How long was Merlino a made man before he took over the family via Natale?

[Cheech]

Merlino was inducted by Stanfa in September 1992. Then the war broke out in 1993 and Merlino went to prison for violating his parole. By the time he got out in November 1994, the Stanfa faction was all in prison and he and Natale had the backing of the Genovese and Gambino families to take over Philadelphia.

After getting out of prison, while still a soldier, Merlino inducted Natale by the end of 1994. Then, Natale was immediately made the official boss and Merlino the official underboss. He then becomes acting boss in June 1998 when Natale is picked up for his parole violation.

So he becomes the underboss just over two years after being inducted and the acting boss three and a half years after that.

How was Merlino allowed to run a ceremony by just being a soldier?

I thought only Captains & higher ups can do ceremonies.

who was going to stop him?

[chin_gigante]

Merlino was inducted by Stanfa in September 1992. Then the war broke out in 1993 and Merlino went to prison for violating his parole. By the time he got out in November 1994, the Stanfa faction was all in prison and he and Natale had the backing of the Genovese and Gambino families to take over Philadelphia.

After getting out of prison, while still a soldier, Merlino inducted Natale by the end of 1994. Then, Natale was immediately made the official boss and Merlino the official underboss. He then becomes acting boss in June 1998 when Natale is picked up for his parole violation.

So he becomes the underboss just over two years after being inducted and the acting boss three and a half years after that.

How was Merlino allowed to run a ceremony by just being a soldier?

I thought only Captains & higher ups can do ceremonies.

Evidently it didn't matter in this instance. They had approval from the Genovese family to make Natale the boss anyway.

I think there are a few other examples of soldiers conducting ceremonies. I think Damiano Zummo was still technically a soldier when he inducted Vincenzo Morena into the Bonanno family in Canada. If I'm remembering correctly, Zummo was only officially promoted to acting captain sometime after Morena became a member. If it was Ralph DeLeo himself who inducted Vito Guzzo Jr into the Colombo family in prison then I think it's likely DeLeo was back to being just a soldier at the time. There's probably some more examples out there.

[johnny_scootch]

There is no rule that says you have to be a certain rank to conduct a ceremony, as long as you're a member and you have permission from the right people you can do it. It's the same in Sicily.

[BobbyPazzo]

Matty madonna came home , got made, and made capo pretty quick. He was a rare breed. He just was the original dope boy when drug dealing was forbidden for real. He knew the life as good as anyone and was as stand up as they have ever come.

[Shellackhead]

Merlino was inducted by Stanfa in September 1992. Then the war broke out in 1993 and Merlino went to prison for violating his parole. By the time he got out in November 1994, the Stanfa faction was all in prison and he and Natale had the backing of the Genovese and Gambino families to take over Philadelphia.

After getting out of prison, while still a soldier, Merlino inducted Natale by the end of 1994. Then, Natale was immediately made the official boss and Merlino the official underboss. He then becomes acting boss in June 1998 when Natale is picked up for his parole violation.

So he becomes the underboss just over two years after being inducted and the acting boss three and a half years after that.

How was Merlino allowed to run a ceremony by just being a soldier?

I thought only Captains & higher ups can do ceremonies.

Evidently it didn't matter in this instance. They had approval from the Genovese family to make Natale the boss anyway.

I think there are a few other examples of soldiers conducting ceremonies. I think Damiano Zummo was still technically a soldier when he inducted Vincenzo Morena into the Bonanno family in Canada. If I'm remembering correctly, Zummo was only officially promoted to acting captain sometime after Morena became a member. If it was Ralph DeLeo himself who inducted Vito Guzzo Jr into the Colombo family in prison then I think it's likely DeLeo was back to being just a soldier at the time. There's probably some more examples out there.

Thanks for explaining

[B.]

Natale said "New York wasn't recognizing Philadelphia at all" when Stanfa was in charge. He tried to reach out to Gotti through Amuso to see if Gotti had backed Stanfa. Natale felt that nobody in NY had backed Stanfa.

If I remember right, along with saying Gotti sent word not to recognize Stanfa/Philly, DiLeonardo mentioned to me that some guys still had contact with them like the Corozzos. We know in more recent years the Corozzos appear to be close to Philly members based on the Stefanelli tapes and Esposito being related to them.

Natale said too that Turchi was friends with Lenny DiMaria and tried to pay him $10,000 to get backing to become Philadelphia boss so that's another Corozzo connection. Maybe that faction was going against Gotti's ruling to try and build support in Philly.

There is no rule that says you have to be a certain rank to conduct a ceremony, as long as you're a member and you have permission from the right people you can do it. It's the same in Sicily.

DiLeonardo and interestingly Bobby Luisi have both said you need two captains to hold an induction.

Carmine Taglialatela said he was made into the Luccheses by Paul Vario who was apparently acting captain at the time and didn't mention any other captains in attendance.

I'm sure it's like the "informal" ceremonies we've heard a lot about, where they blur the rules and people just aren't supposed to mention it.

[chin_gigante]

How many made guys were on the street when Stanfa got arrested?

As of March 1994 there were about 35 members total on the street (including active guys, inactive guys, and the North Jersey guys). Only about 20 or so of them would've been particularly active. About 30 members were in prison at the time. Then all the Stanfa guys got pinched (though a couple like Frank Martines and Vincent Pagano were already in prison).

There would've been about probably 15 active members on the street by the end of 1994 (including guys who had recently been made like Natale, Mazzone, Borgesi, Lancellotti, Angelina, Frank Gambino)

[Cheech]

Not sure we can use anything Natale said @B

They were making fun of him pretty good on the last show they said he took the picture for the last supper

[B.]

It was from Natale's testimony in court which is at least a bit more reliable than what he's said elsewhere. What he said about Stanfa not being recognized does seem to have truth to it based on what others have said.

--

Re: Corozzo maintaining a relationship with the Merlino regime and supporting them, I forgot about this part too from the Stefanelli tapes:



Stefanelli says "my Nicky" (Corozzo) put a stop to the issues about the Merlino/Ligambi regime being recognized and having people poached by the Scarfos.

[PolackTony]

I'm sure it's like the "informal" ceremonies we've heard a lot about, where they blur the rules and people just aren't supposed to mention it.

Yeah, reading this thread I was thinking the same. What’s critical, as with the use of the abbreviated ceremonies, at the end of the day, is whether the induction is accepted and recognized by the system, even if guys are loose with some of the rules.

[B.]

What I wonder is how long Scarfo was trying to regain support in Philadelphia. We first hear of this in the 2000s after Scarfo Jr. is well-established as a Lucchese member but by this time his father has been in prison for close to 20 years.

Was any of this going on in the 1990s or did they wait until Scarfo Jr. was made? Some of the Scarfo era guys in prison still supported Scarfo like Joe Grande which continued into the 2000s but we also know Joe Pungitore had sided with the Merlino-Ligambi guys by that time. Where did they sit when Stanfa and Natale were in charge?

Seems there was too much chaos and Scarfo Jr. was politically too weak in the 1990s for them to have made a move like they did in the 2000s but some of this must have been brewing.

[Cheech]

@B good points.

[chin_gigante]

Was any of this going on in the 1990s or did they wait until Scarfo Jr. was made?

After Natale became the boss, rumours started that Scarfo Sr was using his relationship with Amuso to put hits on Natale, Merlino, and Ron Previte. Previte recorded Natale talking about this at the time. During that conversation, Natale told Previte that Barney Bellomo had sent word to Scarfo that Natale was the only recognised boss in Philadelphia. I believe Bellomo was also incarcerated at that time. Natale at one point wanted to induct Scarfo Jr and make him a captain in Atlantic City to resolve the issue but the Scarfos turned it down.

[B.]

Excellent info.

[johnny_scootch]

There is no rule that says you have to be a certain rank to conduct a ceremony, as long as you're a member and you have permission from the right people you can do it. It's the same in Sicily.

DiLeonardo and interestingly Bobby Luisi have both said you need two captains to hold an induction.

Carmine Taglialatela said he was made into the Luccheses by Paul Vario who was apparently acting captain at the time and didn't mention any other captains in attendance.

I'm sure it's like the "informal" ceremonies we've heard a lot about, where they blur the rules and people just aren't supposed to mention it.

It’s hard to deny anything Mikey Scars says but we can probably name more instances of that ‘rule’ if it is a rule being broken than we can of people actually stating it’s a rule. Coincidentally in Pennisi’s latest Q&A video someone asked him that very question and he basically says what I said that normally it’s administration members conducting the ceremonies but a Captain or even a member can also oversee a ceremony as long as they have permission.

https://youtu.be/6HekwdeSyHA?si=QwAM5q11qY5RktVt