the huge sports betting busts from 2018 and 2019 (Paloan, Poeta, Frontier and Delgiudice. 4 of the biggest operations ended up being all connected. Prostitution case was discovered bc of the investigation into Gary Gags. If it wasn’t, it wouldn’t have been a federal case. Then you have the Cassano case which involved a lot of different type of crimes. All those indictments stemmed from that initial investigation. If anything it says there’s a lot going on.

Yeah, the Nesbitt case was allegedly tied to Gagliano but I assume they didn't have enough evidence to include him, although who knows what they have in the hopper.

As always, the Feds are going to know a lot more than what they are able, or willing to risk trying, to prove in court.

If we go back to the 03/2023 memorandum in the Mike Frontier case, the Feds had a CI who had worked for Nesbitt’s prostitution operation in the past, said that Nesbitt was paying street tax to Gagliano, and that Gagliano was her “Chicago Outfit connection”. The FBI also said they “corroborated” the CIs claims by intercepting email and phone communications between Nesbitt and Gagliano. Even Frontier’s council didn’t deny that the two were personally connected, but argued that it was just a lawful personal relationship (landlord-tenant and possibly romantic). The CI in question, however, stopped informing after disclosing this intel and stopped responding to the FBI when they tried to contact them. Counsel also attacked the inclusion of this informant’s claims in the FBI’s affidavit on the grounds that the Feds had failed to provide background information on the individual. Without someone agreeing to testify and being able to substantiate specific criminal activity, of course, the Feds can be aware of a lot and it won’t necessarily matter. They were intercepting their phones and email accounts, but these guys are careful about how they talk and it’s not like Gags was texting “Hey Jessica didja get dat EXTORTION STREET TAX money that you owe me and DA BOYS in DA OUTFIT fer ‘protectin’ yer illegal prostitution ring??”.

[Tonyd621]

Now I’m very curious because I’d imagine it’d have to be a tough guy to give Cassano a beating, he’s not a spring chicken but he’s a big dude.

Yeah you'd think it would be like that thing where Fat Pete Chiodo's blubber saved his life by absorbing all the bullets pumped into him.

lmao

[funkster]

Either there really isn't much going on with the Outfit or they are pretty low key these days.

I don’t think this has any bearing on this one way or the other to be honest.

I got the sense from that article that the FBI in 2016 started a sprawling investigation they hoped would become Family Secrets 2.

The FBI had been authorized to wiretap phones as far back as 2016 as it attempted to build racketeering cases involving the Outfit’s notorious Elmwood Park and Grand Avenue street crews, a federal judge revealed in an opinion last year in a related case against one reputed bookie.

And for all that, the only case they've brought is a very bad case that was just dismissed.

LOL. I guess you have not been following the huge sports betting busts from 2018 and 2019 (Paloan, Poeta, Frontier and Delgiudice. 4 of the biggest operations ended up being all connected. Prostitution case was discovered bc of the investigation into Gary Gags. If it wasn’t, it wouldn’t have been a federal case. Then you have the Cassano case which involved a lot of different type of crimes. All those indictments stemmed from that initial investigation. If anything it says there’s a lot going on.

Yeah, the Nesbitt case was allegedly tied to Gagliano but I assume they didn't have enough evidence to include him, although who knows what they have in the hopper.

As always, the Feds are going to know a lot more than what they are able, or willing to risk trying, to prove in court.

If we go back to the 03/2023 memorandum in the Mike Frontier case, the Feds had a CI who had worked for Nesbitt’s prostitution operation in the past, said that Nesbitt was paying street tax to Gagliano, and that Gagliano was her “Chicago Outfit connection”. The FBI also said they “corroborated” the CIs claims by intercepting email and phone communications between Nesbitt and Gagliano. Even Frontier’s council didn’t deny that the two were personally connected, but argued that it was just a lawful personal relationship (landlord-tenant and possibly romantic). The CI in question, however, stopped informing after disclosing this intel and stopped responding to the FBI when they tried to contact them. Counsel also attacked the inclusion of this informant’s claims in the FBI’s affidavit on the grounds that the Feds had failed to provide background information on the individual. Without someone agreeing to testify and being able to substantiate specific criminal activity, of course, the Feds can be aware of a lot and it won’t necessarily matter. They were intercepting their phones and email accounts, but these guys are careful about how they talk and it’s not like Gags was texting “Hey Jessica didja get dat EXTORTION STREET TAX money that you owe me and DA BOYS in DA OUTFIT fer ‘protectin’ yer illegal prostitution ring??”.

She was totally his goomara

[Coloboy]

Remember like 10-12 years ago when posters on these types of forums were saying that the outfit was dead and that Difronzo “shut it down”? .

There’s always so much more going on than we realise. The way I read this investigation is they were obviously going for something larger, but couldn’t quite hook any of the big fish. Seems to me that the guys higher up are very good at insulating and protecting themselves.

Scott was reporting five or six years back about how the FBI had a hard on for Vena. I wonder if this investigation was tied to that at all since it mentions Grand Avenue. Never got him either.

[Patrickgold]

Remember like 10-12 years ago when posters on these types of forums were saying that the outfit was dead and that Difronzo “shut it down”? .

There’s always so much more going on than we realise. The way I read this investigation is they were obviously going for something larger, but couldn’t quite hook any of the big fish. Seems to me that the guys higher up are very good at insulating and protecting themselves.

Scott was reporting five or six years back about how the FBI had a hard on for Vena. I wonder if this investigation was tied to that at all since it mentions Grand Avenue. Never got him either.

The investigation really did come up with a lot if you add the numbers up. Classic LCN rackets. Four huge bookmaking operations that turned out to be connected , Nesbitt case, and then the Cassano case which includes extortion and loansharking among other things. They wanted some bigger names to say they indicted a boss or high ranking member but didn’t happen. Top leadership has seemed to insulate itself very well these days.

[Wiseguy]

Remember like 10-12 years ago when posters on these types of forums were saying that the outfit was dead and that Difronzo “shut it down”? .

There’s always so much more going on than we realise. The way I read this investigation is they were obviously going for something larger, but couldn’t quite hook any of the big fish. Seems to me that the guys higher up are very good at insulating and protecting themselves.

Scott was reporting five or six years back about how the FBI had a hard on for Vena. I wonder if this investigation was tied to that at all since it mentions Grand Avenue. Never got him either.

10-12 years ago? I'm still saying that (i.e. the Outfit is close to dead, though not the DiFronzo shutting anything down part). There are at most 16 confirmed made guys left, most of them inactive. And that's probably being generous considering a few of those (the ones only ID as made by the CPD) may not actually be. When looked at in hindsight the recent cases over the last 5 years basically seem to be interconnected gambling ones targeting the two crews/factions of what's left of the Outfit - Elmwood Park/Grand Avenue in the north and Cicero/26th Street in the south. There are few "big fish" left to hook. Andriacchi is close to dead. Marcello is doing life. Sarno will be lucky if he leaves prison alive. There's no real identifiable hierarchy to speak of other than law enforcement identifying what appears to be the most senior guy in each faction - Vena and DeLaurentis.

Forget about "Family Secrets 2." We won't see a case like that (which was a classic mopping up operation) again. And the last case of any significance was the Sarno case 15 years ago. When you look at the general trends over time, we're essentially seeing the exact same thing we've seen in other cities where the mob has died out. Dwindling membership of mostly old and inactive made guys, a breakdown in a formal LCN structure, increasingly descentralized criminal activity (usually bookmaking) being carried out more by descendants or former associates of deceased Outfit figures, otherwise legitimate relatives of past mob figures still employed in some union positions, etc.